Conflicted after DS hit DD and she fought back and beat him up?

[ForAmpleRobin]

Bit of sibling drama today and I’m not sure if I’m handling it right.

My DD is 9 and my DS is 11. Lately there’s been a bit of tension because she’s actually stronger and faster than him at a lot of things like running and general physical things. DD and my niece have started doing cross country and the girls have been practicing whilst we’ve been out on family walks as well as racing each other. DS is quite competitive and I think it bothers him more than he lets on that DD and his cousin are faster and stronger than him.

They were messing around earlier in the garden doing races and silly “strength competitions” like who can get who on the ground first and DS got increasingly annoyed when DD and DN kept winning. It escalated into him hitting his sister and trying to subdue her but she fought back.
She ended up properly beating him up. DN quickly came and told me about it and then I had to carry him inside and DH took DN home. He is covered in cuts and his bruises are starting to show up.

Obviously I’ve told them that hitting isn’t acceptable, but if I’m being completely honest I also felt proud that she’s confident and doesn’t back down. At the same time I know DS is feeling humiliated by being beaten up by his younger sister and that DN will spread it to the rest of the family. However this would help him learn his lesson!

AIBU for feeling conflicted about this? How would you handle it with both of them? I feel like I don’t know what the best punishment would be? I was thinking of grounding them both for fighting but then DD was in self defence so is it unfair and shall I just ground DS?

Being in an abusive relationship is different.

Here we are talking about a child hitting another child who retaliates excessively and causes bruises and cuts. That's a sustained attack. I would be concerned if any child showed that much aggression. That is not normal behaviour.

As someone whose kids are now adults anyone saying this is ok is completely mad. OP I’m appalled. What on earth is wrong with your children? Why are you allowing this to happen?

My god this is bizarre.

Yes. If a son of my attacked another boy and that other boy ‘won’ the fight - I certainly wouldn’t be seeing my son as the innocent party.
Obviously, I’m not including the use of a gun, knives or nunchucks. But if someone wants a fight then they can expect to walk away with a cut or a bloody bruise. Christ Alive. Actions. Have. Consequences.

OP i wouldn't want either of your kids around mine and they too are 9 and 11. (Girl being oldest). My two bicker like mad sometimes and the worst they have done physically is to playfully trip the other one up which I think is bad enough! But thats all they have done! Yet your two are taking lumps out of each other? They'll grow to be bullies n.OP if they think the best way to handle a situation is to get physical. Please ground them both for a while, remove all technologies and work on the violence!

Thats to harsh. Your son learnt a valuable lesson. A quiet word to your daughter about going to far, should be enough.

In a few years your son will give your daughter a proper punch.

He was covered in cuts, your daughter went far over the line and he will remember when he's stronger.

Posters not understanding what defensive means. It has to be PROPORTIONATE. Which this clearly wasn’t.

Give both of them the same punishment then make them write an apology and move on.

she might have gone a bit overboard

Why on earth do you think it is ok to say her son will punch her daughter at some point in the future? Are you a man? This is literally the root of this issue. That a male
thinks if he doesn’t get his own way he is entitled to lash out physically. Think about what you’re saying. If all women were able to physically defend themselves and all men knew there would be (embarrassing) consequences to their violence maybe we wouldn’t have so many women being abused by violent men.

This.

I didn't say he's entitled to lash out but it sounds like he was beaten black and blue and OP needs to ensure that both children are disciplined otherwise it will spiral.

Siblings fight. Parents teach them not to fight. They arent pleased the smaller one won or glad about it being spread around the family and the older one being humiliated.

You tell them both no fighting. Dd went beyond self defence if she properly beat him up. Phones gone for a night or 2 seems reasonable. Cancelling his birthday is very over the top and possibly cruel.

Dd could hurt a peer or dn if she things this behaviour is ok. Ds will be stronger than her at some stage. Fighting is never ok.

This
What the hell.

I think both of them need to learn to keep their hands to themselves. Your DD hitting back is one thing, good on her for that, but beating up? That’s too far. But I don’t think your DS should lose his cinema trip. His humiliation is punishment already. Both of them need equal messaging that their behaviour is unacceptable.

Why does a 9yo have a phone!?

Your dd is allowed to defend herself, but it sounds like this went far beyond defending herself. I'd have consequences for both, and supervise better in future as they clearly aren't responsible enough to be unsupervised.

Don't think Op thinks that much of her son to treat him that way when she's sickeningly cheering on the girl for beating him up

She shouldn't even have to defend herself.

I agree with you regarding DV. But this isn’t that- for a start, these are children, and also, the antecedent to this incident is unclear, as OP didn’t witness it.

If it’s the case that her DS was just being a sore loser, then her daughter was acting in self-defence at least at the start of her retaliation.

But the fact that the lead-up to this was the children playing a game that involved wrestling each other to the floor, and the DS is physically the weakest of the three, is relevant context. It’s unclear whether this was a game he was keen to play, or whether he was keen to play it but then wanted it to stop once he’d been taken down a few times, or exactly what happened. It may have all been good fun from the DD’s point of view but a very unpleasant and possibly frightening experience from the DS’s if he kept being wrestled to the floor by two children who are both stronger than him. Hitting may well have felt like self-defence from his perspective. Or, he might actually just be a mini misogynist, as some PPs have said. But as OP wasn’t there to witness, it’s going to be very difficult to get to the bottom of.

agree that OP has to draw an absolute line in the sand and forbid this type of physical play/competition between the siblings from now on and for the OP to keep an eagle eye so she can nip it in the bud right away. And to teach both children to have a more respectful sibling relationship.

OP, safety at home for your daughter does not lie in her ability to defend herself when he hits her, it lies in both of them learning that they should not be hitting each other.

You cannot let either of them think it's ok for this to have happened.

Yes, right now she can hurt him, she's a strong 9 year old and he's obviously not a terribly strong 11 year old. That's right now though. He's older than her, he is soon going to be going through puberty and then he is very likely to be much stronger than her. You have got to deal with this right now in a way that does not leave either of them thinking it's good to have done what they did.

Why do you feel conflicted? Your kids are close in age and had a fight. Siblings fight ALL the time! It’s pretty normal. They are kids!

Yeah
This is awful. I can't believe anyone thinks it's okay. And the OP saying that kids rough house they're too old for that now and this is exactly why it shouldn't be done.

he had to be carried in doors what the fuck? What the hell kind of sibling dynamic is this and OP sounds like she's not bothered.

Disturbing behaviour from both kids, totally weird. Sounds like you will be visiting them in prison before long.

I find it appalling that a parent wouldn’t show concern that their child was so badly injured by a sibling that they had to be carried. It’s never okay to condone violence. Parenting at its worst.

What, fight to the extent that a child has to be carried covered in cuts? Really? My DCs scrapped sometimes, but just with a push or slap, quickly stopped by myself. My DCs never ‘beat each other up’. Sounds like OP was actively encouraging the fight. Highly disturbing.