In laws being so insensitive after the death of my newborn nephew

[McFool]

NC’d for this

My newborn nephew died at a few hours old on Christmas Day. He was my sister’s first child and it was completely unexpected. I’m very close to my sister and this has been absolutely devastating, and a really difficult few weeks. My focus right now is on supporting her and trying to juggle that with work, looking after kids etc. I’ve been making sure they get fed, liaising with the professionals, talking to family for them, looking for funeral care etc to make life a bit less shit for them. it’s been tough and basically everything that is not about my sister and her DH has been completely sidelined.

On Boxing Day DH told my ILs what happened and I got messages but along the lines of “Your poor sister! Hope everyone is OK”. I know some people are really shit when it comes to grief so I just replied thanking them and saying no everyone isn’t ok we are heartbroken but I appreciate the message.

This week they have sent more messages, with a fundraiser for a baby loss charity about running 2k a day in January and “Maybe you and your sister could do this, try and raise some money”. I replied to say my sister can’t even get out of bed let alone go for a run! No reply, just a heart reaction. They are now pestering me and DH to choose some dates for a Center Parcs holiday we normally go on with them at Easter.

AIBU this goes beyond not understanding grief, and it’s utterly insensitive. These are adults, you don’t have to experience loss to know the encrusting pain it must cause someone. I’ve told DH I’m not going to Center Parcs as right now I’m feeling pretty unforgiving. I honestly feel like I’d be happy never seeing them again.

Or do I need to get out my grief fog? We lost our dad a few Christmases ago and I know looking back I didn’t behave reasonably around that time!

YABU

I’m so sorry for your loss. Ok, I think asking about Center Parcs is quite normal, life will and has to go on for the sake of the other children. The running one is ludicrous, it is something to think about a long time from now and the ‘hope everyone is okay’ is just clumsy. These are not unforgivable things though, just awkward people IMO. Don’t fall
out with them, ask your husband to ask them to give you some time, choose a date for Center Parcs, you can’t be by your sisters side 24/7. I’m saying that with genuine care, I know I sometimes come across as cold and I hope I haven’t.

They’re being dreadfully insensitive. I’m so sorry for your and your sister’s loss OP. It’s heartbreaking and you should grieve and support your sister for as long as you both need to.

I suspect many of these responses are from English people. The English are particularly bad at death, which seems to send them into hitherto unreached apoplexies of awkwardness. They even struggle with the word itself, often preferring softer euphemisms to replace died (eg “X passed”)

It really isn’t hard: just “Oh that is just the most awful, shocking news. I’m so sorry to hear it. I imagine you’re all just in a state of shock right now, but if there’s anything at all we can do, please let us know.”

Would that just about have covered it @McFool?

YANBU.

I think the in-laws suggestion is perfectly ridiculous right now - but I CAN give them enough grace to see where they're coming from, and it's a position of care and thoughtfulness. I'm assuming they don't know their dil's sister very well, but are thinking enough about this loss to see a way to make it MEAN something.

That is an entirely personal decision, and the timing of when the grieving person is ready to make it can be anything from the same day, to never - and all of that is fine - but all I see is the in-laws reaching out with something they think might help.

My experience when my dad died is that nothing anyone says is either helpful, comforting or makes it even slightly better. The only things that helped were practical things - looking after my dog, looking after my son, taking me to Costco on the pretence that we could use their card to save a bit of money on the wake, and then paying for everything at the till... All of those acts were unambiguously helpful. Everything anyone said was degrees of either utterly useless, meaninglessly trite or downright stupid. However, it was all said with the best intent, so even when I was pissed off by something, I could see it was very much a 'me' problem.

What are you on about? What a pointless comment to leave on this thread.

What is wrong with you? OP’s newborn nephew died on Christmas Day!

Genuinely so sorry for your loss.

But yes YABU. They haven’t done anything horrific- I was expecting much worse. I think in their clumsy way they were trying to be helpful/ show they care. Unless they have form for being horrific just delete and ignore.

Plus it sounds like it might do you all good to go on holiday in a few months, especially your kids. Make your DH sort the arrangements but don’t not go (because of this at least), go for your kids’ sake as much as anything else. I’m sure your sister wouldn’t want their lives put on hold either.

I’m so sorry for your sister and your family’s loss OP.

But I have heard people complain about people saying that they can imagine how they feel, and have also heard people say that 'let me know if anything we can do' isn't the right thing to say (there are articles on why you shouldn't say this, e.g.: https://medium.com/letters-to-my-kids-and-anyone-else-whos-listening/why-let-me-know-if-you-need-anything-means-absolutely-nothing-649006c20767). There are people who wouldn't like the words that are so obviously right to you at all.

There is no perfect thing to say - and no words that will truly help anyway. As a few people have said in this thread, often the most hurtful thing of all is people who are so scared of getting it wrong and so say nothing and avoid the topic.

My sincere condolences to your sister and her husband and the wider family.
Absolutely devastating for you all.

So sorry for your loss ❤️
I lost a twin 20 years ago. A cousin I was very close to gave me a card which said ‘congratulations on the birth of your babies’. She told me this was because she didn’t want to ignore the baby who’d died and still wanted to acknowledge her. Friends and family were horrified. Part of me wanted to explode with anger about how insensitive she was being but I know my cousin well and understood where she was coming from so chose to keep calm and move on. My point is many people don’t know what to say in such devastating situations and we don’t want to push people away who are clumsy or not responding in exactly the way we think they should but who ultimately mean well. Take time out for yourself and your sister to grieve. I cannot recommend SANDS enough. A lady from the organisation even visited me at home. As I said this was 20 years ago, so I’m not sure if home visits still happen but they truly helped me find my way through the heartache. The pain never truly goes away but you will all feel better one day. Be patient with yourself and hold on 🥰

I am angry, so angry. I don’t know at who. Everyone. No one.

