DD’s birthday was an utter disaster

[bendmeoverbackwards]

It’s DD’s 19th birthday today. She’s ASD and has been out of education for a few years.

Last couple of birthdays have been disappointing to her and I know this one brought up a lot of emotion not just about birthdays but also her situation in general.

I asked her a few weeks ago if she wanted to see a particular show and a meal at a steak place. She just said no but gave no other suggestions. I then asked last week of she wanted just a meal out and where - no response. So I decided to book a local restaurant just in case as Saturday nights get busy, with the option of cancelling if she didn’t want to.

When I told her, she wasn’t happy and said she couldn’t do it now because I’d chosen it (autistic brain). I asked where else she’d like to go but didn’t get a reply. I suggested a takeaway, took hours of questions about this, she didn’t see a takeaway as a birthday celebration. She eventually decided on pizza.

I also got her a beautiful personalised cake. Last year for her 18th, I got her a nice chocolate cake with her name on but it didn’t have the same personalisation as her older sister’s 18th birthday cake (which was celebrated in lockdown so I pushed the boat out a bit). Also the board base was accidentally thrown out when there was a tiny bit of chocolate left on it. She complained about this for months. I said I would buy her an extra cake (cheapy supermarket cake) but I forgot.

Now she says she can’t have this year’s cake because of the lack of the other one and it would be in the wrong order (autistic brain again).

Choosing presents is also difficult for her so I chose a few small gifts and paid in £50 birthday money into her account. She didn’t like this either, she wanted to choose her own presents (but from past experience she takes ages to choose, months and months, so I thought I’d make it easier by giving her money).

Written down, I realise she sounds like a spoilt brat. But I didn’t do some things that I said I would eg buy her an additional cake and take her for a belated birthday meal (from last year).

The evening ended with her sobbing in the kitchen and me losing my temper 😢

Why can’t she?
Is it because it’s in the ‘wrong order’?
What does she think will happen if she breaks the order?

If this is genuinely a problem for her it sounds like OCD. It can be treated with CBT and SSRIs.

Inaction is a choice too of course. Leaving the cake to go stale is a choice. So either way she’s choosing…but she still may not feel able to eat it.

If it is OCD she may get very distressed to see it cut and eaten out of sequence? It all depends what’s going on in her head. You might be able to guage this OP and then either quietly remove the cake or go ahead and share it among the rest of the family as pps have suggested. The former might be better than the latter if she thinks that something terrible will happen if it’s eaten now. Or does it just feel wrong? I think the why she can’t eat it is important, but not sure if she’s sharing that with you.

I also think you have to stop looking at her behaviour through the forgiving lens of “autistic brain”.

The problem her isn’t her autism. The problem is that she is a highly manipulative and controlling bully. This is how you should be assessing her behaviour and deciding how to respond.

So she wants you to keep the cake out? She’s trying to manipulate you and make you feel bad.

She tells you how disappointed she is that you got the cakes “wrong”? Ditto.

She only wants to deal with you and tells your DH to fuck off? Bullying and controlling.

That should be your starting point, not her autism. It will be much easier then for you to see that you have no reason to feel guilty, and no reason to avoid making decisions which are in everyone’s best interests (including hers).

Ok so let’s take her word she can’t eat it. Time to give it to someone who can - I suggest a food bank as I expect seeing family eat it will stress her out whatever her reason for leaving it alone.

Sorting out the presents I suggest means putting them in the attic if you have space. Clear the space. Clean start. No grudges on either side. No recriminations on either side.

Disagree with this. Autism does mean that executive function is impaired and things like managing time/tasks related to organising a present/card [the latter means going into a shop, choosing one, dealing with crowds and the social interaction involved etc] can be a challenge, especially if ND person is not in a great place.

Making a cake, going to all that effort, was an incredibly lovely thing to do. Mine will sometimes do things like this and it is deeply touching and very much appreciated.

Rejecting and dismissing the gesture is ‘giving back the same energy’ as they say on MN, whereas being deeply appreciative of the effort and thought of making the cake is modelling the behaviours OP is hoping to see her DD adopt.

THIS!!!

I 100% agree with this.

I said in an earlier comment that her behaviour since diagnosis confirms said diagnosis completely.

DD3 needs to acknowledge that, and that her mum did not tell lies to bring about a wrong diagnosis.
She needs to accept that she is autistic, and develop strategies for moving through life.

There’s a podcast called ADHD Chatter -would she listen to this -he’s just done one on Rejection Sensitivity Dysphoria which I would guess is why she gets so upset.

