Needy man in the coffeeshop

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We have a lovely coffeeshop nearby: independent, great coffee and pastries, lots of plants. Much nicer than Costa. A few minutes in there is my only peaceful time, a few times a week.

Every single day an older man is sitting in there. He says he’s ‘writing’ but he looks up at every single person who comes in, with ‘please talk to me’ eyes.

I have tried to be friendly, but it’s never just a quick chat about the weather. It’s always something enormous and I can’t get away: gender, immigration, his life history at great length. Yesterday:

Me: Hi how are you?
Him: Not good
Me: What’s wrong?
Him: Sometimes I just find people are so disappointing.

I was determined not to get trapped again so I just smiled and walked away at that point. Then felt guilty a bit but it’s ridiculous at this point.

Why do some men think women owe them a conversation?

YABU: Talk to him every time
YANBU: Quick smile and sit somewhere else

Good grief. He hasn’t stopped you doing anything. Just ignore and get on with your day.

Put headphones round your neck before you go in - little wave - then when you sit down put headphones on and relax. Just give yourself some space -if he comes over and interrupts that’s a whole different story

Yes this is ‘small talk’ and what many people are happy to engage with. His dreary nonsense is best cut short - someone needs to put manners on him - it doesn’t help to indulge his poor social skills.

Just after DH died I had to take my car in for a service. I sat and waited, as they said it wouldn’t be long. An older man, who was also waiting, kept trying to talk to me. I just wasn’t in the mood and tried to avoid a conversation. It must have been obvious because he said “I’m sorry to keep talking to you”.

I really didn’t want a conversation and I definitely didn’t want to say anything about DH, as I would have cried.

The man knew I wasn’t interested but he persisted. 🤷‍♀️

You are wrong. Its not "small talk" that these people are wanting though is it and thats the exact point!

eg. I make small talk with people all the time - eg at the supermarket checkout we might discuss the current weather or waiting for a bus I might ponder with someone else the changes the high street has seen since covid or when queuing in a shop I might discuss how busy it is with them etc... Thats small talk.

But this man the OP is referring to wants political discussions about immigration and heavy topics that most of us really dont feel comfortable talking about to a complete stranger - especially if they have racist undertones or negative connotations.

I know exactly the kind of person the OP is referring to- strangers who want to rant, offload their negative opinions onto others or pry into your business and ask you personal or intrusive questions and its not ok. That has nothing to do with small talk and its about them not respecting other people's boundaries

I think maybe he'd be better off in one of those cafes inside churches. I remember going into one in my local town, really just to take the weight off my feet whilst out Christmas shopping. I was approached by one lady who was working there in some capacity who came up to me with a "is there anything troubling you that you would like to talk about" me "no only my aching feet, but thank you very much for asking"

Op, you sound like you mean well but for goodness sake, this is so easy; just don’t initiate conversation! At most, offer a brief smile then look away and enjoy your coffee. I certainly wouldn’t be avoiding going, if I were you, given you’re the one approaching him and starting conversation, based on his ‘sad’ eyes.

Id keep it brisk. Just hello and move on. It can be done, don't let it make you give up a good cafe. Sometimes you have to move on from chatting, it's not unreasonable. I'm good at social chitchat but clearly when I don't want to go further. I'm not rude but I am clear.

Maybe she’s lonely because she is a self serving tedious bore who doesn’t nurture any conversations or relationships by showing any interest in others?

He hasn’t stopped you though, has he?

You need to stop asking him questions, that’s what needs to stop!

To be fair OP, I think you have put yourself in that position. Next time you see him, nod and smile and sit away from him. No need for all this angst and changing coffee shops.

I'd smile, say hello and pass the time of day.
If he appears to want to use you as a shoulder to cry on, I'd whip a book out, or a folder and say 'sorry but I do have some work/ reading to do.'

It costs nothing to be pleasant and one day you might be an old, lonely lady in a coffee shop.

Agreed. This behaviour is the fake nice I really struggle with. And I see it a lot in the UK in particular.

Now I wouldn’t want to listen to that stuff the old man is saying. I was that person who for several years has had family, friends and total strangers go into monologues about their deep trauma or contentious issues (eg immigration) while not giving me a chance to say anything. Now I’ve woken the heck up and I don’t tolerate that anymore when it’s a, not reciprocal and b. affecting my own emotional and mental health. I have set boundaries.

Once I knew what he was like I would just stop engaging with him beyond a nod and a smile.

