To think most people would judge keeping this money

[JustAnotherWhinger]

Legally this person is perfectly entitled to keep the money. That’s not the debate. The debate is they are very offended that a few people (several of their family and some friends) have judged them for doing so as morally is very off.

A joint account was set up with a large amount of money (over 25k) between a person who was dying and their cousin. The reason for this was because their cousin had agreed to be guardian for their 3yo child. It was to ensure there was plenty of money about until things like pensions, insurances and probate were all sorted and in place.

However, after 8 weeks living with the Mum and DC the cousin realised they were not cut out to look after a 3yo.

The 3yo is now settled with their mum’s cousin from the other side of the family (in the interest of honesty - that cousin is me). They have contact with the original person one day a month. They are settled here and everything is all settled legally.

When our cousin died a very short time after (literally a few weeks) the joint account transferred solely to her cousin. That’s the legal position and legally it’s their money. However, a couple of their relatives (I don’t even really know them well) are now kicking up a stink about the fact they’ve still got the money and haven’t given it to us to care for the DC or put the money into an account in the DC’s name.

I was asked my opinion and said imo most people would judge that the money was for looking after the child so shouldn’t be kept by the original planned carer.

I’m not over fussed as we don’t need the money and the DC was well set up by their Mummy.
However, I do think it’s poor character to have kept it.

and for clarity - they are not over short of money. They didn’t give up or change their job in the plans to care for the DC (childcare was booked). There’s been no financial disadvantage to them.

@Itsmetheflamingo I think you must live in a sad world where you think that many people who are financially comfortable would essentially steal money that a deceased relative had given them to look after the deceased’s small child. Anyone who does what evil cousin has done is pretty much a psychopath in my opinion.

@JustAnotherWhinger OK, I stand corrected. however in a marriage isn't a joint account 50/50 ?

This. Ask nicely then a solicitor letter. It’s probably not worth incurring much cost to purse £25k but it’s the principle.

I’d absolutely judge the other cousin. What a low, unforgivable thing to do.

and, to be honest, I’d judge the child’s relatives if they don’t pursue this.

I wouldn’t judge you because you are obviously a good hearted person who’s got the child long term welfare and well-being at the top of your priorities. But there are obviously other relatives around who could take this on for the sake of the child.

someone should be asking the estate’s executor to pursue this with a frank letter suggesting the other cousin to ‘do the right thing’.

Of course it is morally abhorrent.
Your cousin's cousin is a disgrace.
Absolutely you should formally ask for the money to be placed in an account, solely in the childs name.
You should of course acknowledge the familys outrage as correct, and tell them you have asked for it to be returned.
Shame them.

It’s pretty awful behaviour.

If questioned, I suspect the cousin would claim that there were some costs associated with the 8 weeks she spent living with the mum and child, and that furthermore she intends to spend the money on her monthly visits with the child, taking them out places and buying them treats and so on. For the next 25 years, presumably.

@JustAnotherWhinger I find it hard to believe that anyone would think that what evil cousin has done is acceptable. The only possible situation in which it would be understandable would be if evil cousin was destitute, and OP was minted. And OP you’ve already said that isn’t the case.

It’s very straightforward. Imagine if you’re having some building work done in your house, so you give the builder £25k to do the work. The builder turns up, works for half a day, then announces that actually he doesn’t want to do the job after all. Would anyone seriously think it was OK for him to keep the £25k?!

Maybe, just maybe, the dying Mum - who seemed to have done everything possible to secure a safe and loving home for her dear child - might have been too overwhelmed by the person backtracking on the agreement, and then, probably, and maybe desperately, trying to find someone else in the family who she would be able to trust to never give up on her child. I can only imagine how disappointing that was for the Mum, and I expect that by that time she might not have been able to think very clearly about all the problems that that would then cause. The poor mother was probably also in a lot of physical pain, or under the influence of a lot of Morphine, or similar - which scrambles your brain - that by the time she was told that her original choice of someone to look after her child, in her, the mother's place, had changed her mind, and would not become her child's guardian, or her carer, after all?

So, I think that you are being rather harsh and judgemental about the Mum@Brewtiful, as even when she first found out about her illness - if it wasn't something she had lived with all her life - her symptoms would have almost certainly made her very scared, and when she realised that her diagnosis was terminal, she must have been terried for her daughter. In my eyes, the Mum was brilliant at managing to get so much sorted out for her cherished daughter, and I am very glad that the originally chosen guardian realised before the Mum died, that she couldn't take on such an enormous commitment to the child, as that at least gave the Mum the chance to find someone else she could entrust her dearest child to.

@JustAnotherWhinger, thank you so very much - from the village - for taking on this difficult, but hopefully very rewarding commitment - which is probably the hardest, and most challenging and important responsibility, that anyone could ever take on. You are an amazing person, and you deserve all things good going forward in your and your family's life. The person who has kept that money is awful for doing so, and as well as giving it back for the child's sake, I think she needs to do so for her own sake too, unless she is a psychopath who will never feel any guilt over what she has done. Thank you again OP. 🩷 xxx

I wonder what you were looking for from the thread @JustAnotherWhinger . As your title acknowledges, most people would judge this behaviour. You say you’re not overly bothered about it and don’t need the money. So I’m just curious, what are you looking for from the thread?

