To emigrate knowing it will devastate my mum?

[tangotingo]

I’m breaking my heart over this as I know deep down I want to go but it will break my mum’s heart.

Been with my partner 4 years, we are engaged to be married next year. I’m pregnant with our first baby. I’m British, partner is from Eastern Europe and his family have settled all over the place (he has relatives in Canada, his home country, Germany and Scandinavia).

His younger sister lives in Germany and has lived there a few years now. She has a partner. They are settled in a lovely small town there which is very safe. They only work hospitality jobs there but have a lower cost of living - they live off one partner’s wage and save the rest. They are considering moving to Hamburg for more job opportunities. They are at a very similar age and life stage to us and are also expecting their first baby. There is a particular industry in Hamburg which is very big and similar to what my partner does for work in the UK, don’t want to go into more detail as it’s quite niche but we’ve seen that one particular large firm encourages foreigners to apply if they have a relevant skillset. I would struggle a bit more as my skills are administrative/customer service so I’d likely end up being a stay-at-home parent whilst learning German. My job in the UK is only a call centre role so it’s not like I’d be giving up a career, so I’m willing to do it so long as we can afford to live. Partner’s sister is confident you can live on one wage over there, and also says she knows a firm that is easy to get into without speaking German as she has helped friends from her own country get in there, so she says she could help us get in their initially if we wanted whilst we’re settling.

I feel, probably quite selfishly, that there is nothing for me in the UK. My parents had me in their 40s, I’m in my 20s now and they are in their 60s. They are full-time carers to my autistic brother who is 25 and they refuse to take any steps to prepare him for the fact that they won’t always be around. He is verbal but doesn’t work, he doesn’t even have a mobile phone as he refuses one and they just accept it. My dad is a hoarder and I hate visiting their home as it stresses me out. I have half-siblings on my dad’s who are 20 years older than me and don’t care about me despite my efforts to have a relationship (I’ve attempted to meet them on their birthdays etc to not even receive a text on mine).

I have dealt with so much anxiety over the years about how care for my parents and brother is likely to all fall on to me in the future as my parents age (my half siblings have no interest). I live an hour drive away as when I met my partner I moved to a different city to be with him. We can’t move to my parent’s city as my partner’s industry doesn’t exist there. I feel absolutely stifled by thoughts of the future. Due to my parents age and being carers they won’t be able to offer me any practical support with my baby. Since I moved an hour away 3 years they’ve visited me less than a handful of times.

Due to large age gaps with my siblings and the fact that my partner has no family in the UK, my child will have no cousins to grow up with except for kids my partner’s sister will have in Germany. I recently have been crying my eyes out as I’ve realised nobody in my family deserves to be godparents to my child, nobody gives a shit enough. We’ve already decided godparents will be partners sister and her partner.

Me and my partner are so lonely and desperate to be around people in a similar life stage. He was quite depressed his last birthday as it fell during a heatwave and he wanted to have a BBQ and realised there was just nobody to really invite so we didn’t bother. It’s getting to him now we’re having a child I think.

Our part of the UK is incredibly rough and our car was stolen a few months ago. I hate the UK rainy grey weather and get seasonal depression, I know Germany is hardly a hot country but the UK is particularly bad due to being an island and we’ve enjoyed many lovely summer BBQs and outdoor parties when visiting Germany previously. I’ve always said no to my partner when he’s suggested moving as I feel bad leaving my parents, but since becoming pregnant I’ve started to want to prioritise baby more and I feel they will be better off if we go to Germany. I only really want 1 child but feel pressure to have 2 if we stay in the UK as I feel the child will be lonely, but it’s different if they will have cousins which they will have in Germany. My, my partner, my partner’s sister and her partner will all be able to support each other.

We have the money to emigrate and get settled - £25,000 in savings. This was originally meant to be a house deposit in the UK but every time we’ve found a home we’ve had to pull out due to the house having major damp issues. Every house in our budget is awful and requires major renovation works. We’ve essentially given up.

I have decided I want to go, I know it won’t be easy to find a rental and jobs etc but I want to at least start the process even if it takes a couple of years. Due to my partner’s EU citizenship I can tag along with him to get residency. I think it’s best for me, my partner and the baby. But I know it will break my mums heart. Can anyone give any insight please? Just to add as well they won’t be able to visit me at all as they are poor, and my dad and brother refuse to travel and mum refuses to leave them.

Mum was worried when I first starting dating someone from another country and said from day 1 “please don’t emigrate.”

