Stay at home parent

[123mother]

Why do people think a stay at home parent doesn't work? That they have so much time on their hands? Am I wrong in thinking I have less of a break then my partner brining in the pay check

You are woefully misinformed there.

Construction is private sector. Your dh is self-employed, I'm assuming, hence no benefits. Many, if not most, working in construction are contractors and are self employed. Slightly different to "normal" self-employed because CIS covers payroll so tax is deducted, but no benefits.

Private sector = private companies
Public sector = government funded (NHS/police/education/civil service)
Third sector = charities

But still...what's the relevance to SAHPs?

Virtually everyone I know works and only one of them has flexible hours. Round here jobs with school hours (or even 7-3 or 9:30-5:30) are rare. Very rare.
These jobs also only work if you have a partner willing to help with pick up or drop off. I know if DS ever manages to do a full day at school I'd have to get a 9-3 job because DH isn't able to change his hours (7:30-4:15). Lots of parents in a similar position. Your friends and family are lucky but most jobs with those hours rarely come up because the people who have those jobs know how lucky they are. Also it doesn't help in the school holidays, don't tell me it's term time only work (supermarket certainly wouldn't be).

Still, I’d rather he was not SE and had all the perks I’ve mentioned in my previous post.

the only construction roles that are worth it are the ones where you own the business (eg installations). My neighbour owns his own installation company and takes in 500k per annum.

I have a toddler, and one day off in the week with him.

We do two activities, I cook a fresh lunch for everyone, go out to the park for a bit, tidy the house and usually bake. I also do 1-2h of either my job, household tasks, or my hobby whilst he's asleep or before my husband starts work.

At the end of the day the house is tidy, we've read a dozen books and we've all eaten well. And necessary stuff is done too.

As yet I'm not massively getting how a SAHM to an NT child is working harder.

Which is not to say it's not beneficial for all concerned.

I have a disabled 9 year old with the cognitive age of a 3 year old.

That means I also have all of the paperwork and meetings (admin) that comes with that, and caring responsibilities in the middle of the night.

My partner and I both work full time, except I’m flexi so over the holidays I can work reduced hours.

We don’t currently have any paid help, though I may consider a cleaner just to do a deep clean.

Everyone in my house is fed, clean and looked after. Activities and trips out happen, the house hasn’t fallen apart, and we have various professionals that are liaised with.

I definitely don’t get what a SAHP to a NT child is doing all day.

Today I have taking eldest to hospital for a scan. I have had blood tests myself.at the gp. I have walked the puppy and older dog separately. I have made pizza dough and soup for school lunches. I have dropped younger two at school after doing school work with them in early morning. I stayed for half an hour and read with reception children after drop off. I have deep cleaned the living room, mopped utility room, sorted through my daughter's books and ordered new ones. Organised insurance claim for
Orthodontist treatment for 2 older boys. I will now do washing and finish pizza (to leave out for kids tonight). I will then pick up 6 year old at 3.20, 9 year old at 4pm from netball club, drive with them to get older boys from Mandarin class at 5pm. Go home give them snacks and sort home work, then take middle boy to cricket nets before taking girl to cubs in town (7.15-8.45). Does that give you an idea?

Honestly? No.

Many of the things you describe can be done either before or after work, or in a lunch break.

“Doing washing and finishing pizza” would definitely fit into your lunch hour. Probably alongside “calling insurance.”

Most people walk their dogs before and after work. Appointment leave exists for appointments.

I know this because I went to a CAMHS meeting yesterday, and just used leave. I have just “made pork” (by that I mean prepped it and put it in the oven), it took 5mins of my lunch break. I plan to use another 10 hoovering downstairs. I called HMRC on a break yesterday.

It doesn’t suddenly become more time consuming to organise pizza toppings because you’re doing it during the work day.

As so many people have said it completely depends on the ages and needs of the children, as well as how many you have. For most people once their kids (no additional needs) go to school you have it pretty easy as a SAHP. However, if you have 5 kids, pets and a large house, then you’ll be pretty busy if you don’t have any outside help, especially if you have a partner who feels that earning money is where their contribution to family life ends and spends their free time golfing and cycling. If you have two teens it would be easier than if you have two primary aged kids etc.

