AIBU to think face coverings in public should be banned?

[OpheliaWasntMad]

Should all types of face covering in public be banned? I think they should. Mainly I’m concerned that people in balaclavas and face coverings are shoplifting and stealing phones etc with impunity.
People with balaclavas on marches look threatening and sinister.
Women with niqabs create a barrier between themselves and others as it’s hard to form connections if you can’t see someone’s facial expressions.
I think all face covering should be banned. It contributes to a society that feels more unsafe and divided.

I agree it’s not racist but I don’t agree with banning religious symbols as I don’t think they present a security risk in the way face covering does.

Some men seem to be way ahead of you. Including a suspected terrorist. An increase in the wearing of burqas just gives criminals an ideal cover. Why would you want to do that?

As an aside, some of these men may have also been wearing jeans. Who would know?

Several incidents have been reported where men have used a burqa (a full-body garment covering the face and body) as a disguise to commit crimes or evade law enforcement, primarily in the UK and India.

• Armed Robbery in Dundee (2019): Three men—Dean King, Anthony Wheeldon, and Connor Willis—were jailed for a total of over 30 years after wearing burqas to carry out an armed raid on a jewellery store in Dundee, Scotland. They brandished weapons and stole Rolex watches.
• Terror Suspect Escape (2013): Terror suspect Mohammed Ahmed Mohamed escaped surveillance in London by changing into a burqa at a mosque, using the disguise to evade police who were monitoring his movements.
• Jewellery Robbery in Leicester (2019): Imtiaz Patel, a 42-year-old, was jailed for over four years after using a burqa to hide his identity during a knife-point robbery at a Leicester jewellery store.
• Incidents in India (2025): Recent reports indicate multiple instances, such as a man in Deoria, Uttar Pradesh, being arrested for wearing a burqa to meet a woman, and a man in London being caught shoplifting while in a burqa.

Absolutely agree- madness to allow people to hide their identity in this way .

I Have an elderly relative whose purse was stolen out of her bag by someone in a burqa . It was in a busy shopping area and caught on CCTV but of course the person couldn’t be identified

Sorry I should have been more clear, I do t think all religious symbols should be banned but was just trying to make the point that banning it is not racist.

Was it you that made a much better point about the Muslim countries that also ban the burqa? I’d like to see the maths on PPs claim that they are racist for doing so.

Accusing us of racism is just a desperate attempt to shut down a necessary conversation. This topic is part of the necessary conversation. Our society is being pushed in a direction that we didn’t choose. We have countless terror threats and crimes being perpetrated against us, in many cases by people who we have tried to deport for being criminals but have been thwarted by the courts. This is not ok and we should have the right to at least talk about it.

Some would even stop us from doing that if they could. I wish I could understand why.

What?! That is the most ridiculous comment and shows complete lack of understanding of the potential situation.

Who decides what’s valid? Which conditions are valid. How far is that validation? Can I wear one to protect the person I love or care for or only if I have the condition. What if I am being diagnosed but don’t have confirmation yet. Who is providing the validation and what does it look like. How long am I allowed the exemption. Right now, I have no right in the green book to the Covid vaccine eg I’m not considered CEV enough for it - that doesn’t mean I’m not CEV (especially as it’s done on cost-benefit not health- even the current letter from the JCVi states “if the cost of the vaccination increases we will reduce the eligibility criteria”.)

Even if I have no medical condition I should be able to choose to protect my future health.

All this stuff is also at the behest of the police officer in front of you. If they misunderstood the rules and they make you remove your mask, the damage is done.

I’m not saying police are oppressors, I’m saying people like you making decisions for society that you can’t comprehend the ramifications for others are the oppressor. People making ableist decisions based on bias and also cost.

What is valid proof someone should share? What is the cost of administering that.

Spend the money where it’s needed - tackling the roots of the antisocial behaviour eg gangs/shoplifting - not masks.