Am I a selfish cow?

Get the hell out. You have nothing to keep you here.
If reform get in, your situation (all our situations) will be a lot worse.

Honestly I’ve tried, it’s got to the point where I paid for and booked a professional declutter service - and on the day my parents refused to let them in. I’ve organised viewings of suitable ground floor flats, and supported living arrangements, and they won’t go!

People who won’t help themselves are a nightmare. There’s nothing I can actually do until they become completely incapable and then I’ll have to do it all, all at once and in a hurry, or I’ll have to be a terrible daughter and sister and just point blank refuse when they’re really vulnerable.

It would have been better for me to move out of the country 15 years ago and then maybe they’d have accepted they need to make plans.

You seem to going into the realms of fantasy! You won't have the wealth to pick and choose beautiful European cities you fancy living in! I think the partners sister is selling you a pipe dream! You want to be a stay at home mum whilst your partner is the sole wage earner? You'll not be living in the cities, you'll be like most people on low incomes in these places, living in cramped apartment blocks out in a suburb somewhere! What are you going to do if your relationship does go tits up or he loses his job or some other reason means he has to go back to wherever he is originally from in Eastern Europe? Where does that leave you because you need a £30k a year stable income to be allowed to stay in Germany as a non EU citizen! You can't retire there unless you've got £30k of annual pension money! You can't pin everything on man who only has so much right to be in Germany himself, if he got made redundant you'd end up in a right mess. Be very realistic about your budget and start looking what kind of place you would end up living!

Ot course they do but this isn't a holiday and different to being in a tourist environment. I speak some German which can be useful on holiday but in some places not because of different dialect - it's another matter entirely in workplace etc! German is not an easy language to learn as much as I love it.

Agreed with the above quotr. I moved to my husband country, had 3 childrens, and after 25 years he left me, i am stuck here, can't go back to my own country as he will refuse the permission for the kids to move there despite he doesn't want the kids living with him. I live closed to my inlaws but if i don't go visisting them i will never see them. My younger Sil used to be my best friends, she was very supportive during the breakup since she did not like the other woman but now that ex husband has a new one she likes, she is taken her distance. If you are moving to Germany, please make your own friends do not rely solely of your partner family.

Sorry I couldn’t even get to the end of the very long post let alone read 84 updates so I’m sure it’s already been said but you don’t need any other reason than that you want to. The multiple paragraphs aren’t necessary. When I clicked on the thread I expected this to be a move to Australia or New Zealand, not a country who’s flight time is shorter than the car journey to get out of my UK city at rush hour 😅. I would expect your DH and you to need to speak at least basic German though despite what your relative has said

Go. One hundred percent. It sounds like a fantastic opportunity. Germany is a high-quality country without the current problems of the UK. That is, things actually work there and are efficient. They have very good healthcare and education systems, and they have lakes and mountains and picturesque landscape and historic, beautiful cities. Plus, it's well-positioned to explore the rest of Europe.

The only downside is that if your relationship goes south, you will be stuck living there unless your partner gives permission for you to take the baby back to England. However, if that happened, you might well find that you prefer to stay in Germany anyway. You'll learn the language, you'll have friends, there will be other expats, and of course you would have your DC. And Germany's not far from the UK.

Your family situation in the UK sounds utterly depressing. You going would force your parents into teaching your brother independence. You get on with your partner's family, which is REALLY great.

Go. Of COURSE you're not being selfish to want to live your one life. Your parents are the selfish ones for making you doubt that you can. Clearly, YOU are their plan for their old age and for your brother's care. I'd fly out of there like a bat out of hell if I were you.

I don’t believe I am neurodivergent, personally. I would say the obsessive posting is more due to being off sick with HG and having an ungodly amount of free time :)

I expect moving to be difficult initially, of course. This does not put me off. I think it would a be shame if our family didn’t try it out.

This. I have had to help 2 women in this exact situation. It's incredibly stressful. You can't just return to your home country with your child, if both countries are part of the Hague Convention.

If it means a better life for you and your child I would go. I’m a firm believer in a degree of risk taking in life- you can always come back.
I also appreciate that this may be the only life we get so we need to try and make the most of it and sometimes that means being selfish.

Sounds like you have made up your mind OP, I hope the thread helped you to clarify your thoughts about it. Wishing you the best of luck!

None of this makes sense. You are choosing Hamburg as it has the right industry for your partner but he won't get a job before you go?!

