Ice agent shoots a woman in the face part 3

[Moontan]

Donald Trump has now said its okay to murder a woman. Because they are doing it for people's 'safety'

It is interesting how far humans will let themselves be abused by bad people.

I was watching a documentary about jonestown the cult.

Some people left the cult

They said that the leader beat people, raped people, starved people. He made them do physical labour for many hours a day. He demanded that they give him all of their money.

And yet still hundreds of people followed him.

People seem to keep supporting a person and staying there. Rather than saying "maybe i was wrong and this guy is actually a bad person"

She is undermining democracy. I voted for Trump. My congresspersons voted for ICE funding.

Who is she to decide that our decisions are not legitimate? Who is she to decide that ICE should be thwarted? WHO voted for her?

She is acting in a thoroughly undemocratic manner. Unfortunately it led to her death, due to misadventure.

So it’s not a left vs right wing protestor thing then is it.

The January 6th protesters were actually threatening and destructive. They forced their way en masse into the main government building. The politicians inside were terrified. This event on the other hand was a couple of women in a car goading ICE thugs. They intended no physical threat. MAGA are lying when they claim the victim ran the killer over deliberately. There is no evidence of that at all - either that she drove towards him, or that he was run over.

Democracy does not mean you cast your vote and then stfu until your next one. That is the opposite of democracy, hence why people refer to protesting as "a democratic right."

fucking bitch knocked me with her car and I thought she would kill me

How could he have shot her three times while he was being hit by a car? There wasn't enough time for both in this scenario.

🤮

To be fair, I think there's a difference between protesting as a mother because the religious regime that governs you has created an economic crash, enforces hijabs, and considers women second class citizens who are lesser than men, with female children already able to be married off to be raped by adult men.....and interfering with an active legal ICE operation to detain illegal immigrants, which both doesn't involve you, and was sanctioned by a government that was voted into power in a recent democratic election.

In the case of Iranians, it seems to me that risking death is proportionate and worthwhile if there is a chance it will free their children of a suffocating and cruel regime.

"When tyranny becomes law, rebellion becomes duty" - Thomas Jefferson

It seems in America you don't understand the term policing by consent, which is not surprising, as you have not adopted it in quite the same way, which is yet another reason why I'm proud to be British and not American today.

Who are you to speak for all Americans - it seems from an outsiders perspective your nation is split on this, so while you may say all these things, your President and government appear to be actively making things worse.

anyone who’s ever been in a car accident could tell you.

i’ve been hit more than once as a cyclist. I certainly let out a string of colourful expletives, and various comments from shit that hurts to what the fuck. Jesus Christ has been invoked also.

never has the first words out of my mouth once I realise I’m still alive been to insult the driver or even think about the driver. If his first thought is “fucking bitch” rather than “thank fuck I’m ok, is everyone else ok, did the car hit anyone, let’s assess the scene”, well that is very telling.

At present the vast majority of these confrontations taking place are from the left.

Is enforcing laws regarding illegal immigration what we'd consider tyranny though?
Also - rebellion is by it's nature dangerous.

When a car grazed me at a pedestrian crossing I saw red. I hammered on the car and called them a fucking cunt. I was so angry and shaken that they could have killed me, I'd have happily dragged then from the car and kicked their head in.
I'm not a violent person but I didn't appreciate having my life threatened like that.

Do you have any specific information or facts to back up your rather vague remark?

And all that is totally understandable.

But if you were a trained and disciplined firearms officer and on duty, hopefully you would have been able to contain your anger. If you couldn't, then that is a very big problem.

I think in those kinds of situations, we often react in unexpected ways, which can appear to be inappropriate to outside viewers, or at odds with the way we're actually feeling. I imagine that this may have been in play on both sides in this incident, with the victim driving away in a panic at her wife's cries to 'drive' when she should've complied, and perhaps on the part of the ICE shooter, saying 'fucking bitch' immediately afterwards?

Knowing that he's not a recent recruit, and has a long history with the department, apprehending rapists, human traffickers, and cartel members, without any apparent incidents, the fact that he chose that day to shoot a comparatively harmless civilian woman at point blank range is bewildering. He should have been capable of dealing with the situation in a professional manner and de-escalating it.

If it wasn't deliberate on his part, but a matter of human error (not following protocol and stepping in front of the car), all I can think is that perhaps he wasn't used to dealing with the public, and so treated her in much the same way as he would treat a dangerous cartel member? If so, it's a huge failure of training.

In a reasonable democracy, this would be seen as a tragedy that would prompt changes in operational standards and training to ensure civilian and ICE officer safety. Unfortunately and unsurprisingly, Trump's administration isn't reacting that way.

I don't think I have seen anyone celebrate her death nor have I seen anyone say that "she deserved it " for being a liberal lesbian woman.

What happened was a tragic combination of circumstances of refusing to get out of a vehicle when instructed to by armed officers and driving towards an armed officer whilst his colleague had his hand in the side window.

Whether the officer genuinely believed and can reasonably prove that he thought his or his colleagues lives were in danger or not is for the subsequent inquiry to determine.

What is not helpful is deliberate misinformation by posters such as:
"there wasn't anyone stood in front of the vehicle " - there was.
"she was simply pulling out of her driveway" - she lived several blocks away.
"the ice officers removed her body like a piece of meat" - her body was removed by Fire Dept /EMS officers.

Right, but that context is important. You implied he was saying stupid bitch as in, her 'stupid' behaviour was responsible for the result.

But no, he or one of his fellow agents just randomly called a woman they had just shot in the fact three times a 'fucking bitch'.

If you think that's excusable, there are no words for you.

Trump was voted in. Mass deportations were a huge promise in his campaign. The anti-deportation choice did not win.

But they can’t leave it be, because they believe they have a moral right to stop ICE. Again, very similar to pro-lifers who refuse to face reality, that their views are just not very popular

Very much coming across as victim blaming.

What doesn't help is the leader of a country saying she was a domestic terrorist who put several ICE agents in hospital. I think his lies have more reach than anything a mumsnetter says.

The 'inquiry' is sewn up. The ICE officer will get off scot free. If he doesn't, Trump will pardon him. Posters are already gloating about that and I know it's true.

And to a lot of Americans, particularly Republican men, liberal women are absolutely the enemy and deserve everything they get. Even to Saint Graham of Linehan, this is all the result of a psychosexual drama that women can't help playing.

My only hope is that this repulses moderate suburban women and they remember it when they vote.

Quote :" I just honestly don't think it's responsible to encourage people to naively involve themselves in direct action and direct confrontation with armed forces who are on active duty. It's clearly going to lead to situation when things don't end well."

This bit :" armed forces who are on active duty"

Armed forces on active duty, on US suburban streets.

I made a post above about this above , and about how the concept of policing by consent works. I will repost a couple of photos.

Can you identify what photo below shows armed forces who are on active duty ?

ICE agents, along with other law enforcement are specifically trained to NOT shoot through car windows. Doing so can create a more dangerous situation by creating a driverless accelerating car. He acted against his training. If he was traumatised by his previous experience, he had no business being on active, armed duty.

No, it's the consequences of his decision that were grave, to say the least.

You're missing the point of my comment, but then that's not surprising. Frankly, I don't care I'm not an American.

I do feel sorry for your nation and the thousands and thousands of people who live in fear in America.

This I'm sure will be doing great things for the American tourist industry it was already in decline!

Good luck and I hope you never find your self in trouble with the police or ICE in America - easy for you to be so dismissive until it happens to you or one of your loved one I bet!