This fiasco keeps repeating itself because the OP is desperate to “ act nice” and “feel good” about acknowledging this man, while not liking the very predicable consequences.

This is why it’s better to be authentic than nice. A lesson I myself have had to learn. People can think what they want of me but at least I know I’ve been honest with myself and protected my peace when someone when I’ve chosen not to give someone an audience to go offload when I don’t have capacity for it.

That’s not to say I’ll never ever listen to someone’s problems - be they a friend or a stranger - but when I do, it has to be a choice I’ve happily taken, so I won’t feel resentful afterwards.

OP if you “need” to change cafes that is entirely a problem of your own making.

I’m wrestling with the fact that he’s stopped me going to my favourite cafe though, and it feels as though it’s because of his behaviour. I feel we’ve gone beyond the point where I could blank him.

He hasn't. You're being a bit silly to frame it like that.

Just make polite chat for 30 seconds and move to a table where he can't talk to you, if that's what you prefer.

It's your social skills that need upgrading, not his behaviour.

He is obviously lonely, maybe because he doesn't have anyone close in his life, or maybe because he is a crashing bore ... but that's not OP's problem.

Perhaps a cheery smile and a quick comment as you pass, but keep on walking and don't sit at a table near him...take a book or something so you don't have to get into a conversation.

I work on a reception desk. Small talk is part of my job and I'm good at it. We get a lot of retirees in due to the nature of the company.

But it is always the men who wander in and start on at me about immigration, the council, the PM, GP appointments, disrespectful teenagers, the neighbouring "rough" town (where I live, unbeknownst to them). The women just come in, comment on the weather, sort out what they need to and leave. Why is that? Why do they think this is appropriate?

Would it hurt you to be kind?

You can say hi to him without asking him a question. That way you've greeted him, which he clearly needs, without inviting a conversation.

A nod and a hello as you walk past. No questions. If he asks you how you are you say good, thanks but you dont ask him back and you dont turn your body towards him. Bright and breezy, friendly, but not signaling willingness to engage in conversation.

Honestly keep going. Look at it as a personal development opportunity for you. Can I a) not initiate, b) not expand the conversation, c) am I ready with my words and positioned to move on directly, d) can I feel no guilt, e)can I avoid avoiding, f) have I learned to adapt my style without fleeing or feeling bad.

Honestly we all can keep learning, adapting our social skills, creating a more assertive stance etc. Stay for you for the coffee shop and to prove you can cope.

Why do some men think women owe them a conversation?
YABU: Talk to him every time
YANBU: Quick smile and sit somewhere else

OP you've worded this in such a way where most people would vote YANBU as its the sensible way forward . I certainly did because yeah I do think the answer is to give a quick smile and sit somewhere else. So officially YANBU according to the options you’ve given.

But at the same time you are massively unreasonable and absurd, in the sense that you could’ve resolved this issue easily instead of simmering quietly and now considering changing cafes.

Is your Coffee shop in Sittingbourne ? I know a man that constantly tries to engage in conversation like your man.

I’m wrestling with the fact that he’s stopped me going to my favourite cafe though, and it feels as though it’s because of his behaviour. I feel we’ve gone beyond the point where I could blank him.

You're fantasising this whole relationship. There is no 'we'. You don't know him and you're reading way too much into his 'sad face' and 'his behaviour'. He's not stopping you doing anything. You're entirely responsible for your own actions and responses and you can blank him from right now if you really wanted to. Sounds like you need some good old-fashioned assertiveness training. Or just have a strong word with yourself and start taking ownership of your choices. Makes me wonder if the reason this cafe became your sanctuary is because you prostrate yourself for people in any other aspect of your life. Just stop doing that. Blank him. See what happens. I'll tell you what - precisely nothing. Like every other person in every other cafe who you don't speak to and get in a tizz about.

You've decided you can't adapt your behaviour, it's not him causing you to change cafes.

You engage him.

Just say you can't chat today and move on.

this man doesn’t, he just apparently looks at OP a certain way, which makes her engage with him and ask how he is!

What are 'please talk to me' eyes? I sometimes write in coffee shops, or on the train, or in airports. When I'm absorbed in something, and thinking about how to compose a response to a tricky work email, or write something creative, or find the exact and perfect word or phrase, I look up from my work and contemplate. Truth is I'm quite deep in thought, not intending to give off signals that i want someone to speak to me.

However, if someone does speak to me, I assume that they are the one who wants a conversation. Maybe I've been getting it wrong for years.