AIBU to take my Year 7 daughter's smartphone away completely?

[ExasperatedIs]

I’m just sooo fed up of issues with my DD12 and her phone. She’s in Y7 at school and since she started her behaviour has been shocking and she’s always in trouble at school for attitude, being disruptive and late, makeup etc. Her attitude has been off the rails lately.
Anyway, onto her phone. I have had all the restrictions on it - screen time, not allowed to download apps, clean content etc, and she has managed to change this sooo many times. She has been trusted with WhatsApp before but my DB partner had seen disturbing status’s with her posing in a bra (my push up bra!), lip synching to music, crying, various attention seeking posts and she had hidden them from all our family forgetting to hide from her - so we had the discussion again about inappropriate things etc and removed what’s app, months later we let her have it again. Then similar things happened with snap chat and tik tok which she mithered to death to have so thought ok let’s see if she can be trusted and keep her word (promises about not posting pics and videos of herself etc) then again she was posting, attention seeking posts etc) so we talked about why she was too young to have them and using them inappropriately and hadn’t listened so had to wait until she older to have them.
Anyway yesterday I see she has two detentions at school already on a Monday for being late to two lessons. When she came home I said she couldn’t have her phone that evening. When I looked at her phone I could see she had been on it til midnight talking to her ‘boyfriend’ after bragging she had the screentime passcode and could alter her screentime, waiting until I go to bed, and she’s even pretending to be going to sleep when I go to her! She had actually stolen her dad’s phone and got the screentime code from a message I sent it to him. She had also downloaded Tik Tok again and posting videos and pics - posing in mirrors, lied in bed with push up bra on, etc etc. Also saw in her phone videos actually in lessons (phones aren’t allowed on school!) and she had posted pictures actually in school toilets so explains the lateness! So that’s it, I’ve had enough now. No matter what I’ve tried - restrictions, no restrictions, trusting her over and over again, explaining things, she just doesn’t listen and continues to be sneaky, lie and take no notice. Last night she refused to eat because I had taken her phone then said she will tell school I’m starving her! I just feel totally exasperated by it all. Not sure if anyone else in a similar boat and gone smart phone free? How have you managed it? Sorry for the waffle ! I just feel so upset at the level of disrespect and disregard. Nothing seems to sink in with her 😩

Take the phone. Maybe not the advice you’re wanting but in my early teens I sought attention in teenage boys, I was miserable at home. Hated the dynamic I lived in, probably daddy issues if we’re honest lol anyway I’m not saying this is the case but something is going on that she’s behaving like this. I would contact the school give a brief overview and ask for her to attend counselling. Seems extreme but she needs to understand why she’s acting out time and time again. She won’t change it til she deals with why. Good luck teens are hard!

yanbu. She’s not ready for a smartphone and won’t be for a long time. She might not accept the Nokia now but half term or the summer holidays might change her mind.

If you have any old spare phones sell th now. Also you’ll need to check your DD’s room and bags for burner phones because she’ll either buy a cheap one or a friend will give her a spare from their house.

Does she have other internet connected devices like laptops or tablets? They need locking down too.

Why doesn’t her dad have a passcode or Face ID equivalent on his phone? You now know that she read dh and your messages and I hope that there wasn’t anything risqué there.

Yes I agree with you. All my friends are tracking their kids with Life 360 etc. We don't.

Op I would be asking to meet with a senior teacher at her school and ask the school counselling person also be present personally. Taking and sending highly inappropriate photos and videos of herself in underwear is a huge red flag to me. You really do need to be taking this very seriously indeed. She's obviously the type of kid who is going to be (already is) addicted to a smartphone and all the social media platforms. Isn't there therapy now for this type of addiction?

I have a 14 year old and a 12 year old, neither have a smartphone. Basic phones only and I don’t need to track them. They have iPads but I check them frequently and they don’t leave the house unless going on holiday.

You need to check who she has been sending photos to and how old are they. This could be a police matter.

Speak to school safeguarding lead so they’re aware of the issue and can tailor assemblies at school around smartphone use and inform other parents.

Do not give in to the complaining that it is all unfair. Spend more time with her and ensure she’s using her time constructively. She is going off the rails but you can change that.

Absolutely take it away!!! Get her a basic phone (Nokia from Argos etc), so she can call/ text in an emergency.
I’m planning on the Apple Watch SE for DD over the summer as she starts secondary in September, with parental controls. This is because I want to be able to use tracking too. Just another idea if you wanted tracking.
Smart phones are a terrible idea for under 14s.

Our school has banned smart watches as well as phones.

I never even entered into a discussion with our Y7 child. They have a phone for when they travel to and from school and they hand it over when they get in the door. It is a dummy phone essentially. I’ve explained the very serious and dangerous aspects of phone addition and social media years ago to them.

We are by far in the minority amongst parents and we feel like we stand out as a result. Your child only gets one childhood - it’s up to you to not mess it up for them.

A neighbour’s child is glued to her phone. Every time her dad leaves the house a trail of boys go in the house. it makes me shudder. All glued to their phones. She is obsessed with her looks and it’s all down to social media.

