Military conscription

[Donotpanicoknowpanic]

There is lots of talk about if ww3 happens then military conscription will happen

This is basically people who sit in an office safely saying we need to either send ourselves or out children to fight and die in horrible conditions

Am I unreasonable to think that anyone who thinks this is a good idea

They should be the first ones to sign up and to lead by example

Any politicians who think this is a good idea, there children should be the first to go

Russia is literally sending troops in wheel chairs and crunches to the front line

So age, disability and gender will not be a problem for anyone who supports any conscription policy's, they can go first

Also the UK will not be invaded, we are not Ukrainian, If we were more like Ukraine I would be more in favour of this as the country itself is under threat

To defend a home and way of life, many young, bright and capable people are leaving the UK to start a life in Australia because they can't make a home here. People will just leave rather than stay and fight

No nation is going to invade the uk. If there is a threat from Russia it won’t be from an invasion, the manpower to invade and hold/run the uk isn’t there, would they take Poland, Germany, France, Italy, Finland, the Netherlands, Sweden before they reached us? How many millions of soldiers would that take? Any war would be via the destruction of our country through long range bombing, or more likely attack would be of a cyber nature, water, power, internet etc, not Russian troops landing on the coast. I don’t think conscription would happen, we are a very different people to those of 1939. There is no longer a sense of pride and duty, and what army wants thousands of conscripted men and women who don’t want to be there. We do however need to take the threats seriously and increase our spending on defence and infrastructure massively, we need as a nation to be much more self reliant and there needs to be huge support and investment for farming and energy production. Governments of all colours have buried their heads in the sand for far too long, they don’t look beyond the next election cycle and frankly it’s depressing. I’d be getting rid of the triple lock, and would freeze all increases in pensions, benefits and public sector salaries for at least the next five years and invest heavily in defence and long term sustainability. We need to stop the political infighting and the partisan politics and start working together for the benefit of the country.

I think we have as much to fear from our own government as any other leader, our country is being gradually destroyed.

So I'm (theoretically) an army conscription officer

There is a war happening on Europe's eastern front

The UK has not been bombed

I knock on your door

Anyone over 18 is coming with me to fight on the front line

So women and men (equal rights)

So the people who are happy with conscription are all happy to go without complaints

Everyone else happy?

I wonder if any of the posters have spent any time on the social media that young people use. I don't see a situation where young people would ever agree to war except if the UK is being attacked directly. We all have so much information now to know how incompetent our governments are. All wars are about power and money primarily. Look at how much money the US oil companies made after the Iraq war. I have zero respect for any of the governments that I have experienced in my lifetime and I would no confidence in their power to make the right decision. Our sense of community has also changed and we are much more global. Would a young person who heritage is from a particular country be happy to participate in a war against that country. A war against Russia for example would mean that UK young people are killing Russian young people (not Putin). All the veterans I have ever heard have always said that war is never worth it.

I’m ex-military and I don’t think anyone in their right mind ever WANTS conscription…..

But the shit has to have really hit the fan for it to become a thing here….as in a sophisticated, armed force has actively mobilised to invade.

Then we are left with 2 options:

• conscript soldiers and fight a war
• don’t conscript soldiers and surrender to an invading force

Neither are nice options, but one is better than the other. Without conscription in WW2, German forces would have absolutely invaded mainland Britain. We are a small nation with a small military (even smaller now because of the genius idea that was the “Army 2020” restructuring and redundancy plan 🫠 which those of us serving at the time said was a fucking moronic idea) the numbers simply don’t work if we were to go to war imminently.

But that’s where NATO obligations come into play.
Most of those countries you mention are NATO members…..”an attack on one is an attack on all”.
If Putin invaded Poland for example, the U.K. (and every other NATO member nation) are obligated to come to their aid.

What if ww3 broke out when someone else was PM? What if say, Badenoch was PM?

What happens if the US invade Greenland? Interesting times OP. War is never the answer though. I think the having nuclear weapons is the best defence. I bet Putin would not have invaded Ukraine if they hadn't given them up.

apologies if this comes across as harsh. If the UK was to join the war or get invaded and was consuming ammunition at the same rate as Ukraine, and receiving the same number of killed an injured as Ukraine, the British army would last approximately 3 to 4 weeks before it ran out of soldiers and ammunition that is why conscription is necessary.

