AIBU or is this understandable?

[Furning]

I have a good friend I’ve been friends with since my university days.

We both moved away from the UK and are both living in Europe now. My friend text me a couple of weeks ago saying that she was bringing her children to visit my city this week, and was I free. I was very free and was looking forward to seeing my friend and her children. We used to go on city breaks and the odd long haul beach holiday before she had children, but obviously don’t get the time to see each other much now so I really was looking forward to a catch up.

The day we were due to meet, she messaged to say her middle child (a toddler, and she also has a six month old and a six year old) wouldn’t settle and she wouldn’t be able to leave the hotel. She suggested another day, then again text to say the toddler was still unsettled and was being hard work. I was very relaxed about what we did, and would’ve been happy to go to the park, for a walk, to a soft play, anything. I wasn’t expecting one on one time without the kids.

She went home on Friday and text to say she was sorry we weren’t able to catch up.

I feel quite hurt. I send the children birthday and Christmas gifts, flew in for their baptisms, stood as Godmother for one. I flew over for her wedding and to another destination for her hen do. But she was a couple of blocks away and couldn’t see me? Couldn’t even have invited me for a coffee at the hotel or brought the kids to my house?

AIBU or is it to be accepted when travelling with kids? My DH is more bothered about it than me and said he thinks he’d be done with the friendship (I am not done and not considering being, but it’s surprised me that he’s expressed such a strong opinion when he’s normally very laid back about things).

I am not sure anyone said that was necessary. Do get a grip.

It sounds like you’re just in different seasons of life. I know mumsnet is very big on going NC but real life tends to be a bit more nuanced. It wouldn’t kill you to adjust your expectations and keep the friendship door open in the background - you may find that in several years time your lives realign and it’s nice to have an old friend. You might need the flexibility more than she does at that point, and you might be grateful for a little patience and understanding.

You don’t have to do any of those things, but it is what I would do, and find it has served me well across my life. It doesn’t sound like you’re that open to suggestions though from the way you post!

I suggested meeting my friend at the hotel and she was not open to this.

Am I to pressure her by suggesting pyjama picnics? Should I have to spend money on toys for the kids to see her?

Again, she is not an idiot. She’s got the ability to say ‘come over and have a glass of wine in my room’ if that’s what she thought would work.

‘You are hardly the best friend ever to her either (after not even really seeing each other for two years).’

@Furning Ah OP, you've fallen into a Mumsnet trap here. You should've offered to at least adopt her kids otherwise you're obviously the bitch from hell. And you definitely aren't allowed to feel upset about, well, anything really unless it involves your mother in law.

Yes. That sentence doesn’t say ‘you should continue to do that’ though, does it? It just implies you’ve both left the friendship to drift and it won’t be that big a deal if it continues that way.

From your posts here, I can certainly understand why she has let it drift!

I agree with your husband. There was no reason for her to refuse to allow you to come to the hotel. You could have ordered room service or you could have brought round a picnic.

The suggestion that you should have taken the 6 year old off her hands is ludicrous.

Tbh, I don't believe she and the children didn't leave the hotel the whole time. I think it's more likely she was busy with her sister and couldn't fit you in.

You don’t think relevant!

OP says her friend has been giving the situation a lot of thought and has been messaging the op multiple times.

You don’t think relevant what the friend is saying post hotelgate?

I can see why you would t want to help her for a couple of hours with one of the kids. However you helped her out and presumably her sister helped her with the baby, it might have been more manageable to settle the toddler if she didn’t have to juggle at least another one more kid and actually be able to be more present with you as well.
anyway, I think your husband is very harsh. The reality with kids, 3 small kids, is quite brutal.

Hi, I can see you are getting absolutely roasted here. If your friend had been there for 48 hours then I would accept that she could’ve been busy and unable to fit you in. However not a moment in a whole week?!?

There were loads of opportunities. She could’ve put the kids to bed and said do you want to swing by the hotel about 7:30 8 o’clock and we can have a half an hour cup of coffee or a drink while my sister keeps an eye on sleeping kids. Or she could’ve suggested just coming to the hotel to breakfast with them. Or absolutely anything!!

I think ignoring you for a couple of days being busy would be fine, but seven whole days and with you 10 minutes away I think that’s unkind. I’m sure her sister would’ve looked after the difficult toddler for half an hour so your friend could come and meet you with the six-year-old and the baby in tow.

