To say SDs have to share a room?

[Cachet88]

DP and I are buying a new, bigger house. It will have four bedrooms. One for us, one for DS6. We also have SD12 (twins) who are with us EOWE and half the holidays. Currently they share a room.

SDs mum moved and we moved to be closer about three years ago. Therefore my mum now lives too far to do day visits but stays here every month or two. DP’s family live abroad and stay a few times a year, and we have other friends and family to stay fairly often too (pretty location!).

As there are now two bedrooms unaccounted for, SDs want a bedroom each. I do not want this, because I want a spare room for guests, and because both SDs are absolutely disgusting in terms of hygiene.

YANBU: they don’t need a room each
YABU: they need a room each

We / DP have been in contact with the school a lot, this is why we moved closer, so the option of more time is there. But they’re nearly thirteen and can vote with their feet.

I have no idea whether their mum’s whole house is a pit or whether she does all their cleaning for them. Their mum seems fine and normal, she’s very defensive when anything is raised which could be interpreted as critical of her parenting, and quite hostile and critical in defence. We don’t have that kind of relationship where you can raise issues. The girls do a lot of babysitting and, from my perspective, emotional support for their mum. But I don’t think they’re neglected to any extent that’d trigger intervention.

If they were here 50/50 I’d say they needed their own rooms. But for so few nights, with the level of cleaning that’s required afterwards… I don’t think they do.

Children are not automatically entitled to a room each, biological or step children. Only on MN is it law to have a bedroom each. I grew up sharing a room with my 3 sisters.

Ideally yes it would be nice for a child to have their own room. However, as they get on and have the same interests I would be inclined to say they share a room. Will they be getting the biggest room? That would be fair I think if you insist they share.

Room each. Set them both up with a super nice daybed that converts into a double bed or something for guests. Both responsible for their rooms including choosing decor/paint etc - this should discourage the messiness... (hopefully).

In your updates you say they often come to yours with dirty hair etc - I would let them be at yours to be honest, you don't know what it's like for them at their mum's. Get them nice bath stuff and encourage cleanliness by setting examples rather than instructing, which doesnt seem to work.

Honestly, their shared room sounds lovely with its ensuite - they need to earn the privilege of a separate room on longer visits (and there needs to be consequences dished out by DH for trashing the room either way). Your DH wants them to have separate rooms because he feels some level of paternal guilt. He needs to address this by being more engaged - and this means taking them in hand over the state of the room and their hygiene. It needs to be him otherwise you will be perceived as a wicked step-mother. I’d put my foot down over this, frankly. He needs to step up.

They do wash themselves here, they both love a long, hot bath with my most expensive products!

It is hard to find the line, I do want them to learn good habits but I also don’t want to spend all my limited time with them nagging.

What you’re saying here indicates a bigger problem, it sounds like your DSDs aren’t being cared for properly at their Mum’s house.

if this is the case, why isn’t your DP pushing to have them live with you more than 50 nights of the year?

It’s not surprising they don’t have many friends at school if they’re not washing and are, by the sounds of it, the smelly kids at school.

They're of an age where personal hygiene is really important and they should be washing themselves every day. If they’re not doing that at their mums, could they come and live with their dad more so he can make sure they are clean and have clean clothes to wear?

I’m surprised he’s allowed this to go on as long as it has; how sad for those poor girls 😞

^Hilarious.

I would probably want to give them a room each with the aim to have them over 50/50 just to help set good habits. However I do see the dilemma. I would maybe just take it as it comes and start sharing and go from there.

Bogies smeared on walls, oil smeared on white furniture, chewing gum stuck under a bed etc are all disgusting. At their age there's no excuse for them to be less disrespectful.
They can definitely share. They only spend about the same amount of time in the house as your guests. And who needs two rooms ruined like that?
Your DP needs a rocket up his arse about this: he doesn’t want to do the necessary cleaning to make their room(s) passably clean. Who does he think will do it then? (that's a rhetorical question; I can guess the answer).
And it's not just cleaning, presumably; damaged furniture might need replacing, and towels that have been left screwed up and wet will go fusty and need chucking out. They sound expensive, avoidably so.