However, the army has already conducted studies and has come to the conclusion that 60% of first round eligible British conscripts would be rejected on the grounds of either being too fat, on drugs, have mental health or other health issues so on. Therefore we will burn through the useful people pretty quickly before relaxing the requirements and requiring the elderly and others to be conscripted.

Even if we had the people, the army would have to drastically cut basic training times because they would be loosing soldiers too quickly. That would mean badly trained and ineffective soldiers going into combat. They wouldn't last as long and the casualty rate would increase and we would burn through conscripts quicker.

Second the UK only has a handful of weapon and ammo factory's they couldn't keep up with the demand. Also they would be pretty high on the Russian missile target list. We would have to hope that a friendly country would sell us some ammo.

Another point worth considering is that the NHS would collapse in the first 3 weeks as it can't treat the number of injured at the level we are talking.

If we are really optimistic, the UK would last 5 months at Ukrainian consumption rates. It doesn’t look good.

The next question is in that situation would the government consider Nuclear weapons to prevent inhalation of the British people?

I wouldn’t go, my husband wouldn’t go and I can only think of one friend that would possibly rather fight than be punished.

Conscientious objectors would probably be much more common now.

Denmark is a NATO member, so normally I’d say that another country invading Danish territory would immediately invoke NATO’s Article 5 (attack on one is an attack on all)……but fuck if I know how that works when it’s one NATO member invading another 🫠🫠🫠🫠

Probably. Whoever is asking for others to go can step up first.

We can't even fund our current army properly let alone add in a load of conscripts. Conscription can't happen unless a lot more money is put into the armed forces and Labour is currently willing to do that.

Given the situation outlined in my post above, prisons would be full.

it's safe to assume that the government would start using the plan written for how to deal with people in the aftermath of an nuclear attack.

you would be forcibly conscripted to provide labor at home for the war effort (ammo factory, NHS body dragger, infrastructure repair)

But do you think NATO is going to survive the next few years, will NATO countries still be able to meet their obligations under ARTICLE 5 without the support of the USA? Trump has made his feelings very clear. We live in dangerous times.

War isn't started by mutual consent of two parties, it is started by hostility of one party.

Why Ukraine should matter? Because if Russia would manage to get Ukraine, they wouldn't stop there. They would conscript the Ukrainians and use them as the attack force at Poland, Slovakia, Baltic countries, Bulgaria and Romania. And those are NATO members. (This isn't a conspiracy theory, this is what Russia is doing right now with people from the occupied parts of Ukraine).

Peace works only when it is better than alternative - for everyone. Which means it works only when the potential aggressor fears that costs of starting the war are too big to make it profitable for them.

The UK would be deciding whether you care about setting the price tag for starting a waror whether you are ok with the price going down. And boots in the ground war isn't the only war.

If there was an invasion then I think many would feel differently. Genuine conscientious objectors like Desmond Dawes who refused to handle a gun in WW2 that Hacksaw Ridge was based on can do vital roles that do not involve fighting. In any invasion women and children are the most vulnerable, rapes occur in every theatre of war. Very few people actually want to fight. But if the enemy was actually at the door and would summarily execute people for not fitting in with whatever their ideals were and your sisters were forced to work as Comfort women which also happened in WW2 isn’t that worth fighting for. Look at history, we fool ourselves if we think we are anymore civilised than our ancestors.

You’re right.
Its terrifying times.
Last I heard, the US military budget is bigger than the next 7 countries combined….so even if every other NATO member had a whip round, there’s probably not enough money/firepower/manpower to make much difference.

How do they treat them?

Unless the government went full on Nazi Germany and started shooting those that didn’t comply they would struggle to do that.

Chew us up and shit us out when they’re done is the simple answer.

The “resettlement packages” when you’re getting out are a joke….and I was mentally well when I got out.
But it is very much sign the paperwork, and “bye 👋🏻 our obligation to on to you is over now, rely on charities if you need help”

There's no suggestion that we would use conscription in a modern war, so this really isn't a subject to get your knickers in a twist about.

Why? Ukraine is a modern war.

We wouldn’t go to war, obviously, because it could be suicidal. The USA would destroy us, we have to be their ally.

On the conscription front, a conscripted army is a terrible idea, surrender is a worse one.