To emigrate knowing it will devastate my mum?

[tangotingo]

I’m breaking my heart over this as I know deep down I want to go but it will break my mum’s heart.

Been with my partner 4 years, we are engaged to be married next year. I’m pregnant with our first baby. I’m British, partner is from Eastern Europe and his family have settled all over the place (he has relatives in Canada, his home country, Germany and Scandinavia).

His younger sister lives in Germany and has lived there a few years now. She has a partner. They are settled in a lovely small town there which is very safe. They only work hospitality jobs there but have a lower cost of living - they live off one partner’s wage and save the rest. They are considering moving to Hamburg for more job opportunities. They are at a very similar age and life stage to us and are also expecting their first baby. There is a particular industry in Hamburg which is very big and similar to what my partner does for work in the UK, don’t want to go into more detail as it’s quite niche but we’ve seen that one particular large firm encourages foreigners to apply if they have a relevant skillset. I would struggle a bit more as my skills are administrative/customer service so I’d likely end up being a stay-at-home parent whilst learning German. My job in the UK is only a call centre role so it’s not like I’d be giving up a career, so I’m willing to do it so long as we can afford to live. Partner’s sister is confident you can live on one wage over there, and also says she knows a firm that is easy to get into without speaking German as she has helped friends from her own country get in there, so she says she could help us get in their initially if we wanted whilst we’re settling.

I feel, probably quite selfishly, that there is nothing for me in the UK. My parents had me in their 40s, I’m in my 20s now and they are in their 60s. They are full-time carers to my autistic brother who is 25 and they refuse to take any steps to prepare him for the fact that they won’t always be around. He is verbal but doesn’t work, he doesn’t even have a mobile phone as he refuses one and they just accept it. My dad is a hoarder and I hate visiting their home as it stresses me out. I have half-siblings on my dad’s who are 20 years older than me and don’t care about me despite my efforts to have a relationship (I’ve attempted to meet them on their birthdays etc to not even receive a text on mine).

I have dealt with so much anxiety over the years about how care for my parents and brother is likely to all fall on to me in the future as my parents age (my half siblings have no interest). I live an hour drive away as when I met my partner I moved to a different city to be with him. We can’t move to my parent’s city as my partner’s industry doesn’t exist there. I feel absolutely stifled by thoughts of the future. Due to my parents age and being carers they won’t be able to offer me any practical support with my baby. Since I moved an hour away 3 years they’ve visited me less than a handful of times.

Due to large age gaps with my siblings and the fact that my partner has no family in the UK, my child will have no cousins to grow up with except for kids my partner’s sister will have in Germany. I recently have been crying my eyes out as I’ve realised nobody in my family deserves to be godparents to my child, nobody gives a shit enough. We’ve already decided godparents will be partners sister and her partner.

Me and my partner are so lonely and desperate to be around people in a similar life stage. He was quite depressed his last birthday as it fell during a heatwave and he wanted to have a BBQ and realised there was just nobody to really invite so we didn’t bother. It’s getting to him now we’re having a child I think.

Our part of the UK is incredibly rough and our car was stolen a few months ago. I hate the UK rainy grey weather and get seasonal depression, I know Germany is hardly a hot country but the UK is particularly bad due to being an island and we’ve enjoyed many lovely summer BBQs and outdoor parties when visiting Germany previously. I’ve always said no to my partner when he’s suggested moving as I feel bad leaving my parents, but since becoming pregnant I’ve started to want to prioritise baby more and I feel they will be better off if we go to Germany. I only really want 1 child but feel pressure to have 2 if we stay in the UK as I feel the child will be lonely, but it’s different if they will have cousins which they will have in Germany. My, my partner, my partner’s sister and her partner will all be able to support each other.

We have the money to emigrate and get settled - £25,000 in savings. This was originally meant to be a house deposit in the UK but every time we’ve found a home we’ve had to pull out due to the house having major damp issues. Every house in our budget is awful and requires major renovation works. We’ve essentially given up.

I have decided I want to go, I know it won’t be easy to find a rental and jobs etc but I want to at least start the process even if it takes a couple of years. Due to my partner’s EU citizenship I can tag along with him to get residency. I think it’s best for me, my partner and the baby. But I know it will break my mums heart. Can anyone give any insight please? Just to add as well they won’t be able to visit me at all as they are poor, and my dad and brother refuse to travel and mum refuses to leave them.

Mum was worried when I first starting dating someone from another country and said from day 1 “please don’t emigrate.”

Am I a selfish cow?

Sorry I missed you saying your mum wouldn’t travel and I said she could- didn’t see that but til after!

