To not sit with dying parent? May be upsetting.

[lurchersforever]

My dad is dying - under palliative team and on morphine. This has been fairly unexpected but he is mid 70s and a heavy drinker and smoker, so not a complete shock at this point that this is happening. He has no specific diagnosis, such as cancer or heart issues, just a number of things have finally caught up with him I suppose.

I am low contact with both parents, especially him, and see them 2-3 times a year for a brief visit. I speak to my mum weekly but never my dad. I think they are dysfunctional and my mum has covered up or played down a lot of health and other issues over the years, but I haven't exactly pushed for info so can't blame her. I do think she's co-dependent.

I was tearful when the hospital rang me (think my mum had asked them to) but I'm at peace with what is happening now and, if I'm honest, relieved it isn't my mum going first. The thing is, I live a 3 hour drive away from them and have a teen at home - with their dad now but should be back with me tomorrow. I also have pets at home - teen has been back to the house to feed them this weekend (I came down yesterday) but if teen stays at dad's if I stay here after tomorrow it will be a pita for them to be going back and fore to mine while also going to college - no buses go those ways and teen is 16 (doesn't have a bike). Could stay at mine but think dad would question it as he knows what's happened - would be odd teen choosing to stay at mine when I'm not there.

Then there is the fact that I can't cope with my mum's house. It's filthy and stinks of smoke even though she doesn't some and my dad has been in hospital 3 weeks. God knows where I would sleep - it's 3 beds but I just don't want to get into any of them! And I really don't want to shower there either. I know it sounds harsh but it's the truth. It's how it was growing up too and is one of the reasons I'm low contact. At the moment dad isn't in a private room so I couldn't stay in the hospital all night anyway, but, despite not really wanting to be there at the moment of his death, I actually think I would prefer to be there than at the house. But he's on the ward and they say he's a priority to move but obviously can't say when a room will be available.

Then another thing is my mum is not even at the hospital for more than a couple of hours a day. It's a bit odd really. I'm here on my own with my dad when my mum is actually close to him and I'm not. I'm not even sure why I am here - we weren't close and he's not conscious - did seem to acknowledge when I arrived yesterday, which I'm glad about, but they then upped the morphine and he's been out of it since. I'm not sure why I'm here but I can't just go home and pretend it's not happening. I had pretty much decided if he gets into a private room I will stay there, hoping (that sounds wrong and I really don't mean to be crass) that it won't be much past the weekend. I know I will have to stay with my mum a night or two afterwards, which I am dreading...

If he's not in a private room within a couple of hours then I am going home and will plan to come back by tomorrow lunchtime, but that will mean he'll be alone until around 10.30am, which is when my mum comes. If he passes between those times he will do so alone. Is that awful?

I haven’t read the whole thread. My DM died last December. She’d has incurable secondary cancer for five years and lived in a nursing home for the last 18 months of her life. We were so close. I adored her. Obviously I sat with her while she died - we went through everything together and there was no way I’d leave her alone for the last “journey” of her existence on this planet. She had a peaceful passing and it was as good as it could possibly be. But it scarred me. Please do t feel you have to do it for someone if they aren’t your “ride or die” person. It’s changed me.

I think unless you come from a complicated family, you perhaps can't comprehend this stuff.

I hope you will be alright OP. I spent years and years trying to be a good daughter. I wasn't there for either of them when they died.
Be kind to yourself.

It must be so hard OP. I get why you are conflicted.

If it were me, I would say my goodbyes and head home. You sitting there is not going to change the outcome of anything other than a level of guilt you might carry down the track.

I see you are worried what people might think. My advice would be don't explain other than to tell your boss he rallied and you would prefer to keep busy at work and visit after hours.

Best wishes and take care OP.

Yes but apparently this is v common it’s just people are told it’s peaceful to be kind, which is why I asked for any medical people to comment. I think nowadays if cancer/morphine involved it “seems” peaceful but apparently eyes wide open stare etc is pretty common or absolute fighting to “escape” in last moments. I say this from what elderly relatives used to say from their memories when death at home was the norm for them as children. We sanitize everything nowadays. OP I’d 100 not be there!!

Whatever you do you, stay at the hospital or go home you don't know how it will hit you. Do they not have a relatives room?

The ward my mum was on had compassionate visiting and be fare all the other patients were OK with me being there as I'm quiet and was focused on her. She got moved to a side room and I got to stay with her around the clock with the use of the relatives room. Difference being we had a brilliant relationship. It's only 12 days ago and the guilt is hitting hard despite knowing I did everything I could to help her.

It is completely random. Dying is something we have no control over, there is no timing involved.

