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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

to believe a "stranger" over my son about abuse

229 replies

QuaintAquaTraybake · 18/04/2026 14:44

DS (he is 21) has always been difficult, as has my relationship with him. He was a challenging child and then a challenging teenager. The behavior he displayed in his early to mid teens ranged from mild acting out (silly fights, occasionally skipping classes to smoke with older boys) to stealing, lying and manipulating his family and others. DH and I did what we felt was best for him as parents. The whole lot, therapy, counseling, "consistency consistency consistency". We felt things were improving at one point in his late teens,as he approached the prospect of going to university and doing his own thing, but now I feel we may simply have been blind to it, or he became better at hiding this mean streak, who knows.

He was in a relationship with a young woman, who I'll refer to as A (24) for convenience, for nearly two years. I have grown very fond of A. She reminds me a great deal of myself at her age. Big dreams but like everyone does she has her struggles. Notably, low self worth. I was very much the same. The only difference between her and I is I had a loving family when I was struggling. A has only had my son, and by extension, us.
Two weeks ago A turned up at our house in tears. DH and I took her in and tried to comfort her as best we could, but she begged us not to let DS know. She also wouldn't say what was going on, at least until my husband had gone to bed. Once it was just the two of us she told me everything.

What she has told me, and what I saw for myself, the cigarette burns on her arms and thighs, bruises, marks, it is awful. He would lock her in their dresser for hours, humiliate her in various ways over trivial disagreements... I cried hearing it and seeing it. I have told DS I want nothing to do with him unless he tells us the truth. DS, however, insists things are not as she describes them. To cut a very long story short, he claims their relationship was healthy and what she calls abuse now are "kinky activities" which she willingly agreed to throughout their two years together. For example, he admits he did indeed put cigarettes out on her, "lightly" beat her when they were intimate, engaged in "degrading acts" because "she likes it, we both like it."

So now DS and I are not speaking, and DH and I are completely at odds. DH refuses to entertain the thought our son could/would/has done something so vile. And he has told me outright he is ashamed of me for taking "some stranger's" claims over those of our own flesh and blood. I tell him why I believe her, he says there is no hard evidence. I say well my own eyes are hard evidence, the bruises and marks I saw on that girl are NOT the result of an ordinary couple engaging in consensual sex, those are not signs of mutual sexual pleasure. And that if he truly believes otherwise he should join DS in seeking out some professional help.

We barely speak two words to each other now. Him sleeping on the couch, me hiding in the bedroom. My question is, am I really so wrong? Am I projecting my own trauma onto someone else and refusing to see the truth. I suppose, I wonder, if you were me, what would you do?

OP posts:
moggerhanger · 18/04/2026 20:30

Aren't we into R v Brown territory here? I don't think that A can consent to being burned by cigarettes. en.wikipedia.org/wiki/R_v_Brown

denisdenisdenis · 18/04/2026 22:06

They all have mums.

RoseField1 · 18/04/2026 22:19

Kimura · 18/04/2026 20:12

A person cannot consent to an act that results in actual bodily harm.

Legally, I understand that. And coerced consent is not true consent. But OP is at loggerheads with her husband and doesn't know how to deal with her son. I'm just saying that looking at it from the perspective that her son may believe she did consent might help her and her DH reach some common ground and opportunity to understand each other, and might help her get through to her son why what he did was wrong and harmful. Just banging on about the law won't help either the DH or the DS understand why this is still abuse even if she appeared to consent to him at the time.

anyolddinosaur · 18/04/2026 22:38

Does anyone really believe that abusers think their victim consented? This just sounds like someone determined to find an excuse for abusers.

The son and husband are adults, changing adult behaviour is very difficult and changing thought patterns even worse. The son might be persuaded to change behaviour by fear of legal consequences but that problems just means he's be slightly less physically abusive and more mentally abusive.

Personally I see condoning abuse as worse than being estranged from son and husband.

NotAnotherScarf · 18/04/2026 22:43

No real man burns his partner with cigarettes. Even if she asks for it. You get her help because that is fucking wrong.

Sorry your son is vile and so is your dh

I am a fully grown, hairy arsed man from a working class area. And your son is scum, sorry but he is

AutumnAllTheWay · 18/04/2026 22:57

LaughingCat · 18/04/2026 16:31

Very much so - childbirth nearly killed me, period pains suck, stubbing my toe is excruciating, I can feel the cold as a physical pain, just not heat. No idea why but I’m the person sat in a sauna at max heat for two hours. So for me, burns just aren't that bad. Also why I’m not great in a kitchen as it takes me a second to work out that I’ve picked up a too-hot pan.

Edit: I’m sorry, derailing the thread here.

Edited

Yes, yes you are.

This is completely irrelevant.

mathanxiety · 19/04/2026 01:28

Your son is the abuser that he is because his own father couldn't separate his identity from his son's.