Moving countries with you both unemployed with a very young baby seems a recipe for disaster to me.

It's your life and you need to live it in a way that's right for you.
You don't see your parents frequently as it is, if you want to, you can do regular facetimes and arrange a number of visits back to the UK to see them.
You can provide support from afar to your parents to recommend downsizing, home support, carers, online food shops, support for increasing your brother's independence.

Or you can stay put and plough your efforts into building networks where you are. Invite friends to a summer BBQ. It doesn't have to be family or no-one.

Don't move with no jobs to go to and a plan to whittle down your savings.

Go for an extended holiday while you're on maternity leave, can your partner work remotely from there for a couple of weeks if he can't take a long break? Or you could both take shared parental leave.

If you like it and could see yourselves living there, you come back and he throws himself into finding a job out there. This also potentially means you could return to work for long enough to hold onto your enhanced maternity pay.

Don't pay rent on a place in the UK and overseas (other than while you're on an extended trip there). That's just money down the drain in the UK.

You sound like a lovely daughter to your mum. I would be sad if my son moved so far away,but I would want the best for him. Your mum can always visit and you could too. We have to let go of our children however hard.

She hasn't got the wealth to have all of Europe at her feet, the OP has only ever had low skilled work and plans to be a stay at home mum or find some minimum wage work! Her partner's work is port / dock related. This talking as though money is no object is not helpful, she won't have a great deal.of choices and if she moves to Hamburg she'll not be in the city, she'll be in a good foresaken block.of flats somewhere miles out!

This.

Are you a bloke by any chance?
Your advice is flippant and ignores the reality of her situation.
She is getting ready to jump from the frying pan into the fire and you are egging her on.
That's sadistic.

Have you ever worked in a port? Do you know the responsibilities and level of skill involved in operating a gantry crane?

I made an unfortunate choice doing a degree in social sciences which has turned out to be notoriously hard to get a job in.

I am intelligent and have never had any trouble getting a job and have been put forward for a promotion within my workplace to a more senior role within the customer service department, but it has unfortunately been put on hold due to pregnancy and HG.

I know we’ll be starting from scratch in Germany but please don’t talk about us as if we’re both thick.

We expect we’ll live in an apartment in Germany, that’s fine. We only live in a pokey terrace now. Apartment dwelling is much more common in Europe.

The reality of her situation is that she’s an adult woman that is free to make decisions for herself, even decisions that you consider to be bad ones.

That she’s decided to go for it doesn’t mean she isn’t aware of the risks involved. You wouldn’t be prepared to accept the level of risk here, but OP is. That’s her right.

Thank you. Some people have been talking as if I’m an extremely vulnerable individual with little to no initiative or agency. It’s utterly bizarre. People have even gone as far to say I don’t really want to go and my partner is grooming me 😂 Some of the responses have had a sly misogynistic tone, I would go as far to say.

Of course the responses advising of the practicalities, warning of issues that may arise and offering genuine advice are much appreciated. Those who imply I’m an idiot to even consider it, not so much.

If I was going on about how I can’t wait to be a psychologist in Germany because I have a psychology degree and how I can’t wait have a big house and live happily ever dancing around the mountains in the Alps and dressing my child in a lederhosen, maybe the response of grave concern would make a bit more sense!

I’ve been incredibly realistic with my plans throughout the whole thread. I’ve been realistic that we’ll need to commit to learning the language and potentially work unglamorous jobs at first. So long we can afford to eat and keep a roof over our child’s head in the initial couple of years when settling in, it has every potential to work long-term. If we tried it out and things got too dire, we’d of course have to return to the UK. But I am doubtful things would become that disastrous with careful preparation and having a connection with somebody already established in the country.

You must do what you feel is best for your family. I never went to Australia because of being an only child with older parents. I regret this all the time. On the flip side my friends mum has just died whilst my friend was on a plane trying to get to her.

People migrate to and from the UK everyday. If you feel Germany is right for you then it's right for you. Even if things go badly in your relationship it doesn't mean that you would want to return to the UK. I think that is important that you also look into the quickest way of staying in Germany in your own right. This would most probably take years anyway but it would future proof you somewhat. I could very well imagine you to be happy in Germany and not wanting to return to the UK against your will.

As a mother in my 60s I say Go! It’s your life. FaceTime etc, flights, all there fur your parents.
Make your life.

Just to say OP that a degree in Social Science can open doors to jobs in other areas, not necessarily that area. Think about transferable skills.