I do think it’s better sometimes for people to just say nothing than the wrong thing, and I know I’m not myself right now

This is the crux of it. Even in the face of grief you have this self-knowledge. Try to hang onto that, and give yourself some space & grace. The poets have long called grief a kind of madness.

You're projecting your anger and utter sadness & helplessness in the face of this awful meaningless death onto your in-laws. They are trying to stay present with you. I suspect that if they weren't in touch, you'd be angry about that.

Let your DH deal with them, and get him to tell them you need some space.

They haven't done anything wrong - don't compound the awfulness of your beautiful nephew's death with a family breach.

That’s true. Better to actively DO something (eg caring for kids or pets) than offer abstract help. My very good friend offered specific practical help when my brother in law died. She was amazing.

This is a hard time for you and your sister and you really need to talk to a friend not mn where everyone has there own priorities to put across. I personally don’t think you’re being unreasonable. Personally I believe that there is no difference in this situation between clumsy and insensitive, you should either take the time to question if your response is appropriate and if you don’t have the time or inclination you should either say nothing at all or you are being insensitive. None of that matters really though you need support and a friend that’s on your side no matter if you’re right or wrong. Hopefully that’s your husband. I’m so sorry for what your both going through.

I think I’m more in line with the poster you responded to go, to be honest. Who the hell suggests a charity run to a mum who has lost her newborn? Seriously, who?

Perhaps calling them shits goes too far, but that is a really appalling thing to have suggested.

OP, get your DH to deal with them now. I’d tell him you don’t want to hear from them right now. Frankly, he needs to have a stern word with his mother.

I'm so very sorry for your loss.

I think their behaviour sounds incredibly insensitive.

I do understand people find it hard to know what to say, but I think most people would manage better than that. Certainly after you pointed out your sister couldn't get out of bed, a normal person would manage to apologise and realise they'd said the wrong thing.

I also agree with PP that it is entirely different from a bereaved parent making their own decision to fundraise or throw themselves into an activity following a bereavement.

I would just go quiet until much later on. Absolutely don't bother about the Centre Parks thing. It's fine to just disengage; you're upset.

Exactly, and for some people, going on a holiday can help them feel better. When my dad died and I wanted to cancel plans with my friend, she dragged me out saying he'd want me to go on living, and that I'd regret not doing things if anything ever happened to anyone else. I did think this was really harsh and I personally wouldn't tell someone to get straight on with things, but she wasn't trying to be mean, and people really do grieve differently.

Sometimes people don't know how to react when someone is grieving. There is always a danger of not saying quite the right words, or deciding that saying nothing is better, but the person is then upset because you haven't said anything. We all grieve differently, and there's no right or wrong way.

Of course you're angry, it's part of the grieving process and it's a natural reaction. The fundraising isn't something your MIL meant for you and your sister to do now, but in the future. I was extremely ill with bacterial meningitis and septicemia and was given a 30% chance of survival, when I was 26. Nearly dying and knowing I nearly didn't make it, is hard psychologically, it's something I had to deal with emotionally. One of the ways to help me cope, was to raise awareness through the Meningitis Research Foundation, it gave me purpose and focus.

The holiday, is probably not something you are interested in right now, and to be honest I wouldn't expect you to be. However, put it on the back burner, and come back to it at a later date. It doesn't have to be Easter, it could be later in the year.

Talk to your husband, explain how you feel. Your in-laws aren't doing anything wrong as such. You're angry, upset, grieving and wanting to lash out. Would some grief counselling help do you think?

I'm so sorry for your tragic loss.

I have come to the conclusion that some people severely lack empathy and just cannot imagine deep pain / serious, life changing problems. I haven't lost a child but been through some very dark times (DH suicidal) and the trite, throwaway comments from friends who are genuinely good people was quite an eye opener. And the expectation that things will be better, you will be 'ok' a matter of days or weeks later.

It beggars belief but I try not to take it personally. Lucky them (in a way) they have not been through some of the horrors I have and it's beyond them to imagine it.

They’re trying their best. Taking you on a Centre Parcs holiday is kind & generous. I don’t really see what they’ve done wrong.

Btw, re. the charity run and the practicalities of that: I would say, some people are incredibly poorly informed about this sort of thing. I know someone who had a stillbirth a week or so before term, and her own mother assumed she hadn't had to go through labour because of it. I know that is not the situation here, but I think there are people out there who genuinely do not connect the dots and realise that the physical recovery the OP's sister has to go through will be just as hard and full-on as if she still had her baby with her, and worse because she is dealing with such a horribly traumatic grief.

Speaking as a mother who has burried one of her children I think you’re being a little over sensitive (understandably) and they’re clumsily trying to help. I’d have a word and suggest that A your not up for planning a holiday right now and B whilst you appreciate their intentions your not ready to discuss the situation yet so you appreciate it if they could refrain from being it up

It's not appalling.

It's clumsy, for sure, but they are watching someone they love go through a huge family trauma, and they are trying to show they care and are thinking of op.

I would for rather someone being clumsy but kind than someone ignoring me altogether, which happens all too often.