AIBU to hesitate about caring for my niece’s baby?

[FerretPants]

I have name changed for this. For legal reasons I can't discuss how the baby was conceived - needless to say that that side of things is currently being dealt with.

My niece has Global developmental delay, severe learning disabilities and is believed to be on the autism spectrum. She lives in a residential setting with staff present 24/7. Her father (my brother) takes care of all her affairs. Her mother died several years ago. She was there only child and there is few other family members.

DN is pregnant and due to give birth in the next few weeks. She isn't going to be capable of looking after a baby even with intense support. Social services have carried out an assessment and confirmed this. So the question has turned up what will happen to the baby when it's born. DB is now in his mid 60's and has said he feels he is too old to care for the baby full time. So myself and DH have been approached by social services - we have two DS's of our own aged 14 and 18 - the 18 year old is due to move to University in the Autumn. We have a spare bedroom (it's a box room but would be fine for a nursery) so that wouldn't be an issue. DH (I haven't told our sons yet - they rarely see her and don't know she's pregnant) is keen to explore the idea further. But I'm having doubts. We are both in our mid 50's and I feel like I'm past the nappies and bottles stage now... But at the same time this baby is family (as is my niece) and I feel like we should help if we can. If we say no the most likely scenario is foster care and then adoption. We have a meeting with social services next week, so we really need to decide one way or the other by then. I'm torn

This is not accurate. There would need to be some sort of court order.

I think there’s many people that consider themselves past the nappies stage but end up doing it again due to circumstance and life not being straightforward. People find themselves looking after grandchildren because their child has had a baby when very young, or due to illness or addiction, or inability to raise the grandchild, or sadly dying etc. it’s not what they planned but the alternative is too awful. I know this isn’t your grandchild but the baby is in your family and if it were me that would take priority over the life plan I might have made.

I’m not seeking plaudits. I’m giving a perspective. On an internet forum. I don’t need you to be grateful. I also don’t need you to be abusive. I’m allowed to give an opinion. An opinion that is shaped by personal experience.

What a strange comment. The OP is seeking views and things to think about, and this person has offered it in a reasoned and calm manner.

I don’t think it’s abusive tbh. I’m just not sure how helpful your comments are- she’s tangentially attached / detached to a mess she does not have to solve.

Of course she doesn’t HAVE to solve it but some people (presumably not you) feel an attachment and loyalty and desire to care for people related to them?

I would not necessarily want to take on the child but I do think you might be able to offer to facilitate ongoing contact between the child and your family. There is no reason why they shouldn’t grow up knowing their mum, grandad and great aunt, even if they have an adoptive family.

I’m sure that the OP and her husband and family have enough sufficient intelligence and wit to come to a decision about the baby between them. There is no right or wrong decision. There is just a decision. I was merely giving a perspective as someone who has adopted two vulnerable children from the UK care system. Also, it’s never cool to tell adopters or foster carers that you’re grateful for what they do. Especially, when you’re in the ballpark of having a child consigned to care.

Just wanted to say that actually there is a massive national shortage of people wanting to adopt, and a vast number of children, including babies, in need of permanent homes… I am definitely not saying that the OP should therefore keep this baby - that's a big big decision for her and her family…but the reality is that the baby won’t be scooped up by adoptive parents eager to take her…

Why would the OP be needed to facilitate that? That just sounds like trying to make the OP feel like she’s doing something when in reality that will happen as easily or otherwise with or without her involvement.

Hallelujah! As I have previously quoted, there are in excess of 3,000 babies and children in England and Wales waiting to be adopted. There are very many reasons for this. I would happily outline them, if anyone was interested. But I won’t disrupt the OP’s thread.

Direct contact between birth relatives and adopters/adopted children is incredibly rare. There is no legal onus on adopters (currently) to facilitate contact, be it direct or indirect, with birth families. This is entirely down to the wishes of the adopter/s. The most usual form of contact is what is called ‘letterbox contact’, whereby adopters and pre-agreed birth relatives exchange (usually annual) letters.

Oh gosh this is such a hard one. Rationally I’m not sure I could commit to this in your situation. What a massive upheaval for your whole family. I mean, her own father isn’t willing to do it.
Emotionally I would find it very hard to say no. And it would be on my mind a lot.
It’s a head vs heart situation.
I think a proper conversation with SS is needed to consider all options. Whatever you decide, you are a good person for even considering it. Many people wouldn’t.
I also agree that if the means of conception were not legal or morally right (I know you can’t discuss this) then keeping the child in the family may be difficult for your DN long term so that’s another thing to think about.
What a difficult position op. I feel for you.

I think that's very sad. I used to know a young girl who was in a long-term foster placement because her mother had learning disabilities. Incidentally, the girl did not have any special needs herself. Her mother was keen to stay in contact with her daughter and they used to see each other, albeit I think this was only a few times per year due to distance.

If it's in the best interests of the niece and her child to stay in contact, I very much hope they can do. The niece hasn't done anything "wrong" - I disagree with the assumption that her child would be better off having no contact with her due to her learning disabilities. If the niece doesn't want contact or repeatedly finds it distressing, then of course that changes matters.

⬆️ this. There are a lot of potential adopters who really really want a baby, and the number of babies coming up for adoption is really low. Something very positive could come out of this in that the baby is very likely to find a loving home with a couple who are very well equipped to look after him or her.

You are a lovely person to be considering this OP, but it might not be the right solution for all concerned.