My dad wished he hadn't been with his mum, who he was close to, when she passed as he said it was awful and he couldn't remember what she was like before as clearly. When his sister was dying in hospital he didn't go for the same reason.

@lurchersforever I think of you do need to go back, stay in a Premier Inn or somewhere similar, that you know will be clean and free from memories.
I wouldn't worry about work. They don't need to know the details of why you are back, I wouldn't worry what they think. If you feel you do need to say anything, just say it could be any day now or you have said your goodbyes

Hi Op.

My dad died today so it felt I should comment on your post.

Myself and my brother were alternating turns at the hospital since Monday. We always had someone with him once palliative care started with the morphine driver (save for something like a vending machine/ toilet break) because for us we didn't feel comfortable with the thought of him dying alone. But it sounds like something yourself and your mum are comfortable with potentially happening so that's okay. The vigil for six days was not easy between two.

You need to do whatever feels tolerable for you and for living with it afterwards I think. For instance my brother asked if I wanted to be called back if my dad died and I said I had no need to see his body once he'd gone, for me the thought of him being alone wasn't ok but the thought of not seeing his body had no feeling one way or the other for me. Everyone is different in what will feel ok and that's ok too.

I think its important to take steps to make this as comfortable for your mum too if you can. I had a bit of an odd relationship with my dad at times but the vigil has been very therapeutic for me and I'm glad on the back end I did it and did as much of it. I didn't feel right staying in my dads house so we booked cheap hotel rooms when we needed to sleep. Thankfully they are still low season rates.

I wouldn't hold out too much hope for a private room. We were on standby for one for six days, they said infectious patients will take priority every time. It's the end of winter and there is still a higher need for them for infectional control right now. Our hospital was able to offer hostel beds on site at £50/ night.

My dad passed at 9am today. And had no fluids for six days. The signs the last two days that we were close was his jaw moving when he was breathing in and his whole upper body jerking with the breathing too.

The main reason I was glad someone was there all the time was we could keep track of things like personal care/ him being moved in the bed/ get his position adjusted if he was coughing/ ask for tops up of sedation if there were any signs of agitation/ give oral gel every two hours through the night. Whether he knew we were there or not I feel we were able to help with his comfortable passing and knowing that is helping me to cope now. It's more than just the presence of another being. Sitting there in the early hours stroking his shoulder and thinking through all the good and bad things that came to my mind was its own kind of therapy.

I'm sorry for your loss. Difficult relationship or not its still a parent and that feels big even so.

You need to do what is right for you, OP. Look after yourself.

When MIL became too ill to be at home, she demanded to not be left alone for a minute. That meant two months of FIL sitting by her side and DH being there every spare moment so FIL could go home, shower & sleep/eat. A couple of relatives helped out, SIL turned up for an hour on weekends. It made her passing incredibly traumatic for all involved - and a relief when she finally died. The sound of her dying still haunts DH. He didn't want to be there, but felt obligated. The DC were affected by their father never being at home longer than to eat.

MIL was oblivious the last couple of weeks. She wouldn't have known if anyone was there or not.

Hello fellow lurcher fan! I am so sorry you are in this situation - it's incredibly hard.

My beloved dad passed a few months ago, in a similar situation, receiving palliative care only, though he was at home. My mom, brother and I spent most of the last week with him, and I was with him the whole of the last morning - though he couldn't speak by then I believe my presence have him comfort (we were very close, especially towards the end). I was on the bed with him when he passed and the others were in the room with us.

It brings me great comfort to know I was with him when I passed - however my relationship was very different from what you describe.

None of us can tell you what you do, or dream of judging you for your choices. You must do as your heart disctatea.

But I can only tell you that, Hellish as it was (I do feel quite traumatised still by the whole experience), I do feel good now about the fact I was at least with him at the end. It may be that this will comfort you in the future, if you do decide to stay.

But you must do what feels right for you at this time, and only you know what it is.

I am, again, so sorry you are in this hard situation.

I lost my mum last Tuesday, she had been in hospital & then a home for the last 5 months. My brother had visited on Monday, the staff put her to bed early as she was falling asleep, went in to check on her during the night & realised she was slipping away, they called my brother but she had gone just before they arrived. Dying isn't an exact science, your dad will go when he is ready. Don't feel guilty for not being there 24/7, you need to prioritise yourself & your family as well, you need your strength & energy for afterwards.

People often seem to wait until no one is in the room with them to die. So I dont think you have to put yourself out to try and be there.

When my mother was in a Hospice my OH sat with her through the day when I had to work and then I joined him when I finished work.. We went home to have a meal and the phone rang to say she had died, when we got back to the Hospice one of the staff said that it's quite common for a person to die when they were on their own, in some cases their family member had just gone to the loo.

