To insist on moving DH and the DC to New York?

[TheCoralBear]

Me, DH and our DC (11 year old DS and 14 year old DD) were all born in the UK and live in London. I’ve performed in musical theatre (and I work as an usher in a theatre when I’m not performing) my whole life and it’s all I’ve ever known. Usually I perform in west end musicals here in the UK however I’ve now been offered a role on Broadway which would obviously involve moving to New York. I want to accept the role and move us all to New York but DH and the DC are dead set against it and won’t even consider it. I really don’t want to turn down the Broadway role as it’s an excellent opportunity for my career. DH are the DC are refusing to even consider moving though. DH has even suggested I go to New York alone and he stays here with the children but I’m not going to just abandon my children like that so that’s why I’ve suggested we all move to New York but DH and DC keep insisting that they don’t want to go. Would I be unreasonable to insist that we are all going to New York and that’s the end of it? DH says he doesn’t care if it’s an excellent opportunity for my career but he is not considering moving to New York, he is dead set against it.

I feel like he was able to be genuinely excited because he didn’t believe for even a second that you would land the role. I would question him on this, his total 180 makes it completely obvious he didn’t actually believe you would get it. Clearly he isn’t giving you enough credit for your talent, for starters. He can only support this in theory and in real practice he never had any intention of even considering a move to NY.

This is an amazing opportunity and not one I would want to give up, however I also would not be moving my children to America given the current climate

Even if your DH gave up parental responsibility when the children were young, he’s actively involved in their lives, if he went to court now with an 11 yo and 14yo saying they don’t want to move countries I think you will have a hard time getting any British judge to force 2 British children to leave the country they have lived in all their lives. And would you seriously want to damage your relationship with them by forcing them?

This. I'd be asking for legal advice if I were the dad.

Either he's a good enough father for you to have let him back into their lives or he's not and you shouldn't have done!

You want to take your family to live in Trump’s America, @TheCoralBear? There is no way I would want to do that as an adult, never mind taking children there!

And forcing your children to leave everything that is familiar to them, disrupting their education, and taking them away from all their friends is NOT going to end well - it could be really damaging for them.

When I was about 8, my parents decided to follow their dream, and move to the countryside - to an isolated village in the Shropshire hills. Dsis and I were given no choice in the matter, and, as far as I can see, our needs were not considered. It was nice to live somewhere where we could play out in the hill safely, but it didn’t balance out the downsides - we had left good friends behind, and were moved to a insular community where everyone knew everyone else, and I really struggled to fit in and make friends. I was bullied from the time we moved there until the time I moved to sixth form college, and I am still battling the depression and low self esteem that this caused. It is not hyperbole to say it has blighted my entire life.

I do understand why you are upset that your dh initially encouraged you, then seemingly went back on that - I think he probably didn’t really consider what it would actually be like until you got the role, and it all became a reality.

I can also appreciate what a big chance this is for you, but I don’t think it is fair for you to uproot your whole family, for your dream. If you do want to go, you need to go alone, I’m afraid.

Thankyou - I was genuinely unaware of all this....

Culled from several of OP's posts:

"DH hasn’t got parental responsibility for them."

So they're not his children?
"It’s complicated to explain."

"I wouldn’t just take them without DH though because I wouldn’t take them away from him like that. The same reason I won’t go on my own because I don’t want to lose my children. That’s why I want us all to go to New York together."

"I’m not going to go to New York on my own and leave my children with DH without me, no way am I going to abandon my children. That’s why I want us all to go to New York together."

"DH doesn’t have legal parental responsibility because he gave it up years ago through a court order which I also agreed to and wanted at the time but that’s a situation that’s very complicated to explain. Our relationship was also in a very different place back then."

The parental rights issue is quite the hand grenade, isn't it? "He gave it up" "which I also agreed to". "Court order". I was intrigued enough to look it up, this came up on my searches from a solicitor's website.

A father can also lose his parental responsibility if an Adoption or Parental Order is made, but he can also lose his parental responsibility through a Court Order.
This, however, is not as common as people often think and is very rare for the Court to endorse. The Court will consider a child’s welfare as the paramount consideration.
There are a few limited cases in this area of family law, and removal of a father’s parental responsibility has only occurred in the following instances:

• A father has committed sexual assault on a child, causing physical and severe emotional damage as a result of the assault
• There has been serious domestic violence and it was proven that the father posed a serious emotional and physical risk to the children
• To protect the mother’s and children’s safety

It is therefore clear that parental responsibility can only be terminated in real exceptional circumstances and is not as common as thought.

"Has only occurred" says to me that there have been no other reasons for a father to lose his parental rights under a UK Court Order, so yes we are talking child sex abuse or domestic violence. But, hey - "It’s complicated to explain" and "I wouldn’t take them away from him".