Fostering and adoption are two very different things. In the UK. (I always find it very unhelpful when US posters talk about the adoption system in their country). Long-term foster carers would be expected to maintain direct contact with their foster children’s birth parents, and possibly other birth relatives, unless there were reasons not to promote contact, such as violence or sexual abuse, for example. Adoption is very different to fostering. Adoption is a legal process whereby the baby or child is legally severed from their family of origin. The adopter/s become the new legal parent/s and they get to decide on contact with the family of origin. In the same way that most parents here would decide who they wanted to be in their child’s sphere of influence.

Just to say, not all adopters are in couples. Some of the best of us are singlies. So many myths that need to be busted on this thread.

@FerretPants

I think this is a very tough position to be in and i don’t think you are being unreasonable in the slightest to be very cautious. It would be extremely irresponsible- to you, your family and to this baby- to rush into blindly based on emotion alone.

I would say having both professional and (indirect) personal experience of a not dis-similar situation (which I won’t go into) I would be very cautious.

Firstly, yiu have to consider whether you have the physical, emotional and financial resources to take over the care of a baby. And you need to consider the future too, not just the here and now. How will this affect your retirement plans, for instance? How you will you cope when the baby is teenager and you are heading to 70+ (based on the fact your DB is mid-60’s I;m guessing you are mid-50’s or older)?

secondly, you need to consider the impact on your children- this will be a big disruption to their lives- if your eldest is of to uni this year, he may well be sitting very important exams in the next few months- how is that going to work with a newborn in the house? Your younger son is also coming up to a crucial time- can you give him the support he needs, as well as coping with a young baby? It’s important to take your son’s views into account, but I think it would be wide to bear in mind that they may not really understand the impact on them, and also that they may not want to say “no” for fear of seeming selfish.

I don’t know the nature of your nieces’ GDD, and it may not be hereditary at all, but if it likely/there is a higher than average possibility that this baby could have additional needs then that is a further consideration you need to take into consideration. Especially as you wouLd be older carers. I’m not trying to be disablist, but if you are older trying to care for a child/young person with additional needs there are additional challenges for many.

I would also caution with regard to social services and whatever promises they make re support if you do take on kinship caring role- you should be prepared to manage without whatever support they offer. The experience of the family I alluded to earlier would strongly suggest that this is not be relied upon. They were promised all sort of support, which either never materialised or was not maintained consistently. I am not sure if they were deliberately over-promised to help persuade them to take on the children, or whether the promised were made with sincerity but then cuts/lack of resources etc meant those commitments could not be honoured. Either way, the majority of support they were offered initially was not followed through on. It was really difficult, and trying to get answers/things done was very hard work. I’m not getting at social workers btw- I think most are massively overstretched, the departments are under-resourced etc- merely stating the promised support was not provided, the excuses for this were many and varied- I suspect a combination of deliberate/“aspirational” (being generous) support plans and genuine issues with providing it because of staffing/financial constraints outwith an individual social workers control. This couple are aware that they are not unique in terms of their experience of social work support being suboptimal to nonexistent. So by all means, go and ask questions of social work regarding kinship caring for your nieces baby, but I think you need to take whatever they promise with a pinch of salt.

In your position, I would not agree to take on the baby, family or not. I understand the desire to help given the very tough situation your neice (and your DB) find themselves in, but I think it will be a hard road to tread for you and your family, and it seems better all round if the baby could be adopted. Only take it on if you are 100% sure you can cope. I know I could not.

You may not wish to discuss it here but you should definitely be thinking about the possibility of SS forcing contact with the father or his family for the next 18 years if you agree to kinship care.

@Puffalicious I sincerely hope nobody has 'flamed' you. I think many people are just not honest about how hard being a parent can be. I wish you well.

Direct contact does happen. Yes it isn’t as common as in other countries as the majority of children being adopted in the UK are from a background of domestic abuse/ neglect/ a level of risk that the court determines is not in the best interests of a child to stay with their parents (and the parents are not necessarily in agreement with this). There are cases similar to this one where the parents are unable to care for the child but pose no/ little risk to the stability of the child/ adoptive parents. Adopters go through a lot of training, and part of that covers why it is in the child’s best interests to know about their birth family and have contact (letterbox or otherwise). Direct contact is certainly discussed, whether that is with birth parents or significant family members and I know a couple of families personally in whom it works very well.

You may already know this, but the starting point for adoption since the recent reforms is for some form of direct contact with the bio family, including parents ('staying in touch') Whether or not it will actually happen is another matter though, it's too early to tell. Understandably it is another barrier affecting the number of adopters, it's a lot to expect of adoptive parents I think.

Yes, I know that this is something that Sir Andrew McFarlane, the president of the family court, is pushing very hard. As yet, there is no real legal onus on adoptive parents to maintain contact. As with everything, there are trends that come and go in adoption. Mainly inflicted by so-called experts who do not live with some of society’s most vulnerable children. And who give up their careers and lives to do so. In my personal opinion, there should be no blanket ‘policy’ but every case should be taken on its own merits. As it is, I organise, facilitate, pay for and supervise regular meetings-ups for my AD2 with her birth mum, who is herself the product of inter generational chaos and dysfunction. These meetings are very positive for AD2(10) because she loves her birth mum, is concerned for her wellbeing and loves to hear about her extended birth family (and their pets!). These meet-ups boost AD2’s happiness, sense of identity and self-esteem? Would I be prepared to maintain links with birth father, who was found - after two fact-finding court hearings- to have been responsible for the non-accidental death of a 10-week-old baby? No, I would not! But this is what the CAFCASS guardian and AD2’s TENTH social worker in two years wanted me to do. As a novice and vulnerable adopter I could have been forced to commit to something that simply feels morally wrong, just to satisfy a trend in adoption.

Op I’m sorry I could not do this. 54 here and I can’t even think about how exhausting this will be.

Would you see a grandchild of yours go into a life of care rather than try to cope with the exhaustion?