AIBU to think women voting Reform are voting against themselves?

[Peaceandquietandacuppa]

AIBU to think that any woman voting for Reform is like a Turkey voting for Christmas?

the latest debacle - Rob Kenyon refusing to simply apologise for commenting on a disgusting post about Carol Vorderman’s areshole where he said “we’re all thinking the same thing”.

He was given the chance and chose instead to say “ I didn’t write the post” and “it was a long time ago”

Reform support him and say women are clutching their pearls at “mild tweets”. We all know from the many many threads on MN. That women face abuse every day and are most at danger from men they know. These men walk among us every day without us knowing. And if they feel so empowered to publically like a tweet saying they would love to lick a woman’s a*sehole or that women have abortions so they can “shag around” we all know that’s the tip of the iceberg in terms of their true thoughts. What about the Reform candidate who was convicted of kicking his partner while she lay on the ground outside a nightclub and Reform simply said “he’s done his time”

I attach a copy of what our dear friend Nigel wrote after the Sarah Everard case. Where was the energy he is giving for Henry Nowak? Oh wait because the perpetrator was a white man there was no opportunity to create tensions that suit his agenda.

IABU - women who vote Reform need to wake up, and fast

IANBU - I agree with Rob Kenyon and all the other things they have said against women (I’d love to hear why if you don’t mind)

And how many have you met?

I find it troubling that you don’t give people credit for being able to see that. And if they don’t, well they still get a vote. And that only people who vote a certain way are informed and have access to the ‘correct’ information. W

There are people who are having issues with HMOs in their area - actual lived experience. There are people who may have direct experience on something awful. There are people who are racist. There are a million and one reasons.

I wouldnt vote Reform because they terrify me. But I would fight for someone’s right to vote for any political party they want. But nobody has the right to tell others who they should vote for. If you don’t want people to vote for Reform, you have to abolish the party, and that’s unlikely.

When Brexit kicked off, I noticed than on MN, the people who were going to vote leave were told they were thick and evil. The remain lobby (in mainstream media and on here) could have explained their own point of view. But they didn’t. I wasn’t sure which way to vote until I got into the voting booth. If you counter someone’s opinion by just telling them to shut up, you can’t expect them to change their mind

You've been told immigration is a problem by the people who caused immigration to massively increase and caused the small boats crisis and you think those same people are going to prevent the problem that they caused compared to labour who have actually made a difference in reducing immigration and small boats crossings. Interesting.
Im not a Labour voter BTW- I've voted tory most of my life but even i can see how much of a fuck up they've created. Im not going to give them the chance to do it again. A pig wearing lipstick is still a pig.

I know Reform voters who are extremely intelligent, good people and can explain why they vote that way. They don’t fall for the shite that GB News spouts. But people would rather disbelieve that than examine their own attitudes to those who are or think differently (which is rather ironic)

I live in largely Leave/Farage loving town, so enough. If you include those online spouting complete shit, probably thousands. They all have the same talking points that aren’t true. The spelling is atrocious also. Some I know some of these are bot accounts but there’s plenty of real people.

It’s funny how only those who vote Reform are ‘uninformed’. Anyone who disagrees with the MN. left leaning way of thinking is dismissed as being evil or thick. And most of you will prove that point by doubling down on that.

It really isn’t a good look and in fact makes people even less likely to change their views

I mean, all those ‘informed’’ Voters who voted labour in the last election§ have don’t seem to have made much of a positive difference. (Waits for the argument about inheriting a shitshow which labour knew about and yet they still claimed to be able to sort everything out in record time)

And you actually lower yourself to talk to such people. How do you cope!

It is an insult.

Your claim is that people with fewer formal qualifications are more susceptible to misinformation and manipulation.

There are many forms of intelligence. If academic attainment is the measure of political judgement, should we therefore celebrate the politicians and advisers with the highest qualifications who were responsible for delivering the following:

The Iraq War.

PFI contracts that left taxpayers with huge long-term costs

Financial deregulation

The housing crisis

Students loans

A benefits system that too often fails both taxpayers and those genuinely in need of support.

Energy policies that have given us the highest costs in Europe

Criminal justice policies that some believe have resulted in unduly lenient sentences for serious offenders especially in crimes against women

Gender policies/ messaging that many women feel were introduced with little regards for the hard won rights of women or their protection.

The sale of this country's "family silver" (and it's actual gold).

And every other tax on aspiration!

And what does that say about the highly educated people who repeatedly voted for these governments and policies while expecting different results?

Labour has talking points that get repeated. Spelling, so what

You don’t really have to talk to these people at great length. It would be pointless to try really. Most of them don’t want to know. They seem quite happy in their ignorance and absolutely hate being proven wrong because they think being wrong says something fundamental about them as a person. They will double down. I’ve tried to have discussions in the past. It’s futile. I only discuss politics on here now.

And educational attainment doesn’t act as a measure of any kind of intelligence. Being degree educated is irrelevant. Unless you are going to suggest that only those of graduate level and above should vote?

It could be argued that those who think that only a degree shows intelligence aren’t capable of understanding the nuances of different types of intelligence, as well as the reasons why not everyone goes to university.

When a significant number of a certain group are illiterate, they usually points to something gone wrong with their education. Yes, some people have other reasons, but there are too many for it to purely down to dyslexia or something.

But voters for other parties are no different. You have made up your mind already and won’t change it. It would be pointless to try really.

This is pretty offensive tbf.

Being degree educated isn’t irrelevant at all. It teaches critical thinking skills and how to decipher information, how to judge its accuracy.

It isn’t everything. You don’t need a degree, plenty of people who don’t have them don’t fall for shite, but it helps. It would be great if those skills were taught at high school.

I am fairly sure the poster was being sarcastic.

But thank you for illustrating my point perfectly about the nasty superiority that is often displayed on this site.

As for spelling etc, I’m a pedant but doesn’t it occur to you that those people who can’t spell were perhaps let down by the education system? That they may come from a poorer background which didn’t prioritise formal education?

That doesn’t make them stupid. Some of the most dim and bigoted people I have ever known have a high level of education.

It doesn’t really. You are no more immune to the party you support and their lines than someone without a degree.

What about my point to you?

I’m sorry that you’re offended. What would your conclusion be if a high number of people who voted a certain way couldn’t spell? Low socioeconomic background and poor schooling? Probably. Some will be learning disabilities, but not in those numbers.

Some of the students I've heard in the last few years seem to have a lack of critical thinking skills.

Plenty of people who do have a degree 'fall for shite' as you so eloquently put it.

I will read it again and come back to you. I’m just about to go away now. I’ll be back later to answer properly.

Obviously exceptions exist, it’s about averages.

It’s irrelevant and not worth commenting on.

Except it isn’t. Poor literacy in those numbers is indicative of poor schooling.

Everyone gets a vote. Ik you feel better placed to make critical judgements. I’d say you’re wrong on that. You’re no more immune to what the politicians you do back are saying.

Are you a Labour voter still?