The pair of them belong together.

I'd get in touch with A and try to persuade her to get support from Women's Aid (0808 2000 247).

I'd also try to persuade her to report the assaults. She should go to the police but I'd guess DS has threatened her or has photos of her that she doesnt want sold or broadcast.

I'd be seeling a solicitor about divorce if I were you. Can you see yourself growing old with this man?

Goodadvice1980 · 19/04/2026 06:19

YANBU OP.

Your son is toxic and your husband is at the very least a wet lettuce and at worst an enabler of abuse.

hattie43 · 19/04/2026 06:58

Your son is a disgusting abuser . Take her to the police .

MrsPerfect12 · 19/04/2026 07:58

I don’t think any amount of therapy will fix your son. This is who he is. Your husband thought he was better after the last bout of therapy and he’s in shock. He may come round or he may not but the son’s behaviour is escalating.

thesecondmrsdewinter20 · 19/04/2026 08:37

moggerhanger · 18/04/2026 20:30

Aren't we into R v Brown territory here? I don't think that A can consent to being burned by cigarettes. en.wikipedia.org/wiki/R_v_Brown

Was coming on here to say this. You can’t consent to being burned with cigarettes.

abusers often use ‘kink’ as a smokescreen for abuse. The shame that the victim feels for ‘consenting’ is part of the manipulation and abuse, making it harder for them to walk away / get help / report.

GlovedhandsCecilia · 19/04/2026 08:48

QuaintAquaTraybake · 18/04/2026 14:44

DS (he is 21) has always been difficult, as has my relationship with him. He was a challenging child and then a challenging teenager. The behavior he displayed in his early to mid teens ranged from mild acting out (silly fights, occasionally skipping classes to smoke with older boys) to stealing, lying and manipulating his family and others. DH and I did what we felt was best for him as parents. The whole lot, therapy, counseling, "consistency consistency consistency". We felt things were improving at one point in his late teens,as he approached the prospect of going to university and doing his own thing, but now I feel we may simply have been blind to it, or he became better at hiding this mean streak, who knows.

He was in a relationship with a young woman, who I'll refer to as A (24) for convenience, for nearly two years. I have grown very fond of A. She reminds me a great deal of myself at her age. Big dreams but like everyone does she has her struggles. Notably, low self worth. I was very much the same. The only difference between her and I is I had a loving family when I was struggling. A has only had my son, and by extension, us.
Two weeks ago A turned up at our house in tears. DH and I took her in and tried to comfort her as best we could, but she begged us not to let DS know. She also wouldn't say what was going on, at least until my husband had gone to bed. Once it was just the two of us she told me everything.

What she has told me, and what I saw for myself, the cigarette burns on her arms and thighs, bruises, marks, it is awful. He would lock her in their dresser for hours, humiliate her in various ways over trivial disagreements... I cried hearing it and seeing it. I have told DS I want nothing to do with him unless he tells us the truth. DS, however, insists things are not as she describes them. To cut a very long story short, he claims their relationship was healthy and what she calls abuse now are "kinky activities" which she willingly agreed to throughout their two years together. For example, he admits he did indeed put cigarettes out on her, "lightly" beat her when they were intimate, engaged in "degrading acts" because "she likes it, we both like it."

So now DS and I are not speaking, and DH and I are completely at odds. DH refuses to entertain the thought our son could/would/has done something so vile. And he has told me outright he is ashamed of me for taking "some stranger's" claims over those of our own flesh and blood. I tell him why I believe her, he says there is no hard evidence. I say well my own eyes are hard evidence, the bruises and marks I saw on that girl are NOT the result of an ordinary couple engaging in consensual sex, those are not signs of mutual sexual pleasure. And that if he truly believes otherwise he should join DS in seeking out some professional help.

We barely speak two words to each other now. Him sleeping on the couch, me hiding in the bedroom. My question is, am I really so wrong? Am I projecting my own trauma onto someone else and refusing to see the truth. I suppose, I wonder, if you were me, what would you do?

While I think those marks could be the signs of a consensually kinky sex life, I don't think that someone who isnt a victim would disclose that as abuse to anyone, let alone the perpetrator's mother.

Their interest in each other may well have initially involbed kink and power dynamics, but she isn't happy with anything that this has become so it now abuse.

QuaintAquaTraybake · 19/04/2026 09:43

I woke up this morning to news that DS and A have been talking for a few days.

No mention of this by A, who last messaged me two days ago - confirming she was doing OK, and had been focusing mostly on work. According to DH (who surprisingly stirred from his period of total quiet, it is a miracle!) A visited DS at his apartment yesterday after a day or two of texting back and forth about their apartment and dog, and the two ended up spending the night together. Sigh.

