AIBU to tell my son he made his sister feel unsafe and uncomfortable?

[Resini]

Hi all, last night for our anniversary DS and DD along with DS’s girlfriend took us out for dinner and to see a show. Afterwards DS and his girlfriend suggested we go for some more drinks, they are both members of a private members club and could take guests so suggested we go there.
DH and I don’t go out late very often and don’t enjoy drinking very much so we didn’t stay too long but DD did.
DD is only 21, she is quite young for her age, has only lived at home, where as DS is 28 and his girlfriend 25. Obviously DD can handle herself and doesn’t need her big brother looking after her but it wasn’t her normal environment either.
Today DD has told us, that both DS and his girlfriend got very drunk and both used cocaine. Now of course I’m not naive they are young adults (albeit professionals DS is a solicitor and his girlfriend works in policy research!) and I know these sort of things happen in professional circles in London.
DD ended up going back to DS’s girlfriends flat to stay the night as it got late, she missed the last train (we are out in Surrey) and didn’t want to try get a cab that far. DD told me she felt really uncomfortable as they also invited one of their friends back to stay at there’s and this friend has been flirting with DD all night, she felt he wasn’t listening to her saying she wasn’t interested and didn’t want to be stuck in the same flat. She says she told DS this and he told her she was being silly and that the friend is “docile”.
DD ended up not sleeping at all, she said she felt on edge the whole time and left very early.
She has asked me not to say anything to DS as it will make her look pathetic, but I’m really disappointed in him, both in the getting so drunk he had to “have a tactical vomit” on the side of the street, using cocaine and not taking into account his sisters safety or comfort.

AIBU to think I should send him a message explaining that he made his sister very uncomfortable and owes her an apology?
I don’t want to be overbearing but I also think the behaviour last night was out of order.

I’m mid-thirties and also never been around anyone on cocaine. None of my friends, family or colleagues take drugs, to my knowledge.

I read one uncannily similar a while ago too. The girlf worked in PR.

If he’s so oblivious he wouldn’t even make sure his sister is ok, then he isn’t the kind of son I’d want to have raised. Regardless of your daughter asking not to say anything, I’d be talking to him about how disappointed I was in his behaviour. What if the guy had tried it on, would he have cared?

Don’t be freaking ridiculous. I plenty of times had sex when I was drunk and I definitely consented to it myself, this is Quaker like attitude to alcohol is insane

Separately to this situation. It actually frustrates me endlessly when sex is presented in a way that suggests men are the only ones who actively want to have sex. For all we know his girlfriend had already made it clear she wanted to have sex!
And I don’t think this is the place to get intoxication and consent, as of course intoxication can remove the capacity to consent, but it is far more nuanced than drunk people can never consent to sex.

So what you’re saying is that if your long time partner is up for sex but you know they have had alcohol, you should assume they are incapable of consent and should refuse ? No one is excusing anything. If she was passed out drunk and he had sex while she was unconscious you might have a point. As it is, you become more ridiculous with each post.

Exactly this.

Personally, I normally would say respect your dd wishes but to be honest in this situation I think your son needs to know how unreasonable His behaviour was.

As if you are saying in a relationship there doesn't have to be consent because you are really uncomfortable at seeing the reality here. Consent must be given every single time. She could not consent last night. She was drunk. Consent could not be given. If he chose to ignore that then the reality is that he committed that crime last night.

I mentioned it because a lot of people on the thread were normalising drug use and claiming that it's practically unheard of for an adult to never have been exposed to drug users. I'm not sure what you mean by "ultimate punishment"? I'm not trying to punish anyone! I was simply giving my own viewpoint, as is the whole point of MN.

Why do you assume anyone was forcing? Honestly you’re just looking for issues. Grow up

The poster means that you’ve pointed out something blindingly obvious to anyone with half a brain, but with which they have a problem accepting as the norm.

Then girlfriend, I and half of mumsnet, have also committed a crime as plenty of people have sex while drunk and consent.
Of course consent is needed every time, but it is not impossible to give while drunk.
It is situational, I’m going to stop debating this.

Honestly, it’s hard enough for women who are sexually abused to be believed/not face blame/shame. I have colleagues talking about the risk to men of fake allegations etc etc. without stupid opinions like this, implying sex between a drunk couple is immediately rape

If someone hasn't consented then they are being forced. FFS!

Yes it is hard as society believes every rapist who falsely accuses them.

You saying consent doesn't need to be given when two ppl are in a couple says a lot. No wonder marital rape was legal. Those ideas still exist sadly it seems.

Now maybe watch the tea video to learn about consent.

To be fair I'd say using cocaine to the extent you have to take it on a night out with your much younger sister whose clearly uncomfortable, after an evening with your parents, is pretty druggie behaviour

It's not just occasional use. A lot of people who take cocaine "recreationally" are addicts who need to use cocaine in every social situation even when it's not appropriate. You don't have to be begging and stealing to be an addict

And also that men are invariably stronger than women.

From what DD told me, he didn’t buy the cocaine himself, it’s by the by though his behaviour was unacceptable. I just want to know if I should go against DDs wishes and talk to him about it or not.

What the fuck are you talking about ?

No one is forcing anyone to do anything they don’t want to do. Just because you have consumed alcohol does not make you incapable of consent. Grow up.

I’m so tired of the tedious trope that everyone in professional jobs especially in London does coke. You know who says that? the people who do coke who want to normalise it. It’s exactly the same as alcoholics who try to make out everyone drinks like they do and if you don’t then you are some sort of uptight puritan. I have never done coke and nor have the vast majority of people I know despite working in those circles. The people who do tend to be insufferable morally bankrupt wankers - and I await the arrival of them here to tell me how simply everyone does it darling and I’m a naive dullard. The human misery behind each line of coke should be enough to make people think twice. But like I say I await the coke users and the stories about how they are 100% certain the coke they get is organic and produced by people paid the living wage.

What do you want from this thread? 🤔

Oh for god’s sake give it a rest. Please. Nobody is saying that consent isn’t needed when you’re a couple. Of course it is. But the point here is that just because the person has consumed alcohol doesn’t make them incapable of consent. If a woman who has consumed alcohol makes it obvious that she wants sex, what’s the problem ? It’s situational and down to common sense. We’re not talking about shitfaced and passed out, and your partner taking advantage of you while you’re unconscious. We’re talking about two consenting adults engaging in sex after a few drinks. There’s a world of difference.

To know whether I should go against DDs wish and talk to DS anyway, which is what I asked in the first place, it has been rather derailed though.

No one is saying that. But when someone is drunk that doesn’t mean that they cannot consent. If two people are the same level of drunk, and both want to have sex, then there’s no coercion, there’s no force. It’s consensual.

If a person is passed out and the other drunk person has sex with them, yes rape. If the other person says no, yes it’s rape. If the other person is sober and can see that their drunk partner is so drunk they don’t understand, again, rape.

What you’re describing is not rape. It’s not legally or morally wrong for two drunk people to both want to have sex