With dementia on the increase, AIBU to think that many overestimate the amount of inheritance they may receive?

[EndlessSeaViews]

I can't help but wonder if people (who currently don't have an elderly or unwell parent) realise just how expensive care fees are in this country?

I see so many inheritance threads on here and people getting upset because they have discovered a sibling or other relative is set to benefit more from a potential will or that a parent or in-law has suggested they should add this person in or take that person out and see threads stating 'We are set to inherit this or dc will be rich at 25 with this big inheritance from their gp' etc?

I can't help but wonder with an ever growing ageing society and diseases like dementia being the biggest killer in this country that many people will have a shock when their parent or grandparent ends up in a care home and all of 'their' inheritance is swallowed up.

I'll be honest, up until a few years ago, I too had no idea just how expensive care costs are to the individual or to society in general.

My parents are in their 80's and mum is (now) in advanced Alzheimer's disease having suffered for the last 8 years and even though she also has cancer, heart disease and osteoporosis her poor body must have a strong will and desire to keep on living because despite succumbing to various infections and a couple of falls over the last year, one which saw her fracture her neck (a fracture that most elderly osteoporosis sufferers die from), she keeps on going.

Due to her frailty and double incontinence she requires carers 3 times a day which is currently costing mum £4k per month (almost £40k so far). Thankfully my parents can afford this. Post hospital discharge mum had 6 weeks of 'free' LA funded care and it was dreadful, so we are thankful there are funds for private care and I will forever be grateful for that. This current care though is really not enough so between my elderly father, my sister and I we fill in the rest of the time (carers only here for a maximum of 3 hours per day, usually less) and it is beyond stressful. Eventually and probably sooner rather than later we will have to conclude we just can not keep mum at home any longer and she will most probably have to go into a care home and with her growing complex needs it will more than likely cost £1600+ per week, so at least £70k per year. Dad is 85 this year and although he is in physical good health we are concerned that his cognition is declining too so who knows what the future lies ahead for him and how much care he may need?

DH's uncle had a stroke two years ago and has been in a care home, on end of life care, for the last 18 months, this has so far racked up a bill of £150k.

Personally, I have never relied on an potential future inheritance and I am thankful that my parents have enough funds to be able to pay for the best care their money can buy, I know many are not so lucky. But I could never rely on my parents money coming my way and so dh and I have long ago made our own provisions for the future but reading so many of the inheritance threads here with siblings squabbling over wills whilst their (often not yet too elderly) parents are still in fine fettle makes me wonder how many will be in for a big shock should either of their parents or relatives become one of the many who are diagnosed with dementia every year and need lots of care?

It's not, on the face of it, a terrible thing to do. The obvious answer to "don't want to pay for my parents' care" is "well provide it yourself then" and that's where, for obvious reasons, many people stall.

Of course, it often isn't possible when everyone involved works, has dependent children, not enough space, doesn't live nearby, care needs are too high or too specific and so on. Sometimes it is possible and even if the reasons for doing it are selfish, it's arguably also selfish to use a care home to spare yourself the burden of care if you don't have to.

The issue here appears to be that it wouldn't be what your FIL wants, and that's very important. There's also the question (and I'm not speculating, just raising it as something to consider) about how well cared for he would be.

That's why powers of attorney are a good idea- if you have people around you who you can thoroughly trust of course.

It's still only a low percentage of people who actually need long term care in a home with dementia.

We were under the belief that if, say, mum was to go into a care home right now, her savings (and pension and AA) will cover the cost of the care home fees and dad will be able to live in their home without any issue but as soon as mum's savings run down to £23,250 the final 'bill' will sit there until dad passes away and then the final amount will be taken by the LA upon sale of their house (regardless if mum is alive or not)?

This is the information we have been given by their FA.

@EndlessSeaViews you ha e painted a picture of complex clinical need. Have you applied for continuing NHS care for your parents.

I've just had to navigate this with my DPs. Mum in v early stages of dementia and Dad a very fit and healthy 92. Then dad fell over putting the bins out, now unable to walk and they are both in a care home - really good care but Dad was shocked at how much it is costing and complaining that the GC will inherit nothing. Given the bulk was going to my brother's family (and he is doing nothing to help) I can't say I'm that devastated at the loss of inheritance.

My friend’s parents estate is currently dwindling at a rate of over £200k per year, both of them are in dementia care homes, both otherwise physically healthy but absolutely away with the fairies with no idea who anyone is. Both unhappy.

I feel quite strongly that some cases of dementia should be eligible for assisted suicide (and not because of money, because of the sheer indignity that advanced dementia can bring) having watched my own relative become a shell of their former self, weighing 5 stone and in nappies after years of suffering. They would certainly not have wanted that, and it’s true that we’d be vilified for keeping a pet alive in that state.

Dementia is frequently funded under CHC - so not costs.

Yes, I do agree that we do try to prolong life far too long when people do not have any quality of life. Personally, if I have Alzheimer’s, I would rather go. I just don’t think that we can carry on like this but the current generation of people in their 90s went through war time rationing so maybe the next generations won’t live so long as so many people seem to be overweight these days.
I believe, in Germany, people have started sending their elderly relatives abroad for care to countries like Thailand where there is more of a culture of caring.

Love this ^ 💙

This is not going to happen, though, having the capacity to consent and being at the end stage of life is how assisted dying is going to proceed. Dementia means living a long time, and often in declining or no capacity, so it's very unlikely these cases will meet any criteria. There was a case of someone who agreed to it, in another country, when well but when they had dementia, did not want to die and they had to be held down and injected. I'm not sure that's where we want to head, although I also feel I wouldn't want to live under those circumstances.