DS says he will try to make things work, "if she will just admit she actually enjoyed some of our sex stuff, then we can move on and leave all of this behind us."

DH insists I should talk to DS and hear him out, from where I sit right now I can't. I am disgusted and not just with what he has done but the fact he still has no remorse. Zero. Zilch. And then there is A who may well be the victim but has her own part to play in all of this, it seems, if she feels the need to go right back to being with him... though they do say it takes, what, seven times on average? What do you all think?

OP posts:
WeCantBoardYouFromACoffeeShop · 19/04/2026 09:50

Thephantom · 18/04/2026 15:55

Aww, not happy that my opinion doesnt align with yours- and this is the best you can do?!

Awww look, a 'my precious boy could never' mother in law!

Tillow4ever · 19/04/2026 09:51

QuaintAquaTraybake · 19/04/2026 09:43

I woke up this morning to news that DS and A have been talking for a few days.

No mention of this by A, who last messaged me two days ago - confirming she was doing OK, and had been focusing mostly on work. According to DH (who surprisingly stirred from his period of total quiet, it is a miracle!) A visited DS at his apartment yesterday after a day or two of texting back and forth about their apartment and dog, and the two ended up spending the night together. Sigh.

DS says he will try to make things work, "if she will just admit she actually enjoyed some of our sex stuff, then we can move on and leave all of this behind us."

DH insists I should talk to DS and hear him out, from where I sit right now I can't. I am disgusted and not just with what he has done but the fact he still has no remorse. Zero. Zilch. And then there is A who may well be the victim but has her own part to play in all of this, it seems, if she feels the need to go right back to being with him... though they do say it takes, what, seven times on average? What do you all think?

I think that at this point I would report to the police. I’m usually very much in the camp of the victim leads the way, but your son might kill her next time so she can’t speak out again. A needs help escaping him for good.

Laura95167 · 19/04/2026 10:01

QuaintAquaTraybake · 19/04/2026 09:43

I woke up this morning to news that DS and A have been talking for a few days.

No mention of this by A, who last messaged me two days ago - confirming she was doing OK, and had been focusing mostly on work. According to DH (who surprisingly stirred from his period of total quiet, it is a miracle!) A visited DS at his apartment yesterday after a day or two of texting back and forth about their apartment and dog, and the two ended up spending the night together. Sigh.

DS says he will try to make things work, "if she will just admit she actually enjoyed some of our sex stuff, then we can move on and leave all of this behind us."

DH insists I should talk to DS and hear him out, from where I sit right now I can't. I am disgusted and not just with what he has done but the fact he still has no remorse. Zero. Zilch. And then there is A who may well be the victim but has her own part to play in all of this, it seems, if she feels the need to go right back to being with him... though they do say it takes, what, seven times on average? What do you all think?

I think people always go with the lure of the familiar. And a woman with no family probably is conflicted with not feeling OK alongside missing her dog, her home and the familiarity of a family.

I think its worrying DS is shameless in his interest in extreme sexual acts. BDSM is a thing, but it comes with risks especially if practised unsafely - even for him. People who practise it safely have safe words and wouldnt push for sex acts someone refused. Consent is only consent if youre able to withdraw it. And legally there are some sex acts you cant consent to so if the police found out even if A said she liked it they could prosecute. You said A said this kicked off because he wanted a sex act she said no to.

I also worry if sexually he enjoys "using someone as an ashtray" whether his tastes would escalate. Hes already talking about getting her to agree she enjoyed sounds like it wont stop. And I genuinely dont understand why your DH is so supportive, because even if it was a consensual sexual interaction I dont know why that level of degradation, humiliation and physical pain arousing him doesnt repulse your husband. And I wonder how much of your husband treating DS like a precious little prince has influenced DSs entitlement and attitude. I dont know if I could continue to be intimate physically or emotionally with a man who thinks this is OK if son is "just kinky" if it was BDSM the terror his partner displayed should have upset him. In a BDSM relationship youre still partners first and playmates second. And i worry DS likes how vulnerable she is.

If A is back with him, Id worry for her. But you cant force her to want help. Tbh I might be concerned enough to make a police report myself but I don't know if it would help. So sorry OP

LeebLeefuhLurve · 19/04/2026 10:03

It does often take a victim multiple times to leave their abuser and at this stage, it might be worth getting some professional advice yourself OP, for support, as you have a violent sadistic son, and a husband who is his enabler. To be honest, I'd be using this time to take a good hard look at your husband and his attitudes towards women.

Unfortunately, the kink defence line is used by many abusers, and threads like this are catnip for posters who seem to really enjoy telling us all about their kinks 🙄

BuckChuckets · 19/04/2026 10:11

DS says he will try to make things work, "if she will just admit she actually enjoyed some of our sex stuff, then we can move on and leave all of this behind us."

