To tell a friend I can’t continue this level of help?

[Cosmicpickle]

The context I suppose is that I have 2 under 2, husband does work long hours but is genuinely great both as a partner and as a dad, I know I’m very lucky there and no complaints. Our friends had a baby at the same time we had our youngest, there is one week between them. My youngest is what I’d call an easy baby, sleeps well, feeds well, happy to just be here and really is no hassle at all beyond what you’d expect from a 4 month old. My friends baby on the other hand is a more difficult baby, doesn’t sleep well, cries a lot, issues with feeding, doesn’t like to be put down etc. Her partner isn’t a great support, see’s his days off as his time, his time after work as his down time- you get the picture, not particularly helpful. Her mum goes round 2 days a week to help her out and when the babies were tiny she asked if I would mind taking her baby for a few hours a couple days a week so she could catch up on sleep, rest, clean etc as she was really struggling. I remember all too well how hard it was being a first time mum with a tricky baby so I was happy to help and initially it was 2 days a week, 9am-lunchtime ish, yes it was a handful with my own 2 plus hers but it was okay and I knew she was finding it hard.

The problem is that now the babies are 4 months old and we’re still doing this except over time it has become longer and longer. The last two weeks one of the days has been 9:30am until 5pm, tomorrow she has asked if it could be the same and has also asked if I could have him overnight on Saturday so she can go out. Now I can manage but obviously with 2 under 2 myself it can be tricky and just a lot really with the 3, and the overnight- her partner isn’t working, he’s off, but she knows he won’t agree to have their child alone overnight so has asked me instead.

It feels like it has become just too much and I need to pull back a bit but is that unreasonable? I know she is struggling, genuinely, and I know how hard that is, I don’t want to be cruel and I don’t want to make her life harder, I can manage, I don’t mind helping, but this just feels like too much now. Especially as the babies aren’t tiny newborns anymore who are happy to just be in the pram or sleeping, days out are getting trickier with a toddler and 2 babies! AIBU?

I am certain that her panicked reaction to you suggesting contacting her mum or her DH are because she fears her lies are about to be exposed. There is no way her DH would want his stay at home wife not looking after their baby for four days every week. She might as well work. She has absolutely been taking the piss

So very sorry. I'll never forget a mother asking me to collect her son after school one night a week, then it was two, then it was three - and when the Easter holidays came she said I am hoping you can have him all day all week? I was gob smacked at her nerve. Unfortunately he was only 5, and my two were 7 and 9, and they had to be constantly reminded to include him in their games. Not a nice time for either of the kids and I had to tell her she'd have to take leave from her new job. I see the boy now and he has grown up to be a lovely young man.

Well done, OP! @Cosmicpickle

I hope she gets the help she needs. We all need tough love at times.

Enjoy your time away with (just) your own family. Sounds like a very good idea.

her partner isn’t working, he’s off, but she knows he won’t agree to have their child alone overnight so has asked me instead.

Your husband needs to find out if this is true. If it is, he must be a right CF to refuse to have his own child and think it's acceptable for his wife's friend to mind his baby instead. Your husband should be letting him know it's not on to exploit you in this way.

Hi OP - just wondering how things are now

Did you hear anything from the HV?
Has your “friend” been in touch again?

Hi OP, I thought a lot about this thread since I read it initially. Depression and anxiety is like looking at things through distorting glasses, so the help you ask for and try to get people to give you is likely to be influenced by your biased ideas of what you need. So I dont think she is trying to be a CF, especially if she is not usually like that, but just trying to get her needs met at a time when her ability to assess those is impaired.

I think you have to keep the line that you cant do any more, offer to support her to get help and keep reflecting that you can see she is having a hard time coping, but that the solution of leaning on you for help is not sustainable.

I'm wondering......imagine she gets pregnant with a second baby. Then the firstborn would end up full-time with you. I think it's time you had a good talk with her. Helping out the first frw months is fine, but she's using you know. Is she a SAHMom? Selfcare is important, but she shouldn't make you responsible for hers! Maybe she should consider daycare for one or two mornings every week so she can go and do something for herself - a yogaclass, shopping, seeing a friend.

It was correct to ask for a professional to visit, Op.
Nice to remain friendly and answer her phone calls and to keep inviting her to group outings once per week..

Keep calling professionals to recheck on her welfare if she is fobbing them off and if you are genuinely worried.
It will be the professional assistance that makes the biggest difference.

Your husband is sensible. He could go armed with leaflets about how men can help when women have PMD and where he can attend a caring for baby course. Practical help with finding him work could help. Puting up a notice around town and spreading the word about what type of work he's looking for etc.

I agree with others that suggesting the woman go back to work, part time, allows her to pay for childcare, or utilize her DH, while she concentrates on something else that gives her positive vibes.

I’ve voted YABU simply because you need to tell her to get alternative child care - you are being a doormat and she has a husband problem. She’s a CF and so is her husband. I’m so sorry for you as you sound like a heaven sent angel.

I'm sat wondering if her DH is actually the father - not to suggest she hasn't got enough problems already - but any man who has their own child surely wouldn't behave like he is doing (or would they) especially as she appears to be struggling so much. Does your DH know their history, did he actually want a child? Having said that my exH was an absolute pig, definately not father material and I left him when DD was 4.

Maybe he didn't want children.