But I’m doing what you do, on top of a full time role. Somehow your perceived version of the parenting you do is organic, grass fed; whereas mine is the UPF riddled, “depleted” version. I have a relative who talks about how difficult it would be to ship her kids around to various clubs if she were employed: the reality is, she’s been out of the workforce so long she’s lost her nerve.

Many could be done during a lunch break, you are correct. However, my point is not that these must all be done between 9-5pm, but that there are enough of them in a household if 6 when you have long drives to school and us etc. to keep me occupied for much more than a full standard working day, 7 days a week. For example, just to take the tasks detailed in my post today which needs to be done between 3-8.45pm.Theae kind of jobs people specifically pay nannies or get parents to help with. It seems strange they would pay someone to do all this, if they just whizzed through it in their lunch break, or could easily fit them in and around flexible jobs. Thanks for pointing out people walk dogs before work by the way. Just out of interest , have you ever owned a puppy ?

Not this again surely. Continuing with the stance that nobody who works has ever owned a puppy😂 my parents had multiple puppies as we grew up, both always worked full time. We have had 2 puppies, and always worked.

I’m not superwoman, not superhuman, most of our friends have dogs, have had them since puppies, and have also always had jobs!

So when I was working:

I would have taken leave for the scan.
Walk in blood tests for me at 7:30 before school/work.

DH would walk the dog before work. I did the evening walk.

School lunches are free for youngest/included in school fees for eldest/supplied by school for middle (disabled - special school).

School work is done in the evenings. Youngest might read while I was doing breakfast, or practice times tables in the car or something.

I was a teacher so spent all day listening to kids read.

Deep cleaning/sorting books - weekend and holiday jobs.

Insurance claim - after school job or holiday job if it's a rediculous only open between 11-11:15 type place.

Washing - before/after work (delay timer is amazing!)

Homemade pizzas - prep the dough the night before to give it time to rise. Roll it, make sauce and toppings just before we're ready to eat.

DH would do school pick up. Clubs shared between us. Supervise homework while cooking.

Id also... Work between 8-6, DH 7-3, care for disabled DD, pop round to elderly parents several times a week, sort all the disability admin, work evenings and weekends in front of the TV, and God knows what else.

No. I don't get your point at all.

And that's nothing special, that's a pretty standard working parent routine. It's just life!

Ok, I'm not quite sure how your relative's lack of nerve has any relevance here. As I have said multiple times, it is NOT possible to do my job and a full time job at the same time. You can dispute this, but you are wrong. If you took time to actually read what I have written you would understand that I am not commenting on anyone else's parenting choices. I am very simply stating that I am fully occupied providing the kind of life we have chosen for our children. Just because I don't get paid, does not mean I don't work full time, however much you would like that to be the case. I know, and many people agree, that it is entirely possible to spend productive and valuable working hours performing the job of SAHP. You are not doing what I am doing on top of a full time role. I am sure you are doing your best by your children according to your situation, like all of us.

I have, I’ve had 2 dogs - both from puppies. Both managed absolutely fine with morning and evening walks, and one of us coming back at lunch (before WFH days).

You are making mountains out of molehills to convince someone (yourself?) that you’re super busy.

I have “prepped dinner” …. I chopped some potatoes and put pork in the oven. I don’t need all day off work to do that. I have “done washing”…. I put the washer on this morning and unloaded it. If I was working in the office I would “do washing” tonight.

You’re busy looking busy.

Honestly I take my hat off to you. I could not live that that.
you should be rewarded and greatly appreciated for what you do.
it makes me appreciate my life more now. 🌷

“it is NOT possible to do my job and a full time job at the same time”

You don’t have a job. You have a voluntary life choice.

I am not sure why you are listing.how you manage your life admin. I am perfectly aware as a trained secondary school teacher and Mother if 4 that things can be arranged in a number of ways. I am also aware that washing machines have timers! I don't mind how other people manage. I am sure for many of them it is very hard. The only reason I am posting what I do is because I was asked how on earth I spend my day when my kids are at school.i provided a small example of a full working day of jobs and people pile on saying they could be done outside of working hours. They could not because they take up a full working week. Mu husband also has a full working week. That's it. Obviously I could stay up till 2am cleaning and pay for someone else to look after them, that is not what is being considered.

Ok. If you want to insist that jobs = pay (I absolutely disagree and so might lots of people but that's fine) . To clarify, it is not possible to provide the level of care and attention I do for my children, and also hold down a full time job in the current set up we have chosen. I am not saying you can't have kids and look after them whilst working. I am saying we chose to have children and bring them up this way and that shouldn't leave me open to being attacked for being inadequate/lazy or anything else.