IMO as someone who’s done it, the people with the guts to leave the UK are the ones who can achieve a lot in terms of
career and personal growth. You need creativity, social skills, confidence, curiosity and a bit of cleverness (working things out your own way). It will threaten a lot
of British people who are at heart extremely scared of other places, which is why they threaten with “oh, but what if you break up etc”. More likely to break up with the massive depression and stress of living in the UK when there is somewhere else you could be happier. It will set you apart from British people who’ve never left but it doesn’t sound like you’d miss much anyway.

Oh, also- since Germany is in Europe geographically, holidays are great as you can drive. Much better for long weekends, school half terms etc. Much cheaper too. Also, if you do all the paperwork etc and you do break up from your soon to be DH you will have German law on your side, which is no worse than here and possibly better.

Also- medical system for baby- fantastic.

Just remember 'wherever you go, there you are'. Circumstances don't change you - only you can change yourself. The baby will be a massive life change. It's also a great opportunity to build community through attending baby groups and classes, and later nurseries and school. Better imo than being in a country where you don't speak the language and are relying heavily on someone who may find you rather needy when the time comes.

As for your family issues - you can shoulder the burden (if and when there is one) or not, regardless of whether you're in the UK or a few miles away in Germany. You make it sound like you'd be moving to the dark side of the moon with no prospect for any ongoing communication with people and events at home.

Wait for the birth at least.

No, the alternative is thinking through emigrating from all angles, including the unattractive ones.

You don’t know unless you try! Germany is only a short flight away so it’ll be easy to visit your parents for a weekend almost whenever you want. I emigrated a little further afield (Canada) and am raising to LOs here - I have no regrets. The UK isn’t going anywhere if things don’t work out and you want to move home.

You only get one life. Live it for you and your kids!

I do know. I can get a visa on the back of my partner based on his being an EU citizen, through an EU family reunification scheme. It would be a process and not instant.

I think given you technically have family here, but at the same time you feel that there is nothing for you in the UK - you are not close to your family (and that is of course OK) and you can't stay here for a family you don't feel close to. You'll just end up resenting them even more.

It's the nay-sayers who have lived abroad who are urging caution!

How would you be staying in Germany if you split up ? We’re not in the EU anymore. Its not as simple as just deciding to stay.

If you do go, he needs to be your husband not your partner before you leave the uk. This should be non-negotiable- if you can’t afford a big wedding, do a quick cheap registrery office one and then have the big wedding in a few years time. But be legally married.

Research English groups and ideally mum groups in Hamburg. Start learning German this week. do not fall for the “everyone can speak English” line- dh (before we were married) lived in Germany for a year and while lots of people could speak some English, he said it was akin to saying “well, all British children have French lessons”. They had a bit of English, but most couldn’t hold a conversation in English anymore that most people in the uk can hold a conversation in French.

I’m another one that says do it. Don’t let it be a regret later on that you didn’t give it a go.

Oh and definitely consider getting married first just as immigration and whatnot will be slightly different.

And check carefully about the legalities of having a child there. We found out when we had our baby that if we’d died our baby would go into care as the Uk wouldn’t release a UK citizen to a non Uk citizen so our parents wouldn’t have any rights. We had to sort our will out quickly. Now our friends get custody anyway but at the time we wanted our baby to go to family. It’s just a slight complication worth checking into as immigrating brings up all sorts of random complications.

Your detailed post seems to lead to only one conclusion, that moving is absolutely the right decision for you. It makes absolute sense, and sounds like it would be the best thing for all of you.
Go, do it and don't feel guilty. This is your life - love it how you want! Why would you stay just because you mum would be sad? you don't owe your parents anything and it sounds like there's little effort on their part either way.
It sounds like you're miserable, there is nothing keeping you in the UK, and the prospects in terms of having a good quality of life with supportive family around are much better in Germany.
It's a no brainer.
It's not hard to keep in touch these days no matter where you are, and you can always visit the UK.

Good luck. Don't doubt yourself!

Well, OP, Germany isn't far at all - from the title, I thought you meant Australia! So very easy for your mum to visit. But, fundamentally, you are not responsible for your mother's happiness, so you must do what is best for you and your own family. You would not be unreasonable to move.

However, ...... It concerns me that you say you are lonely and relying on your partner's sister for social contact. Just depending on family members for support and contact is very dangerous. Please, please, wherever you end up living, do make the effort to make some proper friends - you will need them, and they will make your life so much better.

Yes I would definitely look at expat groups within the city 🙂

Please get married to protect yourself now you are having a baby

If you listen to the doomsayers, you’d never do anything. Nobody would ever emigrate just in case they split up with their spouse. Many, many thousands of people emigrate all over the world and make good, successful lives. Saying you're naive because you believe your partner to be a good person is ridiculous-many people have successful marriages with decent people. And I say that as someone who divorced and raised my kids as a single parent. Am now happily remarried. If shit happens in life, you deal with it-but people getting married should be positive about their future spouse!