Is dementia on the increase, or are people just living longer and therefore more likely to develop it?

Also, I dont know anyone who thinks about how much inheritance they will receive (unless it's relevant because a close relative has just died and the will is being read).

Care home costs all in including accommodation vs care at home + house upkeep, utilities etc.

Once you need a certain level of care, care homes are cheaper, it doesn’t need to be FT care.

Your parents can put their house ownership into a Tenants in Common with their children as owners too.

This means when there is only one parent left alive the house cannot be sold to fund a care home as it also belongs to their children.

Also, it's worth knowing that only around 3% of elderly people go into a care home. And the average time is 2 years.

To give the other side, none of my family have gone into a care home so far.
My uncles and great uncles lived to their late 90s, at home, dying in hospital after a few days.

My parents are not wealthy and could not afford a care home for more than a few months. Very limited savings. After that the state pays but the choice of care homes is limited.

The issue is that many older people are being kept alive by drugs, but are often immobile and have chronic illnesses, when they would otherwise have died 10 or more years earlier.

With recent research showing that several vaccines reduce the impact of dementia, it is possible that we will start to see a reduction of cases as vaccination is pushed out more widely to at risk groups. So this may be less of an issue as the vaccinated generations start to reach the ages where dementia risk increases....

The latter.

CVD was the chief reason for death before, now it's managed with surgery and drugs so dementia has taken top place of causes of death.

My pils will need care.
They are both mid 80s, one has parkinsons and is very frail now.
One has relatives who all lived into their 90s (admittedly in poor health) so I imagine they will go the same way.
Dh and bil will do everything to keep them at home as long as possible - but I won't be involved....they can give up their lives if they want. I did 13 years and it has had a terrible impact on my own physical and mh.
Family usually have no concept of what elderly care involves tbh.
It's not granny sitting quietly in the corner, smiling at everyone benevolently...its sundowning, smearing faeces, incontinence, aggression, 20 hour a&e waits...those family members who say they will take a parent in usually don't last long in their caring roles ime.

yes that is how it works- on credit.

It's too late now probably but your parents could have named you and other siblings as tenants in common meaning no house sale can be forced when your dad is left.

I am going to throw something else in here too. Both parents lived to 89 and 91. One in a care home for 4 years.

We pride ourselves in the UK on throwing everything medical at older people.My Father in the end was in an awful state. Not able to walk,incontinent, unable to wash himself and suffered from numerous infections. Had Covid twice and was hospitalised numerous times. He and (my Mum) were ready to go many years before. They didnt want to end up like this and my Father in particular would be roaring with rage.

For the people who say they dont want to be a burden and will kill themselves rather than be a burden on their children. It doesnt happen. You lose sense of reality and become more and more dependant on your children. If I could also say you become very selfish and self absorbed. You just cannot help yourself.

The whole thing in the UK is a shitshow. It was only at the very end of Mum's life that someone from the GP surgery called me and had a frank discussion about not doing any further medical interventions. No more medicating to hell. Make her comfortable and in no pain. But we are no where near this.

THE CARE HOME INDUSTRY NEEDS A REVIEW. THE NHS OPTIONS ARE HORRIBLE. MUM HAD A FEW AND VERY BADLY RUN THEY WERE TOO. MY FATHER IN THE END PAID NEARLY £450K FOR HIS CARE.

One option if you can find one is a private nurse either live in or part time.

Cheaper than a care home often.

None of us should expect - nor have a right to - an inheritance from our parents. Even without the likely care needs, parents can leave their money wherever they wish.... charities, friends etc. And good for them!

If people are not aware, it’s worth knowing about Immediate Needs Annuity plans which, for a one-off lump sum payment, provide a guaranteed, regular income for life to cover the shortfall between income and care costs.

You can also buy Deferred Needs Annuities - whereby the payments start after an agreed period with lower upfront costs.

Well I will be popping pills so I don’t get to the stage of being in care. I honestly can’t think of anything worse and I do want to be able to leave my children something. Note I lost my husband at 38 I probably have a diff view around death if this alarms anyone.

Really? I do worry about people’s attention spans these days.

It’s a relatively long post, but it’s very clear what the OP’s points and questions are. It’s also on quite a complex topic - not everything can or should be discussed in bulletpoints made up of only one syllable words.

Yes, but nurses don’t work 24/7 365 days of the year. You will have to employ 2/3 nurses unless family want to take a shift. In most cases they don’t. I certainly don’t and neither do my siblings. That is why our mother in her late 90s is in a home.

I agree of course. However I was very very firm with my two parents and some people would class me as bordering on bullying the way I did. I had extremely firm boundaries. I would do everything they wanted. Its much easier as so much is online and an email can take seconds to send.

I insisted on POA but both parents were fine with this. If I had seen any indication that they would fuss around, want to be taken to the bank etc I would have withdrawn my support.

Anything that could be done by others would be brought in and paid for by them.

They didnt have a choice to pick me to do it. I never got into that conversation because they trusted me to get things done quickly (and that was the most important thing to them).

My siblings had a few minor comments but seeing they didnt do a thing due to being abroad I was able to run my way.

I sound like a right bossy cow. But it was the way I survived.

I recognise the guilt tripping of course. I wouldnt stand any nonsense from any utilities either. Got significant compensation for various things they were doing to my Mum in particular which went back into their accounts.