There might be a lot of reasons, she might be depressed, she might be having marriage problems, but if I was you, I too would feel sad. A week is a long time to be ‘far too busy’ every moment, to see a good friend willing to come to the hotel.

for context, once when my husband was really ill in bed, I had an extremely bad migraine so couldn’t drive, I got an old dog and a teething screaming toddler in a taxi, on a train, in a taxi, 100 miles away to my Uncle‘s 70th birthday party. Arranged for a family members to walk the dog up and down outside so we could be present at the birthday party for the cutting of the cake, etc. I think if you want to do something, you can. And she had a whole week to find half an hour.

think now I’m about to get roasted….

I can see how you’re upset but you clearly don’t understand how hard it is to have a 6 yo, toddler and baby. I’m amazed she got there in the first place. It could well have been traumatic getting there. It must have been traumatic staying in a hotel with three young ones. Only 6 months after birth too. Her hormones could well be all over the place. As you gave no idea how bad it can be and not very sympathetic, she probably thought it best not to subject you to that! Toddlers often like routine and can get pretty upset without it. If she didn’t sleep very well, she was probably exhausted. She was probably going out of her mind! It was obviously very stressful for her. She probably couldn’t leave the toddler with her sister. You wouldn’t have had any quality time. She wouldn’t have been able to give you anyone attention with a grumpy toddler there. She probably roiling have been able to listen properly. She would only be able to say half a sentence before having to watch out for / calm a toddler if you’d gave been present. You couldn’t have been sympathetic. She probably knew this from your attitude. She wouldn’t have wanted to subjected you to that. She could well have been embarrassed if you had gone to the hotel. She was obviously not coping at all. She knows you don’t understand.

It’s easy to be optimistic and make plans when you have children. Sometimes plans don’t work out how you want. She was probably very upset that you couldn’t meet too.

Of course, she hasn’t been able to travel she’s been pregnant or had young children over the last seven years. Very optimistic travelling alone this time with children those ages!! Does she work? She’s been on maternity leave three times? Probably now too. She could well be skint and not afford to travel.

You sound very unsympathetic which may well be understandable from a childless friend. This friendship will probably end anyway. She’s clearly struggling and you don’t seem very supportive or understanding. You’re just annoyed and resentful that you’ve made the effort to travel. I wouldn’t expect a new mum to travel to me and then even more so when she’s got her second or third child.

I can also understand her wanting to be back after your meal when you saw her. Perhaps she probably thought her husband needed rescuing! Putting three young children to bed can be a nightmare. Do they sleep well? I bet the baby is not sleeping through the night. Is she breastfeeding? She probably won’t be able to leave the baby too long.

You have an answer then.

Parents of young kids usually come with their kids. For a few years, it’s very difficult to see them alone. Their kids come first.

If you don’t want to take leave to spend with your friend along with her kids, then you won’t see her until her kids are older. Focus on friends without young kids.

Probably better for her too. When you have young kids, the most valuable friends are the people who delight in spending time with your kids, and helping you with them, as much as they do with you.

I don’t think this is anything more or less than your lifestyles, priorities, locations, pressures making friendship incompatible.

if you want to stop making an effort and allow the friendship to fizzle out, that wouldn’t be unreasonable.

She wasn’t being unreasonable not seeing you, either. You have one adult son. I cannot fathom being stuck in a hotel room with three children, -8°C outside (snow on the ground making a stroller pointless?), a baby and a toddler waking in the night, away from home, no kitchen, one bathroom, cramped room with clothes and toys everywhere, no adult around other than a visiting sister…I too would have bailed on you even if you were right next door. She’s obviously come to see her sister because she needs to (not wants, needs - nobody does this sort of trip at this time of year with a 6mo for a laugh) and my supposition would be that there are problems at home. Couple that with a toddler who won’t settle and a baby waking at night - you’d be on my list but at the very bottom because you would be a nice extra after keeping body and soul together for four people.

So, if you’re not ok with being at the bottom of the list, just let it fizzle out. Not unreasonable but also hardly the stuff of friendship. My friends have stuck by me through thick and thin. They never used annual leave to babysit (!), but they gave me space and time, jumped to no conclusions, asked after my wellbeing, messaged periodically and picked up where we left off after 8-10 years. I think you’re being selfish, but selfish in the way that people can reasonably be selfish. You’re just different people now. She’s no longer giving you what you seem to need from her.