Quite apart from the financial unlikelihood and the rampant disregard for what her children want, we can now add a rampant disregard for their safety. If it's all true.

I still don't understand why you won't go alone
@TheCoralBear ? You won't be abandoning them at all, unless you don't trust your DH with them? In any case at the ages your children are at, it would be madness to uproot them for 18 months.
We moved to NY when ours were 3 and 7 due to a wonderful work opportunity. We came back after 18 months as life in the US was not for us and we wanted back in the UK education system.

Did you discuss with your kids before you auditioned? Looking at their ages especially the 14 year old they also should have been spoken to about it not just your husband.

If your husband does agree to go what happens if you can’t change your kids minds and they don’t want to go? A 14 year old can easily refuse to get on the plane.

I'm sorry but WHATTTTT!! You can't insist anything! Who died and made you the boss? I'm going to assume that your husband is a fully grown adult and make his own choices? Insist, jeezo

Yes, l thought the parental responsibility thingy as a huge red flag.

It’s a 75/25 spilt, you’ve lost on this occasion OP. Your husband has given you the option to go yourself though 🤷‍♀️

You have to ask yourself the question, what's more important, family or career? It's a tough choice, but probably also quite an easy one... These decisions are easier when you're single or child-free, which you're not.

You have to decide where your responsibilities lie, and if you choose family, (which I'm sure you will from the tone of the thread), then if you have to try and not be bitter or resentful with your family afterwards.

Rage bait is my new favourite expression and this has got it written all over it.

Very intrigued as to how even if you are legally able to force it how you plan to force children of that age onto the plane? Can you pick them up and carry them? Yes your DH has been unfair in saying he would consider it but to not even consider the fact your children don’t want to go anyway is ridiculous.

Legendary Glasgow venue

Have you done a full budget to account for housing and living costs? Do you know if it’s even legally possible to take your family with you on a visa? We were in a similar position in Trump’s first term (I was the trailing spouse) and decided against it even though it was a VERY good package to include accommodation, private schooling & healthcare. We made the decision not to go mostly because of Trump and I’m so glad we didn’t go, even though I have always wanted to live in the USA as I love its literature and theatre (I also work in the theatre industry). The US govt are disinvesting in all social spending and building a massive military and moving towards martial law. It would be like taking your family to Berlin in the late 1930s - a foolish move at any price, but for a short contract in an insecure industry - what are you thinking?!

Given that you choose to be an usher when you aren't working so don't ever see your children in the evenings apart from Sundays then I think you should go alone initially.

On such a long contract you will get time off and you could come back for a few days. I worked in New York for a bit and lots of people fly back and forth for the weekend.

It's an amazing opportunity to have 18 months living in New York for them- lots of actors children do this- but it will of course have an impact on their education/friendships and I assume that's why they don't want to go?

I’m retired now but I worked in education for many years. My view is that you would be completely wrong to move your children to NY then move back again in a couple of years. Most children would struggle with being moved into a completely different education system, which is far away from everything that is familiar. Do you expect them to just slot back into their previous life again when your contract ends after a year or two?

I strongly urge you not to do this as I’ve seen how unhappy children become when parents insist on moving far away for selfish reasons (yes, you are being selfish). Don’t force your kids to follow your dream rather than thinking about what is best for their well-being. If you don’t want to go to NY alone, you will have to turn the work down.

Insisting on moving family to New York so you can fanny about on a stage?
That would be a big fuck off with that, end off.

1. its a dreadful ill-timed moment to move children in their teens / GCSE years
2. 3 out of 4 in the family do not want to go
3. acting work is precarious and the show might not get extended so it’s not very long term or secure considering the upheaval involved
4. how would your DH be allowed to work? Your acting income could not support the family in NYC unless you have inheritance you’ve not mentioned or something
5. who in their right mind would move to the US right now
6. When you have children you are committing to putting their needs above your own whilst they are still children
7. they don’t want to go.

22 Broadway Musicals That Closed on Opening Night | Playbill

The Tyne doesn't flow through Glasgow.

As an aside. Theare no posts from the OP on any other threads.

If he’s their biological parent, he can still apply to the court for an order preventing them from moving.

It sounds like a lovely opportunity, but 18 months doesn't seem long enough to up and move a whole family without some sort of permanent income.
I don't know how visas work there so can't comment on that aspect.

Can't believe that OP is so far into cloud cuckoo when native actors are two a penny in certain areas in America.
I think she's got a fixtation with that it's going to be all foot lights, name up in lights and top billing, meanwhile in the real world....
If a man was 'insisting' he would get the same responses on here and quite rightly so.

You would be unreasonable to prioritise your desires above that of your entire family.