to resent pressure on grandmothers to provide childcare?

[ReluctantGM]

I feel like there’s a real pressure placed on grandmothers that just isn’t there for grandfathers.

I work and I want to keep working. Partly because I need the income, but also because it gives me structure and some space. But because I’m the grandmother, there’s a clear pressure on me to step in and provide regular childcare so my daughter and daughter-in-law can return to work. I’m often told I could be spending more time with the grandchildren and building a bond with them.

I do understand that childcare is expensive and that life is more expensive these days. I’m not dismissing that at all. But I’ve said more than once that I can’t do it. I don’t have the energy or capacity for it, and I don’t want to take on that level of responsibility.

My DD and DS keep bringing it up and have even suggested that I go part time or rearrange my hours to make it work. It feels like pressure rather than a genuine choice.

I was exhausted by parenting the first time round. My DS had mental health problems and needed a lot of care and support well into his early twenties. I gave everything to that stage of my life. Yes I love my grandchildren, but that doesn’t mean I want to be responsible for them day to day.

I also find it really hard to tolerate crying babies and young children now and I don’t want to keep getting ill from all the bugs they inevitably bring home.

Yesterday I was out shopping and saw a toddler having a full tantrum and felt relieved that I don’t have to deal with that anymore. I walked away to get away from the noise.

What I find particularly frustrating is that there is absolutely no expectation on my husband. No one is asking him to change his work or take this on. It’s just assumed I should be the one to step in.

I’ve spoken to other friends and they feel the same pressure. Their husbands get no pressure and there are no expectations of them to adjust their work hours or give up work to look after children.

Why do adult children/DIL/SIL feel they can pressure grandmothers into providing childcare, while grandfathers are left alone or not even asked, especially if they’re working?

Of course the main problem is that childcare in the U.K. is just too bloody expensive! Especially given that both parents so often need to work nowadays, in order to pay the rent/mortgage and have enough left for other basics.

Does it say if that is what the grandmother wants to do? I'm assuming you'd agree that they have that right.

It is too expensive but that burden is being put on grandmothers rather than grandfathers or shared equally.

https://theweek.com/culture-life/are-grandparents-the-uks-forgotten-workforce

https://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/entry/feel-trapped-grandparent-childcare_uk_691b0a2ee4b085766d7dfe6c

https://inews.co.uk/inews-lifestyle/30-hours-childcare-grandparents-3867583

Now just because you have never experienced something it does not mean it isn’t an issue. For example, I have never experienced spousal abuse, but I would not go onto a thread where a poster is talking about experiencing spousal abuse and stick my size eights in and declare it’s not something I’ve ever experienced. Because it comes across quite badly to be honest.

Misogyny is ingrained prejudice against women. Which is exactly what this is.

Isn’t it interesting that childcare is deemed too expensive for parents to pay for yet the price of providing childcare by grandmothers is absolutely a-okay? The price on a grandmother’s health, income, pension, social life, sleep etc. is all a perfectly acceptable price for her to pay?

People really should be making a plan for maternity leave and childcare before they even have the child tbh, if we are hoping to see men/fathers be part of this process they need to have a rude awakening as to expectations and responsabilities they have outside of just earning money.

They think it is ok as long as it free or cheap. Grandmothers must not be allowed a life of their own. They have got to be ever giving and kind. Meanwhile grandfathers enjoy themselves often not having done a lot care with their own children and getting away it with a second time with grandchildren.

How will they have a rude awakening. Some men don't get involved and that is why some women are scrabbling around pressuring their DM or MILs to plug the gap.

@BelBridge as per Merriam-Webster

Sexism

prejudice or discrimination based on sex
especially : discrimination against women

behaviour, conditions, or attitudes that foster stereotypes of social roles based on sex

misogyny

hatred of, aversion to, or prejudice against women

also : something (such as speech or behavior) that reflects and fosters misogyny

Which is exactly what I said: misogyny is prejudice against women. What’s the debate here?

Sometimes it's not just sexism - in my child's case, neither grandfather is nippy on his feet and while doting on their gc, with experience of changing nappies and feeding, they simply aren't fit enough to be left in charge of a toddler or baby. Of course, the same applies to grandmothers - where it used to be non-working 50 year olds, maternal age and women's need to work mean late 60s and early 70s filling in. I'm fit but I still found a full day with a hefty toddler very tiring.

My post - reproduced below - is more in line with the MW definition, which includes prejudice and discrimination in both definitions.

Misogyny is stronger, implies hatred, not just discrimination

Anyhow: both suck.

Even when the grandfathers are fine on their feet, they mostly do not take on the bulk of the care of gc.

It needs to be a wide spread change in how people approach having a child as a couple, I don't think many men understand what women sacrifice for having children not just with our bodies but like what you did and I have had to do and be at home with our children for an amount of time.
You would need to gather the financial and time impact/costs to each parent fot each option....that would be a rude awakening.

For me sexism is more about deep rooted stereotypes that have been around due to culture and history. It’s the beliefs.

misogyny is more a hatred of women and acts of abuse against women in a more directed way at such as online abuse and harassment.

in the examples in the thread it feels more like a history of stereotypes rather than people hate women as such.

both aren’t great either way - there are male stereotypes and female.

old fashioned stereotypes showing on this thread are that men work more and women have more caring roles.

I think that would be a rude awakening yes. But stereotypes and expectations keep coming into play.

A lot of men do not even take the fully paid paternity leave at my work because they are scared it will affect their careers. They are quite happy for the careers of their wives to be destroyed though.

I won’t fully disagree here - it’s outrageous but unless we want to pay much more tax and remodel our capitalist system then it won’t change much.

However, I’ll disagree slightly as one of my daughters manages to pay for childcare for 2 kids - one wraparound and holiday clubs and one with a childminder chosen as it was what they could afford. 2 parents, neither much above minimum wage and one doesn’t work Fridays. They have a mortgage though it’s cheaper than equivalent rent tbf and no they don’t get any top up but do get 30 hours recently which unfortunately doesn’t quite work like it sounds but helps.

They get an odd bit of help in the holidays to try save on it a bit - but just once per week.

I’m saying it is actually possible to manage without family childcare - it’s all about choices - the first choice though should never be pressuring gran to fill in - or the 2nd, 3rd and do on!

👍😊

I think they are bang out of order. I've never expected my parents to look after my child. They looked after her when there was an emergency and I had to go to hospital. I discharged myself so they wouldn't have to look after her overnight. I would never expect any type of regular commitment.

I think some grandparents enjoy it. I know if my DD has a child, I will happily help her out at much as possible. That's because I want to and would love it. I completely understand why some upeople wouldn't want to do it. I only have one friend whose children I wouldn't mind looking after. The rest of them have hard work and I've been glad to give them back!

It also doesn't say if they were responding to pressure to drop their hours. which is what this thread is about.

Where did I say it doesn't happen?

X number of women say they do childcare does not mean they don't want to do it, aren't fit enough to do it or are being pressured to do it so it doesn't prove anything.

Maybe women need to learn to say no without having to question what other people do? I do and have done lots of caring for GC for 20 years. I don't feel any desire to question women who don't want to do it. I don't need to start working out if a 60 year old can do x y or z.

Maybe don't worry about what other people want you to do and make your own decisions and get on with life.

No so no useful information unless you want to decide for yourself. Ie make it up.

Lots don't take it as they can't afford to. Some employers give full pay but many don't.