@Chenecinquantecinq I am sorry to read this was your and your relatives experience. I worked for a good few years in palliative and end of life care as a nurse. With children and adults. With those who had morphine and other medications and those who did not. I do not recognise your/ your relatives description of how someone is just before they die.
No one can really tell the op what to do can we?
All our experiences and the way we process are so different.
I hope you find a way op. Bear in mind it does not matter what work thinks or what anyone else thinks. Take care.

I buried Mum on Thursday

She spent a month in hospital, her first few weeks were grand, she was on a ward, had company and 24/7 care

I got called Friday morning to come. I sat with mum till 3am Sunday morning

Those last few hours were in Macmillan and I couldn't have done it without their support

Mums rattle lasted 11 hours and was so loud they came in and aspirated her - for the comfort of those on the unit

It wasnt easy, esp as I was alone, but now as I get condolences everywhere, I can say mum never suffered nor was she alone

And that comforts me

Do what you have to do. I refuse to sit beside any bedside. I will make the exception for my mum but that's it, what every you chose to do not what you think you have to do xxx

There's no right or wrong OP, just do whatever will allow you to be at peace with yourself in the future.

Haven’t read the thread, but wanted to let you know OP that so many people pass alone - often when their visitors pop out for a few minutes, so don’t be concerned about him being alone in his last moments - many people seem, in the end, to prefer it that way

You need to do what you can cope with and what you feel you need to do. You'll get an instinct. It may or may not be governed by how close-contact you are.

My father died last year. He went downhill very quickly. As per his wish, we got him home that evening and he died the next morning. I hadn't felt the need to come home from work early- in fact I'd stayed a bit late to tie up and handover - and I'd eaten and sorted stuff out at my own home before I drove over to my parents. I'm orderly by nature and I needed that time to be organised and also to do something normal and gather myself before heading into a deathbed. I hadn't needed to be there to see him home, but I wouldn't have missed being with my parents later that night, even though dad wasn't conscious because it was the last time we'd be together as a family. My husband came in the middle of the night to support us. I needed him to support my mum in ways I couldn't. I think we all had about 90 minutes of sleep.

As with others, he went in the early hours. Mum went for a cup of tea. I don't know if he could still hear- and he was hard of hearing anyway, but I certainly believe he waited for me to come back from a nap and for my mum to leave the room. I told her - she didn't have to find him. Too many people choose to find that sliver of time they're alone for it to be coincidental.

It was the most natural thing in the world for me to sit with him and play music and keep him company whilst we waited for the Dr and to be with him through that. But as soon as my husband spotted the undertaker, I vanished. I didn't need to see that. Instinct took me away. My husband supported my mum through it. I can cope with memories of those final hours both before and after he died, and yes, I do recall the visual but I also easily remember my dad as he was in life. I know if I'd seen him leave, that would've been too much for me and indelible.

You'll just feel your way through OP. Do what you can cope with.

It’s such a deeply personal thing, you can only try and do what’s right for you in the moment. Try to think what would give future you the most comfort after this is over, or what would cause you the most regret.

I can only comment on my personal experience and to echo a previous post, being there for my dad’s final moments was serene, profoundly moving and comforting in a way I could never have imagined beforehand and I can’t really explain. We didn’t have a complex relationship though and he’d had dementia for a long time. I’d made peace with not being there if I’d popped out for whatever reason but I’m very very glad I was, after a long and difficult three weeks of end of life care at home.

And a huge thank you to all of those involved in end of life care; you’re all incredible.

Yes you have to do what you feel is best. You know yourself the best and what will be best for you in the long term.

I'm a nurse and we always respect the adult children of dying parents. The no contact / low contact children always have good reasons for the separation.

I'm in nursing and medications given near time of death are to ease the dying person's suffering, especially work of breathing, agonal breathing, secretions, etc

If you research near death experiences or hospice nurses' experiences

People who are dying experience visions towards the end - they talk to and see people who have passed and locations where they used to live

I think the eyes wide open is them seeing these visions

I'm so grateful to everyone for sharing their experiences. They've all made me feel less alone.

I've come home now but I think I will probably go back tomorrow. I stayed at a hotel last night and will probably do so again if I stay overnight.

Someone mentioned about my mum not caring about me or me about her - I do think she does and so do I. I suppose my dad did in his way too. It was just a bit fucked up really. My dad had a very difficult relationship with his mother too, which wasn't his fault.

I was a carer for many years, people often wait until they are alone to die.

It won’t take weeks if he’s not eating or drinking.