Take it into work! She’s made it clear she’s not going to eat it so jusssu take it to work and tell her she made it clear you wasted your tome money and effort and worn bother doing that again! End of conversation!!! If she behaves like this she gets punished but not having a cake end of! Make it clear that this is HER consequences for HER t and HER decision that has ended up with the cake being donated to work and all the crap she spouting you don’t want to hear any more!!!

Can the rest of you eat the cake and freeze her a slice? Cake freezes quite well - and if it's not quite as nice when its defrosted, that's a life lesson. But she can eat her portion at her leisure that way, and the rest of you can demolish the rest of it. If she wants to sit and look at her sad slice in the freezer to infinity - that's on her.

(Have an AuDHD DD so remember some of the self-sabotage very well).

Her response was ‘no’ so I’ve asked her for a solution. But I don’t know what to do with this bloody cake if she doesn’t have a suggestion

You have already been given plenty of suggestions upthread for what to do about the cake! Pick one, and go with it. See what happens. Use the cake to trial a new approach.

It's funny - you want us to give you exactly the right solution, same as DD wants you to give her the right solution. But in the end you do have to pick something that looks reasonable and try it. We can't guarantee it for you.

I agree with this.

The cake is something she can project her other feelings on. She is disappointed with the cake, focusing on that and controlling everyones reactions and behaviour around the cake. By doing this, she doesn't have to think about bigger, more abstract concerns like her disappointment at her life not being what she wants. The cake is easier to obsess and tantrum about, than which course or job she should go for.

The cake is just a cake. Treat it as everyone else in society treats a cake - a food treat to celebrate a birthday, in a flavour the birthday girl likes. Ahe gets a piece, everyone gets a piece, it's done. If she's disappointed by the cake, that's fine. Small disappointments are a part of life. I often order dessert and an disappointed by it. She needs to go through the process of being disappointed and dealing with those feelings without lashing out or blaming others. Once she can do that, she will be better placed to tackle other disappointments and pressures.

She's currently dealing with any pressure (e.g birthday pressure) or disappointment (e.g birthday disappointment) by avoiding, blaming and controlling. She needs to learn how to deal with it better. You are trying to remove the pressure and disappointment and pressure so she doesn't feel any negative emotions, but she NEEDS to feel them so she can learn how to handle them in an appropriate way.

It's ok if she is disappointed and dissatisfied. Those are normal feelings, serve up the birthday cake and don't respond to her unhelpful responses, she needs to learn not to do this. That way, she can slowly develop strategies to help her tackle bigger negative feelings, like her lack of A levels, and move forwards

No. She is deciding she CAN'T. It is her choice. Choosing that she CAN might cause her discomfort, but it is possible.

Someone who really can’t help themself from acting in this way is surely completely unsuitable as a babysitter for young children. What happens when the child does something illogical or completely unexpected, as young children do? If your DD can control herself enough to cope with that sort of thing, she can control herself enough to cope with a cake that’s not the one she wanted - if she chooses to.

I'm afraid I think you are pandering to her and encouraging her in this ridiculous behaviour. It isn’t doing her any favours - she has to learn to live with the rest of the world.

I like the advice that doing nothing is a choice too she’s making.
I don’t think there’s a difference between doesn’t want to or can’t.
It’s a very odd set up with the cake and gives her a lot of power and puts a lot of pressure on her.
Cakes are served on a birthday. I might say to young adult dd should we do cake now in the afternoon or after tea but a cake is to be enjoyed by all the family.
If she didn’t want it on her birthday it’s fair game for other people in family to enjoy it. Just save her a slice in case she does fancy it. I wouldn’t entertain any nonsense of you ate my cake. A cake is to be enjoyed and shared not go stale on the side.
I’d casually say this evening did you decide about the cake. If she says no just say ok and the other 4 of you have some. I’d save her a slice and probably freeze the rest. I wouldn’t donate it as she’s said no to that (and I don’t think food bank would want a few days old handmade cake).
Giving her power and endless choices isn’t working. You know with toddlers you give them limited choices you don’t say what do you want to drink you say choose milk or water I’d adopt a similar approach even though she’s 19.

Disagree with a PP about trying to hammer home your belief that she is autistic if she doesn’t believe so at this point in her life. It’s clearly not a point where you’re going to be productive so instead I would be saying - let’s make a plan for you to get a job or training towards a future job. If she says she can’t, ask her to give you one good reason that she can’t do that. Be kind but help her out of her pit.

Basically if she thinks there is nothing up with her/different about her then take her at her word - and crack on accordingly as you would with one of your other children.

