To ask how many times you have seen anyone wearing a niqab (full face veil revealing eyes) or burqa (full face veil with mesh cover for eyes)?

[Jane379]

I've seen recent talk on UK Reddit about banning them, and I think we should, for several reasons, but I also think in some ways banning is easy but actually integrating people leading a very conservative Muslim lifestyle is much harder, and should be the main discussion.
European countries that have banned found not many women wore them. What about here? Some estimates say 1%-2% of Muslim women, but we don't really know.

I live in S London in an area with quite a few Muslims and have only seen about 10 niqab wearers in my life. Most in more central areas. I've never seen anyone wearing a burqa.

How typical is this?

Exactly. It's not a free choice.

It's the double standard around it too for me. I've seen women out in full black niqab with just eyes visible, walking along with a man who's usually wearing sportswear.

Where I used to live in the Middle East, niqabis were working in front-facing government roles, serving the public and it was absolutely awful as a foreigner trying to communicate. I was also working as a teacher and several of the mums wore a niqab and honestly I came to know them by their designer handbags and many times felt like i could have been handing the kids over to anyone.

Because of all the problems that exist in the world at the moment, it's what women are wearing that's the issue.
Stop telling women what to wear. This post is wildly racist.

I see a fair few when I go to certain areas of my city.

I may be generalising wildly, but I perceive women who wear niqab or burka may be more likely to be being abused by male relatives. Although I’m sure it’s not universal and many women chose of their own accord, it’s obviously a method which men can use to control.

Given that, I can’t support a ban which could potentially remove even more freedoms from such women.

Burqa very rarely. I think the last time I remember seeing a burqa was in rural Turkey. Niqab very regularly.

I can’t get upset about bits of cloth and how they are worn and to attempt banning expressions of cultural affiliation seems to me very oppressive and something the Taliban could get behind! I remember a photo of two armed police standing over a Muslim woman wearing a head covering on the beach in Marseille at the time when I think it was Sarkozy was trying to crack down on expressions of Islamic identity. Her young children were with her and they all looked terrified.

Is it really the woman's choice though?

Exactly. This is not behaviour I want my children to see being modelled in society. The message is a very negative one for women.

I see them occasionally close to where I work. London. Always seems to be walked by a man. I support a ban. It reminds me of Afghan women and how they don’t have a voice in society at all. You basically cannot participate in society floating around like a black ghost.

Could we not say that clothes like bikinis, push up bras, mini skirts, stilettos etc. are also not choices made in a vacuum, and have been designed to package us up as sexual objects for the male gaze?

Personally, I'm not keen on either extreme of dressing - extreme cover up or extreme exposure.

Almost every third woman I see is wearing it. And almost every second person I see is wearing a headscarf. I see female children , some very young , wearing headscarves.
I live in West London, very Central.
I almost feel like I am living in a Muslim country,

Definitely ban it.

My logical problem with banning them is the same as my logical problem with the death penalty. People say the reason they want to ban niquab/burka is because they disagree with women being forced to wear them. But banning would be forcing women not to wear them which is just as bad but in the other direction. It’s like saying ‘we will kill you in order to teach you that killing people is wrong” or ‘I’m shouting at you so that you understand it’s inappropriate and annoying that you’re shouting’ or “I’m hitting you because you need to learn you’re not supposed to hit people”.

Daily and in much higher numbers that a few years ago

It isnt racist. People are discussing it from different angles. I am talking about how my experience of it impacted communication and security. It isn't about race and I hate conversations being shut down like this. I dont agree with banning it, like many other things I dont agree with but which i would oppose being criminalised.

Daily. I'd support a ban.

Niqab/full face covering multiple times a day

it used to be incredibly rare - maybe only in Knightsbridge by visiting Arabs.

the problem is it’s a very visual
representation of a strand of Islam which is incompatible with western democratic values. And I believe the UK should be less welcoming to and accommodating of those who don’t share our values.

Yes we definitely could.
But the diffence is a veil makes it very hard to have a job and participate in society. Wearing a bikini would too in an office but I genuinely have a choice not to wear one all the time. So it's not in the same league is it?

Loads.

Genuinely amazed people see so many.

I’m a Muslim myself, live in London and honestly, perhaps seen 10-20 women dressed in the niqab in entire life.

I see many each day where I work in central Leeds. Their teenage/adult daughters don't wear them, so the families I see are clearly making their own choices

Walking around London I see women in stilettos and mini skirts less often than I see niqab.

most women are just wearing ordinary clothes

No burkas, but lots of niqabs. Edinburgh. It’s not quite daily, but it’s not at all unusual to see them in the main areas. I kind of assume they are tourists, but how would you know. I hate it when you see a little group walking a few paces behind a casually-dressed man.

One thing I’ve noticed is a disproportionate number of face-mask-wearers are heavily-veiled Muslim women. It crossed my mind that that might be a niqab in another form.

I live in South Yorkshire. I've seen quite a few women wearing niqab but the hijab is far, far more common. Never seen anyone wearing a burqa in the UK.

Well are the women in niqabis intimidating or oppressed? Does it conceal burning Islamicist beliefs likely to issue in terrorist activities, or a cowed obedience?

seems to me people project their own fears and fantasies onto this manner of dressing.

Which is where you come in as the child’s parent. I’ve had lots of conversations with my daughter where I’ve explained that every woman has the right to choose what she wears as long as it’s appropriate for the location and situation. That some people have specific dress codes based on their culture or religion, that I don’t agree with it but do support everyone’s right to be able to make that choice. I’ve explained that some people are forced into it, we’ve spoken about Afghanistan and other extreme ends of various religious beliefs.

I think that rather than banning it there should be support and help for women who feel coerced into wearing it and respect for thechoice of women who wish to wear it.