A job, is a “paid position of regular employment.”

I struggle to believe that anyone went from secondary teaching to walking the dog and making pizza and thinks they’re busier than they would have been had they stayed teaching. There’s a reason so many of us leave that profession, and it’s not low workload.

I think you’re so defensive of your choices because you can see that compared to what life would have been had you remained teaching and been a mum of 4, you’re a lady of relative leisure.

Except clearly they can because people do. You spend your day doing what other people fit in around work. Not until 2am fgs, normal waking hours. You could do everything you do and work full time.

If you don't want to, that's a perfectly valid choice. I have made that choice for myself this year. I want a year to relax before a career change. Nothing wrong with that.

But to keep insisting working parents don't do everything a SAHP does is rediculous!

I think it's quite unusual to be able to leave a puppy alone all morning and afternoon. Every dog is different though.
You say I am trying to convince myself I am busy 'making mountains out of mole hills'. I am simply stating that I spend the equivalent of a working week looking after my children, household and animals, as well as volunteering. I am asking for other women to accept that is a valid choice and not to be unpleasant and try to point score. The basic point here, is that everyone has different things to manage and varying degrees of optionality when it comes to life balance and priorities . Some households outsource domestic labour and childcare, some can't afford to and have to get by. There is always fall out one way or the other. We have less money than we might, because I don't earn anymore. All I ask you to consider, instead of lashing out, is that I that perhaps people shouldn't only give value to those things which are done in exchange for money. You seem determined to characterise me personally as somehow less capable because I choose a life where I don't earn cash. This is not unique to you, it is typical (sadly) of a society where money and professional success are valued above all else; it is so sad. So many people seem to relish making sweeping generalisations about SAHP, based on nothing more lazy assumptions.

It is not insisting something ridiculous. It is a fact. If I was at work, I couldn't also be looking after my children.Why on earth do you suppose people would pay for wrap around child care if they didn't have to?! There are things you have to outsource/compromise on one way or another if you are full time working. Fact. That doesn't mean it's less desirable as a choice, or easier as a necessity. But it is a fact.

Speaking honestly, I won’t recognise that it’s a valid choice - because I don’t think it is.

I think that everyone who is capable of work, should be at work. I accept that for some that means part time, but I view all optionally unemployed in the exact same way regardless of whether their husband is paying for them or the taxpayer is.

I believe that women have come too far for their responsibility to be exclusively domestic labour and children related, and if I had a daughter I’d be teaching her to do better for herself than to rely on a man.

I think that men should carry their fair share of all aspects of running the home. The workload not being split fairly leads to men who are developing their careers and financial security, and women who are at home hoovering. That’s an outdated idea, IMO.

I also completely reject the idea that anyone who is at home all day is busier than a working parent. They cannot be, because they don’t have the 8hr work day inbetween the responsibility that everyone has in their homes.

The ridiculous thing is life isn't SUPPOSED to be endless work and drudgery so why everyone is competing to be top of the Martyr Olympics I have no idea. I work part time so have no idea which side of this debate I am on but I feel absolutely no guilt in "outsourcing" part of my children's upbringing and not do I think my paid work is some kind of weird self indulgence to give me a break from my real work of "relentless" child rearing. I wanted to have kids. I don't bring them up as some kind of favour to the patriarchy or as some kind of penance.

I also work in as fulfilling a role as I can compatible with what I consider to be adequate financial reward but it's not a treat to myself or what I'd do if I had no financial obligations. And I do volunteering and my own cleaning as well but also sometimes sit on my arse chatting shit on Mumsnet or doom scrolling and don't feel the need to justify that to anyone.

Other people strike different balance, good for them. If as a result of their own choices they have it harder than they need to then more fool them quite honestly.

I didn't ever say it would be easier, or the same in terms of workload if I worked full time. Why do you assume that I am saying that? That is precisely the reason I decided not to work in order to bring up my children. This is a circular conversion. Obviously, if I had a full time job, I would have more to do overall. I have never claimed otherwise at any point. We are lucky that be able to pay the mortgage in one salary. If I were working, I would have less time for my children and therefore not be providing the same level of care. This is why I repeatedly say that I can't do a full time job and also do everything I currently do..because I would be at work !