One thing I wanted to add was that sometimes these nudges can come better from a friend or sibling - someone the autistic person looks up to or likes. More than once I’ve seen one comment from a non parent result in a change of viewpoint where years of parental conversations have made no difference. Who might that be for your girl?

I’ve given her till 9pm tonight to make a decision about the cake, if not then I will. I’ve already decided that the family will have some and I’ll freeze the rest.

Im also making a trip home at lunchtime to hide it in the mean time as it occurred to me she could possibly bin it in an act of defiance.

All this drama! It’s totally making me see the ridiculous-ness of the situation.

I've given her till 9pm tonight to make a decision about the cake, if not then I will. I’ve already decided that the family will have some and I’ll freeze the rest.

Sensible.

Im also making a trip home at lunchtime to hide it in the mean time as it occurred to me she could possibly bin it in an act of defiance.

Not so sensible.That's her making a decision. It's her cake, who cares if she bins it? Don't waste your time going home. OK, you don't like food waste, but you are going all the way home just to stop her throwing it away? That's you making drama.

Well done Op. I think if she does do something to sabotage it, just say 'that's a shame, I bought that to celebrate your birthday' and then do not enter any more discussions about cakes until next year, when you ask her what cake she would like for her birthday again.

Also have a chat with your DH so you can both be on the same page, and present a united front

Good point about how she might listen to others.
I go on about girlguiding but it can be a massive positive for girls and women especially those who feel they are different.
If she likes children then she could look at volunteering there’s all age groups from 4 to 18. So could be doing crafts with little rainbows or more like an older sister to 14-18 rangers. Lots of leaders are autistic/adhd and lots of the girls. People are generally very tolerant and understanding, my other leader is a lot younger than me and has shared her diagnosis with me and I’m a mentor/friend to her, she talks to me about work issues etc. She might realise she’s not alone and odd one out.

Hard as it is I wouldn’t go home. If she bins it it is her making a decision which you asked her to do. My bet is she will do nothing and it’s going stale on side as a stick to beat you with about how mean you were getting the wrong sort of cake.

I wouldn't ever offer a cake again after cake gate.

No chance ASD or not.

She said "no"
And that's it? Wow. She is the boss of you, the despot. I would say to her that as she can't cope with cakes on her birthday there will be no more cakes. She is very welcome to bake one herself if she wishes to contribute.

From your responses OP, it feels like you are pandering to her too much. I think you need to start giving her deadlines to do things and don't let her wallow. By letting her take time and not make decisions, you are allowing her to ruin her life. Shes still young and has the chance to sort out her future, but letting her sit and complain and blame you, is not moving forward.

I think you need to toughen up. Tell her she had to enroll in a course starting September. Foundation course maybe. Just something. Or she will be stuck in the same rut into her 20s and won't be moving forward. You might feel mean doing it, but I doesn't matter. She will be thankful eventually when she starts to do something with her life and starts to succeed.

Hi Op.
I have similar with my dd. Just want to know you are not alone.
I appreciate the thread has moved on. My sister and I are debating. Both ND.

Was she upset because you threw the cake out as there was a bit left? or that you threw the board out ( which was special for her 18th) and you have kept the older sisters board?

It's just occurred to me that we, as a family with 2 diagnosed autistic young people and at least one undiagnosed parent, gave up on birthday cake years ago.

It never became a battle but the children didn't enjoy the ceremony of lighting candles (possibly too much attention) and never even accept cake at family birthday parties.

So I'm wondering now if cake is just something that it is commonly difficult for autistic people to handle.

it is a bit sad not to have cake, but it's just not worth it in our family.

Honestly if she throws it in the bin I’d take that as a weird win - she’s moved on from “Mama fix it” to sorting it for herself. Don’t mention it just move on too.

One thing that occurred to me is all this unloved cake and presents sitting around is meant to act as a visible reminder that You Messed Up. The longer it’s around for the more you will get the message that you have done wrong and you’ll put up with your punishment. That needs to end now. Well done for taking the first step.

I didn’t go home. I’ll find out after work if shes done anything with the cake. Probably not but I can’t abide food waste so wanted to avoid that.

Shes sent a few messages - you said you’d sort it (the cake), you ‘have to be nice’. I’m sick of being bloody nice.

You will see that the last few years have left me a bit broken and lacking in confidence and insight. But I’m determined to get that back now.

I do worry about the effect of my new attitude on her mental health, I’m pretty sure she’ll see it as her ‘losing’ me. But I have to look longer term.

Thbak you to you all, I wish I could personally thank you ❤️