That's crap. She doesn't sound vicious and mean at all, quite the opposite.

I think the only way is, as others have said, that when they can prove that they can look after their room then they can have one each. If the disgusting behaviour goes on, they carry on sharing. Put the ball in their court - if they really want it they'll do what they need to do. If they can't be bothered to clean their rooms then they're obviously not that bothered about sharing either.

I definitely wouldn't offer individual rooms for 12 year old children who only need it for 100 days each year but are also leaving their current bedroom in such a state.

I shared a bedroom with two siblings until I was working age. In all my life I've probably only had my own bedroom for a couple of years!

Kids don't have to have everything their own way. Nothing wrong with sharing a room.They should count their blessings.

@Cachet88

I can see both sides of this.

Have the girls specifically said they want separate bedrooms? I know one said she (in essence) wanted a bedroom and a 'playroom' and that would be a resounding NO from me.

If they were neat and tidy would you have a problem with them having separate rooms? I ask this because if so AND they've specifically asked for separate rooms, I would have a serious discussion with them and explain that right now you won't be allowing it because they are so messy. But IF they can manage to begin and continue to keep their shared room neat, tidy, and 'hygienic' then the issue can be reopened. With the proviso that if they fall down on their tidiness, they will again be sharing a room.

No she doesn't, not by a long way. Expecting children to keep their room in a reasonable condition and respecting the home in general is far from vicious.

I agree that they probably wouldn’t trigger intervention by social services but I do think that your DH should be pressing for more contact. Lack of basic hygiene, not knowing how to keep the place tidy, few friends, emotional support for a defensive mother sounds like a tough life for them.

Their mum sounds borderline neglectful.

Is it possible something like ADHD is at play? Are they organised with their school work?

Oh my goodness, I can identify with the disgusting hygiene of girls of this age, horrendous

*obviously not all of them

Shared room seems fine to me.
They share at their mum’s place.

Guest bedroom can be an office too?

Ah that old chestnut....a common insult on MN when a SM dares to want a bit of respect from her DH's offspring.

Put them in the same room. All those saying they should have their own room but 1 gets kicked of theirs and has to share with the other when guests arrive....do you not see the flaw in that argument? "Out you get Lucy, Aunt Mable is coming to stay so you're going to have to give up your room and bunk in with your sister, remember though it's her room so don't mess it up". 1 child gets to have a permanent room of their own and the other has nowhere that's just hers. That will bode well for their future relationship.

Mine were the same absolutely disgusting, now have immaculate houses of their own so it does pass 😂

I agree. Let them have a room each, tell them if someone else is staying during their time with you they will have to double up, that's normal but it's not going to be regular.

Or your six year old could sleep with you for the odd night, that too is normal.

As oir their poor hygiene, trust me,that will change soon enough and you won't be able to get them out of the bathroom (I hope you have more than one bathroom). Buy them nice toiletries and show them how to look after themselves, their hair and their clothes. All kids need that. My mum taught me nothing, I learned from magazine articles!

It will work out, don't worry.

They're not entitled to a room each, and they've demonstrated by their behaviour that they're not ready for the terms on which you'd consider it, i.e. keeping their rooms in a decent enough state that other guests could be accommodated when needed. I'd insist in the first instance that they share, but I'd be tempted to give them a way to earn the privilege of separate rooms if that's what they want. So I'd sit them down and say that you're prepared to consider it, if they show you that they can abide by your reasonable rules, and spell out exactly what you expect from them - dirty clothes in the laundry basket, damp towels hung to dry, no litter anywhere except the bin (and at 12 I'd expect them to empty their bin in the recycling when needed), etc. If they manage that over, say, six weeks, at that point they can have their own rooms. Make it clear that any backsliding and they go back to sharing.

No she doesn't!