Double post.

No. Any one person in a joint account can access and spend all the funds in a joint account.

Can I also add OP that it’s really good of you to look after this poor child. I’m glad she’s got someone kind in her life.

This is absolutely deplorable of the cousin in receipt of the joint account funds.

They 100% know that money was for the benefit of the child in question. Absolutely no shade to them that they have been unable to provide a home for the child once reality hits, but absolutely vile that they haven't sent the money to follow the child!

OP you should definitely ask for the money, and if you don't need it you need to tell them to transfer it to the child (you could fill their 2026 ISA allowance, then in April they could also fill the 26-27 ISA allowance for the child, and if there is any left over then put it in a private pension in the child's name which can also been done in a relatively tax efficient manner).

The money is to benefit the child and quite honestly the other cousin who still has the cash should be utterly ashamed of themselves for stealing from a bereaved child!

No. How many time does this need to be explained?

Money in a joint account belongs 100% to both named people. Either person can withdraw all of the money and refuse to share any and it is not theft. If one person dies, the other person gets all of it because that’s how joint accounts work. There is no 50/50.

Splitting money in a marriage comes from divorce.

I would imagine in this situation a very carefully written will was written ?
what did the will say re the child and care of the child in the future. ?
Either way the money should be transferred immediately to the OP caring for the child. Failing that I would be instructing a barrister after talking to police.

This cousin sounds like an absolute disgrace across a number of levels.

She agreed to do something she had clearly not thoroughly thought through causing untold chaos and upset for a dying woman who went from thinking she had her child's future sorted to having to deal with sorting out a new plan in days when the previous one had been months in the making. While bad, that may be excusable, if she wasn't now holding onto the money that was intended to care for that child. Together these things show her to be an absolute vile person.

I would certainly be gradually withdrawing those monthly visits if it is doable without any upset to an already traumatised child!

In the short term, I would play your cards close to your chest - don't let your feelings be known to other family members just yet.

Write to the cousin, perhaps via the solicitor, or at the very least via special delivery post with a copy via email with delivery and read receipts switched on, asking her to return the money so that it can be used for what it was intended.

If she returns it, let family know that it has returned and remain dignified by keeping your opinion of she originally behaved to yourself.

If she refuses, go scorched earth - make sure absolutely everyone on her side of the family as well as friends, neighbours and acquaintances know that not only has she kept the money, but has actually refused a formal request to return it, thus effectively denying the dying wish of a mother and stealing from an orphaned toddler!

I think they could have held back 2k to cover expenses during the 8 weeks and given the rest to the now carer of the 3 year old.

Personally I’d ask them to move the money across to a savings account for the child.

Wow what a grabby this woman

I'd go in gently by saying you're setting up a savings account or trust fund or something and give her opportunity to save face by putting the money in eg. "Thank you for holding on to child's money, I was thinking we could invest it like this ...."

If she won't return it, absolutely shame her all ways.

I would ask the cousin for the money.

Something along the lines of "I understand xx gave you some money to look after DC before she died. Since the situation with DC changed so quickly and we have all been caught up with grief, you might not have thought about how to send the money back. Since I am now looking after DC, can you send it to me and my bank details are xxx.

The main image I'm getting I'd your poor cousin in her last days,knowing that the planned carer for her child had fallen through.. that's so upsetting to think of. How on earth was this the person deemed suitable.. 😔
For a yone ever in a similar situation, a trust family account can be set up on a regular bank account which allows a trusted person to help a person with finances etc, on a trust basis only. It is v clear that the account holder owns the money.
Shame on this person. I woukd think the vast majority would be shamed into returning it when confronted, if they thought to do such a thing in the first place.

But that wasn’t what was intended by the deceased. It was to be USED by the person looking after the child for expenses incurred in doing so.

I totally agree.

What kind of documentation, such as emails or verbal testimony from relatives or others, exist to support that the mother had intended the money to be used for the child’s upbringing?

Also, it isn’t clear what has been done, if anything, to persuade the cousin to pass the money to @JustAnotherWhinger or transfer it to an account in the child’s name.

The OP says that there is plenty of other money as the mum planned well, so they don’t need this for the child now. It was intended to make sure funds were available while probate was sorted and inheritance handed out, just to make sure the child was provided for during that time. OP didn’t need it though.

But it is money from that child’s mum so should go to the child. It was never intended for the cousin to use for themselves. I’d put it into a savings account for the kid since they didn’t get access to this money while it was actually needed (to cover the gap waiting for inheritance).

We don’t need the money, and tbh the DC doesn’t need it as their mummy left them well set up, but the more I think of it the more the principle of it annoys me.

I had a very odd childhood (abusive parents, brought up by grandparents) so it was mostly double checking that actually my thinking is the ‘norm’ and not clouded by my childhood and not influenced by people who are very, y, very angry at her for her change of heart over caring for the DC.

People’s opinions matter a lot to the person in question so knowing that my opinion is the same as the majority gives me good food for thought on how I will approach it (and I definitely will approach it now I think).