Because we never allowed it in the first place, we have zero pushback.

https://healthprofessionalsforsaferscreens.org/about/

YANBU. Mine don’t have smart phones- they are currently 11 and 13. They have occasional use of a smart phone and a dumb phone which they also completely reject! I’ve said they won’t be getting phones until they are 14 at least and even then absolutely no social media until 16. They are basically fine with this.

Current teens will be the last to have this battle with as I firmly believe that in a year or so it will all be banned. The medial evidence and links to poor mental health are huge. In the future we will think of giving smart phones to 11 year olds (or younger) as tantamount to giving them a pack of fags and a bottle of vodka.

My eldest is in year 7, her phone gets taken off her between 7-8pm, occasionally she moans and has a temper tantrum, but it's tough. WhatsApp is a nightmare and I hope this social media ban is passed.
I would start giving consequences to the bad behaviour, no phone for a day or two, goes to a week of the bad behaviour carries on, grounding, not being allowed to go to any social events, etc.
I'd also look into if it's a cry for help, is she lacking attention from you and her dad? It might be that she wants some boundaries in place.

This is a crisis OP - not just for you and your daughter but for kids everywhere.

Smartphones are addictive. They have been designed that way. They have inbuilt functions to grab your attention and hold it, making it incredibly hard to put down and ignore. Social media exacerbates the problem - the endless scroll, the continued little dopamine hits of short form video, all of it works to retrain the reward centres of kids so that they need the phone for stimulation and lose the ability to access joy from other activities.

Kids with smartphones exist in a less joyful world. They are deprived of the genuine satisfaction and enjoyment that comes from engaging in activities like reading, playing, exercising, creative play, art and music because their brains have been trained into reliance on constant, passive stimulation. And on top of that they are exposed to inappropriate content that teaches little girls they have to be sexy, dramatic, attention-grabbing etc.

You absolutely need to take the phone away, and not just for a few months but for a few years. Buy her a dumb phone so she can contact you. Facilitate opportunities for her to spend real life time with her friends, and in doing activities she loves. Be empathetic to her fears that she will be left out but reassure her that friendships exist outside the online world. Tell her her happiness means more to you than anything and that she can’t be happy when she’s addicted to a smartphone.

Smartphones and social media are a huge threat to our kids and you have to protect her from what she can’t resist or manage herself.

Smartphones are extremely addictive. Your daughter needs those wasted hours back. However you have to also make sure that your phone is locked away and/or that you are not scrolling your own social media accounts. Lead by example.

No 12-year-old needs a smartphone. The evidence is clear about the harmful effects of over reliance on smartphones at a young age. I am convinced that in years to come we will look back on this era and shudder at how damaging it has been to children.

In addition to getting rid of the phone, I would look into activities that your DD is interested in, to give her something constructive to do and help her develop a sense of purpose and accomplishment. Dance, art, music, sport, whatever she gravitates towards. That’s the best way to build self esteem and give her the confidence to stop the worrying behaviour. And talk to her a lot, not lecturing or hectoring, but keeping the lines of communication open and letting her know she can always confide in you about anything.

Stopped reading the original post when I saw whatsapp, tik tok and snap chat given to a 12 year old (probably 11 at the time)

These are all from 13 years of age

Keep your child off that rubbish for goodness sake.

As others have said, she will most likely get a phone from a friend, so be watchful. Regading taking away her phone and her refusing to eat- I'd contact the school to keep them in the loop, incase she accuses you of anything. I agree on the basic phone, for calls and texts only. Definitely remove her smartphone

Why has she got a smartphone aged 12- she doesn't need it, if you need to get in contact an ordinary cellphone is quite adequate.
She has a world of things she is not ready for at her fingertips with a cellphone- her behaviour would be better without it, but it won't be great because she has already had access. Good luck.

Highschool is hard, I feel your pain. This is also a hard time for kids of this age trying to fit in, pressure from social media, friends.

I’ve been there! You’re not alone. Some of my daughters friends come up on my TikTok and honestly they all seem the same and do this stuff.

someone above saying you don’t need to track her, isn’t it the sensible thing to do in this day and age, know the where abouts of your kids, especially at this age where they start going out more?

I check my daughter’s phone/ipad a lot.

That phone would be gone yesterday.

If it means she’s excluded by and cut off from the friends she uses it to contact it then that’s no bad thing.

She sounds incredibly immature. Too right you should take it off her.

Don't do that, you are rewarding her bad behaviour.

She can use the basic Nokia or she can have no phone at all.

That's it, no choice.

I agree her next move will be to try to get another phone. Bras are a favourite hiding place.

Turn off the wifi at night.

Take the phone away with the message that when you see that her attitude and behaviour are mature enough, you will reconsider, but make it clear that that is a very long way down the line.
You mention multiple examples of attention seeking behaviour. Read that literally. She wants attention, look at giving her that attention and help her to learn to meet her needs in a safer, more positive way.

This. Nokia 105 from Amazon, currently £21.99.

The mobile phone ban in schools applies to all similar devices, so Smart watches are also prohibited.

I think this is concerning for a 12YO. The smart phone needs to go. I'd approach the school to see if there is any support they can offer as this sounds more extreme than normal teenage troubles so early on in secondary.