I guess it depends when they agreed to meet. Maybe they agreed to meet the day before she was due to leave as OP was working etc?

I agree. And your post is possibly the first sensible one I've read.

I think you've had some really strange answers here OP. YANBU in the slightest.

OP, you’re not being unreasonable.

And fwiw - given the additional information you’ve shared - I agree with your husband. I really think this friendship has run its course. And not because of anything you’ve done or not done, but because she isn’t willing to invest the time and effort. The kids (well, the toddler) are a red herring! She couldn’t be arsed to make the effort before she had the children!

Whilst she was at the hotel, was there a series of communications, I.e. you making a number of suggestions in different texts each day and her rebuffing each one? Or did you send a list of suggestions in one or two texts and she just responded with 'I'll let you know,' without getting back to you? Apologies if you've already explained this and I've missed it, I'm just trying to understand what her communications were like, as in did it come across that she was trying to fob you off.

Was her sister saying in the hotel with her?

I do think it's a bit odd OP, I must say. Why mention to you at all that she was coming, and then not take the time just to grab a coffee at the hotel?

I can imagine that the trip might have been too much, and been more complicated and tiring than she anticipated, and she may have thought it would just add more stress trying to meet with you with a truculent child in tow, but why not just explain that, or give you a good old-fashioned phone call? Quite strange behaviour.

YANBU, I’d be letting this friendship drift, and cutting out the gifts. She is not reciprocating at all. She could have made it down to reception for 30 minutes in a whole week as her sister was also there.

Utter nonsense. Some 6 year olds will be fine and some will be OK with it. Some definitely will not.

I had questions but this is your answer Why would I take the six year old out? It’s her mother I’m interested in talking to

I'd put money on you being irked by her children and the mum is aware of it, so doesn't want you around them

So again you missed my first point.

I asked how you suggested meeting her at the hotel - did you specify that casual no pressure in the room was an option.

Because she may well have assumed that you’d be expecting her to get all three kids dressed, and meet in the cafe or restaurant of the hotel.

She might have been embarrassed to suggest hanging out just in the room.

Plus if you suggested it alongside a load of other options she might well have been too overwhelmed to make a decision.

I have friends who have seen me in my PJs who I would feel totally relaxed with hanging out in my hotel room, with the messy room detritus that comes with kids, possibly one naked kid having a meltdown.

Those friends even if we haven’t seen each other for years would tell me all that mattered was seeing each other and would turn up with chocolate and wine, and yes treats for the kids, give me a big hug, pitch in with the chaos and it would be fun.

Other friends I would feel embarrassed in the same situation unless they made it clear they were relaxed and fine with it.

"Why would I take the six year old out? It’s her mother I’m interested in talking to."
"So I’m expected to help with her kids but not actually see my friend? Pull the other one "

It's pretty easy to see that you have no real interest or tolerance for the children. That's ok, but means that unless your friend's sister was happy to look after the kids without your friend, or you could go with the friend and her children somewhere where the children would play pretty independently while you and their mother talked, there was no point in trying to meet up unless there was a third adult to care for the kids. Your anti kid stance is fine, but it's natural and fine that single parents with multiple kids don't want to meet up with you.

Gently i’ll say you’re missing my point. Regardless whether it was 1 out of the 3 children playing up or all 3 your friend has massively down played her situation to you. Nobody takes 3 young children on holiday to a foreign city to spend all week in a hotel room! The fact she couldn’t leave the hotel means she’s either badly misjudged how hard it would be to manage 3 children on her own and hasn’t coped even with her sisters help or her toddler has unexpectantly not coped with the change of location/change of temperature/travel or has some underlying issue such as teething etc causing them to scream the hotel room down. Whichever one it is doesn’t matter she probably feels more devastated about not meeting you than you’ll ever know and will be embarrassed that she messed you about.

However she’s your friend so you know her better than anyone on an anonymous internet forum so if you feel she didn’t try hard enough then distance yourself from her and stop making the effort. Maybe once she’s out the trenches she might get back in touch and be able to meet up with you again without the kids.

A previous poster alluded to possible issues with your friend's relationship/husband. What struck me was the occasion when she left you eating dessert as she needed to be home as she hadn't seen her husband since 8am. this is a red flag to me. I do wonder if there is more to this. If you had met in person, would you have been able to see something that would give away her home situation?