What you do need to do is be clear eyed about the situation you’ll be in. Do your research on your status-your rights and visa status. The cost of living. Start learning German-maybe with a native speaker who can get you talking. Research the differences-the administrative shit which can be wearing, cultural expectations and the law. I admire the Germans. Children over there are expected and given more responsibility and independence than they are here. Less wrapping in cotton wool. Tenants have better protection-and are used to keeping their property decent. You have access to great countryside. Don’t be surprised if you get homesick after a few months in and start to criticise your new home-this is common among expats so it will help if you are prepared for it and see it as a normal part of adjustment.

Speak to your parents so they are 100% clear on making provision for your brother. As a parent of young adults, I’d never expect one of the to be their sibling’s carer. Your parents have placed a lot of expectation on you and that’s not fair.

Best of luck!

I really feel for you OP. This is a really sad situation all round. My parents had me in their 40s so I have big age gaps with my siblings as well as the rest of the extended family, cousins etc. I grew up pretty much as an only child. Luckily, I have nieces and nephews who are closer in age to me than my siblings which filled that gap and they now have children, otherwise mine wouldn’t have any cousins close to their age and the cycle would’ve repeated so I can totally understand your yearning for family for yourself and for your future children. And it’s a different situation but we lost a sibling through illness and my DF has also been very unwell and a lot of the care has fallen on me but I’m lucky that we are a big family, my DH is brilliant and I have lots of friends who have been amazing. It’s very tough for you not having the support of your half siblings and facing the prospect of caring for your DB alone.

I also really feel for your parents. The hoarding and other things you mentioned sounds like they don’t know how to cope with the situation and have buried their heads in the sand, which is really sad. Is it selfish for your mum to say please don’t emigrate? Yes it is really but I can totally understand her feeling that way. The same way I can totally appreciate why you want to create a better life for yourself. Hopefully you can visit regularly and FaceTime etc so your parents still feel close to you and your child. From the sounds of things, your mum saying about your child going to them for long weekends, she’s hoping for a close relationship and again really, is burying her head in the sand to the reality of the situation and this not being feasible given they care for your brother.

I’m not giving any answers here but just wanted to share that I really empathise with your situation. You’re not being selfish at all. If the loss of my sibling has taught me one thing it’s to try to make the most of life

Apologies if I’m reading it wrong but the eu family reunification scheme, but isn’t that for people wanting to join family in the UK?

I think the grass is probably not greener. I would also worry about not being married and of not being able to bring your child back if you split up.

Girl!!! Run run run!!!!! Take ur partner ur baby and get the hell out and live your life!!! You are not owe anyone anything and you deserve to live the way u want not to worry about anyone else, especially those who don’t give af about u or want you around for
selfish reasons only. Your baby deserves to be with family who will care. Get your passport and go!! Let everyone else run after you for a change. Get ur ducks in a row overseas and then get on that flight! Just think by summer you can be living a totally different life to now! And yes it won’t be easy but hell it will be your choice!! Good luck!!!

@tangotingo Hamburg is great. Move and enjoy life.

I say go. The only thing that sounds worrying about your situation would be if you ended up in Germany divorced or, heaven forbid, widowed, and didn't really have a support net around you. But it doesn't really sound like your net here would be terribly strong here in that case anyway, and actually there would be probably more people trying to drain your time, effort and money. Do check what right to German citizenship you have, and what protections there would be if the worst happened - is there an NHS? What about schooling? Is there a benefits system? Do you have to have lived there a certain length of time before you qualify for support?

I think this is the most important thing to think about. How sure are you that they will welcome you with open arms and allow you to live and work there in the first place? There is no longer freedom of movement in Europe for people from the UK and you might not be allowed to settle there at all.

It sounds like you’re running away. Whicj might be the best thing to do. But i think you need to disentangle ‘not being a carer for your brother’, which you could do in the UK, from ‘starting a new life in Germany’. You need to be comfortable with saying no to your parents either way.

Your mum being devastated isn’t a reason to not emigrate, especially as she hardly visits you now and Germany isn’t very far from the UK anyway. You have to live your life for you.

However, other reasons are things that would concern me, language barrier, your own job opportunities, Germany having issues just like anywhere, this new life being all based on him and his family.

Thats not to say don’t go, but you need to really think about these things and the worst case scenarios, especially what happens if you don’t settle well in Germany and want to leave, or you split up and that is complicated due to having a child.