Yes I have experience of this, and because of that experience I’m saying a medical exemption WONT WORK.
Because

1. No one has a right to that information.
2. It’s not just people with defined illness who want to/need to protect their health.
3. There is no way to successfully define what constitutes a medical condition suitable for exemption. And rules would most work here.

4There is no way to administer such a scheme.

What I’m saying is your attempt to “other” people is a terrible take and YOU can’t just say “it’s okay there will be a medical exemption” without being able to
comprehend what that looks like or means for the people it would effect.

no where I know of bans a medical face mask. In fact places like Japan and South Korea many many more people wear a mask in public precisely because of understanding and mutual respect.

If you can’t comprehend that the problem is you have misunderstood the situation.

Genuine question since I am not in a very diverse area, but how do teachers hand over the children at the end of the day to their correct parent when they cannot identify them due to face coverings?

People have very short memories. Go back 10 years, 20 years and it was highly unusual to see face coverings in the UK, whether niqabs, young men intent on crime, protesters, anyone at all. A distinct social change has taken place and it makes many people uncomfortable.

People have always taken sensible precautions against the cold, same with the immunocompromised, but it is disingenuous of posters to keep raising these examples when it’s pretty clear that these aren’t what it is causing concern.

Totally disagree and I think this is a slippery slope. Anyone should be able to wear a mask if afraid of infection. Anyone should be able to pull a scarf up if it's very cold. And if you stop religious women wearing niqabs, they might not be able to leave their houses.

Absolutely agree

Absolutely NO ONE has suggested banning medical masks . The countries that ban face covering make exemptions for medical need. So this argument is a disingenuous red herring

Wearing a niqab is not a religious requirement so why wouldn’t they be able to leave their house ?

Wearing a niqab is not a religious requirement so why wouldn’t they be able to leave their house ?

For those who think a ban is unworkable - they should investigate how other countries manage a ban in face covering .
Also - for those who claim a ban would be discriminatory… The European Court of Human Rights upheld the French ban in 2014, ruling that it did not violate the European Convention on Human Rights, specifically regarding freedom of religion.

Who decides what’s valid? Which conditions are valid. How far is that validation? Can I wear one to protect the person I love or care for or only if I have the condition.

Are you aware if how this type of law is made? There are public consultations and focus groups and lots of work with lawyers and other experts.

How does the Blue Badge scheme work? That’s sounds fairly equivalent.

Even if I have no medical condition I should be able to choose to protect my future health.

I don’t really understand this point but you ‘protecting your future health’ shouldn’t preclude a law intended to reduce anti social and criminal behaviour.

I’m not saying police are oppressors, I’m saying people like you making decisions for society that you can’t comprehend the ramifications for others are the oppressor.

I’m the oppressor for wanting to talk about how to reduce anti social and criminal behaviour for the benefit and safety of all of society? Especially vulnerable people like the disabled who may be disproportionately affected if hordes of marauding youths are allowed to cause havoc in town and city centres with a greater level of impunity because it’s far harder to identify and prosecute. I’m not making decisions for society (although funny that you think I am so empowered), I am making suggestions to help improve things.

I think you might benefit from some further reflection on your stance.

I’m saying a medical exemption WONT WORK.

Apparently the Blue Badge parking scheme is just a figment of my imagination but ok. We still need to look at banning face coverings in general as they are contributing to criminal and terrorist behaviour. How do you want to be accommodated for your medical needs?

no where I know of bans a medical face mask. In fact places like Japan and South Korea many many more people wear a mask in public precisely because of understanding and mutual respect.

I think you are getting confused. You are the only one saying medical exemptions won’t work. No one here has proposed to ban medical face masks.

And if you stop religious women wearing niqabs, they might not be able to leave their houses.

If that happens then I think the solution is education of the community to reinforce that it is a) not a religious requirement and b) not compatible with British/Western values.

We should not be condoning general use of this tool of oppression that is used against millions of women across the world to isolate and restrict them. I am quite amazing at how many will support the use of face coverings despite them being used to oppress women because they think they are being ‘kind’.