@QuaintAquaTraybake this is pretty scary.

He wants her to 'admit' that she enjoyed 'some of' his violence and sexual sadism??? If he was genuinely not an abuser, wouldn't be be upset and desperate to MAKE SURE that EVERYTHING was FULLY CONSENSUAL?

I always worry about whether I'd know if my child was a monster, I feel like you're in that position now.

Sparkletastic · 19/04/2026 10:13

Your DS is at ‘best’ and sadist but could be a psychopath. I think you need to let the GF know that she unequivocally has your support and talk to your DS about ceasing to get his sexual kicks from injuring and humiliating her. Her low self esteem and need to be loved rather than genuine enjoyment is behind her tolerance / going back I suspect.

Laurmolonlabe · 19/04/2026 10:14

Burning someone with cigarettes is not something you get past- you are scarred for life and every time you see them you remember. I'm not saying relationships with S&M in them can't be healthy, but burning someone with cigarettes goes way beyond this- your son needs therapy , if his next girlfriend has higher self esteem and is not so needy he will finish up in jail.

MaybeToxic · 19/04/2026 10:19

QuaintAquaTraybake · 19/04/2026 09:43

I woke up this morning to news that DS and A have been talking for a few days.

No mention of this by A, who last messaged me two days ago - confirming she was doing OK, and had been focusing mostly on work. According to DH (who surprisingly stirred from his period of total quiet, it is a miracle!) A visited DS at his apartment yesterday after a day or two of texting back and forth about their apartment and dog, and the two ended up spending the night together. Sigh.

DS says he will try to make things work, "if she will just admit she actually enjoyed some of our sex stuff, then we can move on and leave all of this behind us."

DH insists I should talk to DS and hear him out, from where I sit right now I can't. I am disgusted and not just with what he has done but the fact he still has no remorse. Zero. Zilch. And then there is A who may well be the victim but has her own part to play in all of this, it seems, if she feels the need to go right back to being with him... though they do say it takes, what, seven times on average? What do you all think?

If A is a victim of DV and your son is controlling the narrative, begging her to come home etc, this scenario fits.

ChateauMargaux · 19/04/2026 10:37

I wonder if it might help to hear him out... but maybe with guidance... I don't know where you would get this guidance, but it might be helpful to know how to enter into a conversation with someone who is intent on convincing you that violence in a sexual relationship is acceptable, when your position is clearly different. I wonder whether taking a look at NVC would be helpful.

https://positivepsychology.com/non-violent-communication/.

Maybe, try to find space to articulate your own feelings, what you need, what would be helpful to you, in this communication. If you explore how you can move forward with your relationship with your husband and your son, but really listening to your own needs first, then you might be in a position to understand what you can and can not control, what you are willing to accept and what you are not willing to accept. Coming to the realisation that you might not be able to change your son's behaviour, might be very difficult.

Your stance might be that violence in relationships is unacceptable. You might also feel that no one who is not being controlled, would consent to this. Your son (and your husband) are trying to convince you otherwise.

I think you need support and counselling. Then, I think that marriage counselling might be required, but you have already been through this. I do not know how you would go about having an ongoing relationship with your son.

Your Complete Non-Violent Communication Guide

Exploring Non-Violent Communication to learn how to express ourselves.

https://positivepsychology.com/non-violent-communication/

Shatteredallthetimelately · 19/04/2026 10:40

Your DS is still trying to pass all of this onto A.

Irrelevant of what your DH says your DS will only tell you what he wants you to hear and no more.

Glowingup · 19/04/2026 10:44

Sounds like a toxic and fucked up relationship and an abusive one. I think all you can do is take a step back until this woman is ready to leave this horrible abusive man. If A speaks to you again, I’d tell her that if she decides she wants to leave, you will be there for her but that the choice is hers.

Changes26 · 19/04/2026 11:17

What an awful situation.

OP, the fact that A came to you demonstrates that she trusts you and feels safe with you. I would keep communication open with her. If she hasn’t moved back permanently with your DS is there any way you could meet with her and the friend she was staying with? Having a supportive conversation around going to the police may be less overwhelming if she has a trusted friend there too. She needs to talk to women’s aid or a local domestic abuse service.

Your son is abusive and dangerous. You had already identified a repeated pattern of negative behaviour towards his girlfriends at school. So much so you had to speak to the girl’s parents. It seems that his behaviour is escalating over time and I wonder what could happen next.

I admire your resistance to deny or downplay his behaviour and consequently not enable it but your DH needs to do the same. As awful as it must be as parents, if your child is abusive to others you have to call them out on it and make them accountable. Imagine if your son has children down the line - how would your DH feel if his grandchildren were living in an abusive household?

So many violent men are enabled by family and friends. As a society (as a human race), if made men really accountable we could get somewhere with stopping male violence against women and girls.

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