I think you have been an amazing friend and support but honestly for the long term good of her and her family she needs to seek some professional help perhaps speaking to doctor about how she is struggling to cope.
could be that she has post natal depression - as well as a useless partner. You can’t keep being her go to - you need to support her not by having the baby but by pushing her to get the right help and maybe help by spending time together with your babies to help her see how you manage yours. Xx

What about the way she is behaving? Taking the absolute piss out of her friend.

She’s also claimed her mother isn’t having the kids as much as she is so her assertion about how little the husband is doing can be called under question too.

He may well be useless, but she’s an unreliable witness.

I’m sat here wondering if you’ve read the full thread? Maybe she’s not telling the truth about his input? She’s already lied about how much time her mum spends looking after the baby. And she’s really quite panicked whenever anyone offers to speak to her husband about stepping up and begs them not to tell him what she’s been saying. Is it possible she could be lying about how much time he spends with the baby too? Not everything in relationships is all about men not doing enough. Sometimes women are the ones not being completely honest.

Quite! And as for any man who has their own child surely wouldn't behave like he is doing - I'm sat here wondering if @Fearnotsunshine has read any of the zillion threads on here about dads being useless when it comes to childcare. Doesn't mean they're not the parent, but many men are more than capable of behaving like this with their own child, or even sodding off and leaving their DC without a glance back, whether the mum in this case is telling the truth or not.

Hi Sally.
I am so sorry but I am unable to do overnights with little Jack, while I’m happy to help you out for a couple of hours here and there, I myself am getting a little overwhelmed having 3. 9.30 - 1 twice a week is doable ATM but I’ve really struggled with you picking him up at 5 recently.
love @Cosmicpickle

Frankly her partner sounds like a total waste of space, presuming this baby is his, he should be helping and she needs to tell him she’s going out Friday night so he’s having HIS child….
its not baby sitting or doing her a favour…
it’s his bloody child too! My exH was like this, on his day off I told him I was working so he was having our DD, he said it was HIS DAY OFF… my mum had DD but I stewed ALL day & told him that night that on my days off I was a mum, on his days off he’s a dad!! End of! I would kindly suggest to your friend that she has a conversation with her partner about his role… he should be getting up and having baby on his days off and letting her lay in etc… I used to literally tell my exh ‘irs your turn today!’ At first he sulked about it but eventually he knew if I was asking then I was knackered… needed that lay in… I didn’t do it all the time, rarely in fact! But when I asked him to have DD he obliged.. I wouldn’t say willingly but he did it… then he’d bring up a cuppa when he’d had enough, wake me and say ‘are you getting up!’
. I think a lot of men love the idea of children but find the reality very different! I don’t think a lot of men are as selfless as most women & struggle giving up ‘their time’ … my ex changed totally,

If what the OP’s friend is giving a true picture of his behaviour, then yes, he does need to step up and be a father. The problem is that she’s clearly lied about how much her mother is helping her, so she may be lying about her partner as well.

The OP’s DH might be able to suss out more about what’s going on, if, as suggested by PPs, he talks to the friend’s partner. They could take all 3 children out for the day. It would give the friend a break so she can hardly object.

I meant to quote @T1Dmama .

This is what i thought! MN is awash with threads about men behaving exactly as he is towards their own children.

Hope all
ok x

Something strange going on here with this lady. She can’t cope with spending time with her baby which is v sad but it’s not on you to pick up for her. She will eventually have to learn to cope. Awful situation for you op

Well I’m more confused than ever about everything as time goes on! By pure chance her partner was texting my husband about their weekend plans last night and her partner asked how I was managing with our two kids so my husband took that opportunity to mention I’ve been having their son 2 days a week as well- her partner apparently had no idea this was happening every week. He knew I had looked after him sometimes but had no idea it was a regular thing and had no idea it was full days. My husband asked how she was doing and he said she’s doing really well… so either she is putting on a really good front at home, or he is oblivious, or she’s putting on a good act to me.

The comments from posters about the night off on Saturday, I’m not sure what has happened with that. The brunch was booked quite awhile ago, I’m breastfeeding which is why I’m not going with them and not going out, my husband would absolutely be happy for me to go and actively tries to give me as much time for myself as possible but as brilliant as he is he doesn’t have the ability to breastfeed and I totally accept that my choosing to breastfeed means I’m restricted for awhile, no issues at all with that. She agreed to go and they booked the table a few weeks ago, she only asked me to look after him overnight a few days ago so not sure if she had arranged for someone else to watch him and it fell through or if her plan was always to try and get me to do it at the last minute.

I haven’t heard anything from the health visitor but I wasn’t expecting to, I don’t think they would be able to tell me anything anyway. My friend did message today asking me to go round, she was struggling to settle him and just wanted some support so I did go. Maybe that’s foolish of me but that kind of support I don’t mind giving as it feels more like building blocks for her rather than doing it for her, I’ve taken the baby bouncer we have that her son really loves here (neither of my babies have liked it so may as well be being used somewhere) so hopefully that helps.

You definitely need to talk to her mother.

Sounds like she's putting a really good act on for you. Don't fall for it anymore. Shows how selfish she can be.

Your friend is definitely not OK. Whether that is not OK in the sense she has PND and is really struggling but trying very hard to maintain an image (which must be fucking exhausting for her). Or not OK in the sense there is a load of other more complex MH issues going on. Or whether she is just enjoying palming her child off to other people all week - who knows.

But I do think that you, her mother and her husband need to talk! This has all "worked" for her so far because she's kept you separate. There is a bigger problem at play, and she (and her child) need help.

Well, she’s obviously putting a good act on for somebody!!