If a person is utterly desperate to wear face coverings, there are a number of countries where it is allowed. Mandatory even. As I said before it has been decreed that Afghan women are only allowed to see out of one eye in public.

Burqas have also been used to enable terrorist and other criminal activity. Allowing them to become more widespread will only create further opportunities for criminals.

See - you still don’t understand. The difference with the blue badge scheme is that not parking in a blue badge bay doesn’t directly affect your health and isn’t policed. Sure you may get a fine from a traffic warden if you use it wrong. It’s not even enforced in most places. Sure being able to open your car door and be closer to the building is very helpful.

You are suggesting the equivalent of the police walking round and checking someone had a defined or proscribed medical condition before they are allowed to use a wheelchair or cane and then confiscating that wheelchair or cane because the person can’t prove on the spot with paperwork or the condition they are using it for isn’t “on the list”.

Thats what you don’t understand. And why you shouldn’t have a say in what happens.

If you want to remove the bad behaviour- deal with the behaviour.

Plus there are people out there who would benefit from the blue badge scheme but aren’t entitled to use it. That doesn’t work for them or help them. It is not fair to take a personal protection away. How long would the application take? In the meantime do you just have to stay at home?

I am not getting confused - this whole post is about banning face coverings. I’m telling you a medical exemption won’t work because of all the reasons mentioned it won’t be fair or reasonable.
I know plenty who mask who don’t even have a medical condition that would likely be covered. They just value their health.

If you want to protect disabled people from antisocial behaviour and gangs roaming around towns. Then deal with that. Banning a far covering won’t stop that. You are more likely to hurt a disabled person than someone in the gang.

The problem isn’t masks - it’s the antisocial behaviour. You tackle that. You put the money, resources and all the think tanks into tackling that. Not creating admin and special documents and laws that won’t even help because the people committing crimes, who you want to stop, don’t care about following the law - or they wouldn’t be shoplifting, or terrorising people.

I think you might benefit from some further reflection on your stance. It’s okay that you don’t understand. You are oversimplifying the “medical exemption” idea without real understanding of what that means.

The problem isn’t masks - it’s the antisocial behaviour. You tackle that.

It’s far harder to tackle anti social behaviour if you can’t identify or isolate the perpetrators.

And obviously let’s enable the oppression of women by men who live in cultures that say it’s ok to sexually assault ‘immodest’ women.

You are suggesting the equivalent of the police walking round and checking someone had a defined or proscribed medical condition before they are allowed to use a wheelchair or cane and then confiscating that wheelchair or cane because the person can’t prove on the spot with paperwork or the condition they are using it for isn’t “on the list”.

Honestly, you are just making stuff up now. Have a look at how it works in other countries and take it from there.

Completely agree!

You're saying it doesn't work, but it does work. France and Austria have introduced a ban on face coverings and it works.

The problem is women who wear head coverings for religious reasons would just be forced indoors, more isolated and unable to work or go out.

A balaclava is different.

They're living in a western liberal democracy. Maybe it's time for those communities to ditch traditions that are outdated and inappropriate. As well as France and Austria, Denmark and Belgium have introduced a ban on face coverings.

Also, some Muslum majority countries ban face coverings, for security reasons.

Maybe they simply accept that they are being coerced to do something based on some story made up by a bloke 1500 years ago in order to get land and obtain a better trade route to the Mediterranean. Fine if they want to hold those tales as a personal belief for whatever reason, but if you want to live in a society your primary responsibility is to that society including its cohesion and security.

Agreed. We make so few demands in this country and instead of being appreciated, minority communities regard our weakness with contempt. Cohesion and security should take priority.

Yes - security and social cohesion are in everyone’s interest. That should be the priority as it protects us all - but particularly protects the vulnerable.
Anyone who has a medical need must be also catered for but if they lived in an area with thugs in balaclavas and on “borrowed” lime bikes I think they would appreciate that their right to wear a medical mask must be balanced with society’s right to say that it must be an exception ( perhaps accompanied by a card like a disabled parking permit) . There should be no need to explain the nature of your need - as there is no need to explain with a disabled parking badge.