Husband thinks it’s ok to let children change baby’s nappy

[Anonymous236864]

Am I being unreasonable in telling my husband I don’t want him to invite older children to ‘help’ change our baby’s nappy? Sure they can be helpful and bring the wipes over but he instructed an older girl (4yrs old) to rub barrier cream on my daughter. When challenged he said ‘but she likes it’.
I said that even though it’s innocent I don’t want either of these girls to grow up thinking other children or people other than a responsible care giver is okay to touch their private parts. He told me I was being ridiculous. As someone who was sexually abused as a child (an older child would touch me inappropriately) who found out later that these parts are private I really don’t want my child or other children to grow up not realising that private parts are private until it’s too late. Does that sound unreasonable?

I think a sibling/step sibling doing this under supervision is ok, but not a random parade of kids.
I remember helping to change my little brother’s nappy, I would have been 6, I loved helping to look after him.

However if it’s a boundary you want to enforce especially given your history I think it’s fine and your DH should support you in that.

You could compromise by letting the other DC help by fetching things or keeping baby entertained while you do the actual nappy changing.

This op. It isnt normal. It isnt ok. And instead of listening to you he is arguing about it.

Also, as relevant wider context, did you have extensive therapy after being abused?

This. Baby won't remember or care who changed their nappy.

Male view here if It makes a difference

Nope. It doesn't. At all.

Sibling or family friend I’m sure OPs concerns would be the same

That’s not what OP is worried about though

At best, your husband is a fucking idiot and completely unable to see the potential consequences of his actions in the future. Boundaries around touching genitals are there to be learnt and enforced. Not broken down and trampled on because he feels like playing teacher. If she wants to help (and I completely understand why it would be fun for her to do so, like having a real life doll) then she passes a nappy, fetches a nappy bag etc. What she doesn’t do is get taught that it’s ok to touch the genitals of another child. What happens if she then decides to play grown ups with a smaller child and remembers that changing nappies was fun, and it must be allowed and ok to do because uncle Anonymous let her do it with his baby?

The whole thing of whether it’s a sibling or an unrelated child is completely irrelevant. Siblings may well see each other naked growing up. There’s a huge, huge difference between seeing each other naked and thinking that touching someone else’s genitals is ok. Siblings can and do abuse siblings.

child of a friend, I think no.

If it was my 4 year old I would be angry and also would never leave them in your care or alone with your husband ever again.

I’d imagine that a 4 year old sibling would enjoy helping.

My elder sister, 10 when my younger sister was born, used to change nappies by herself.

I don’t think I’d want any children but siblings helping, unless it was e.g. fetching a nappy.

Would the child’s parents be happy with this? Do they even know about this? Kids want to help I understand but it’s someone else’s child so it’s not his decision to make on whether it’s appropriate or not

It depends who the 4 year old is. Is she the babies sibling or relative?

Nope, no difference. You’re being just as dense as any female who thinks it’s ok to teach a four year old that there are no boundaries in touching genitals.

Obviously the kid is entirely innocent. That doesn’t even need to be said. It’s the husband who is the issue here, not the child.

Why does it make a difference? Do you know the rates of sibling abuse?

I think we are also looking at this from the babies perspective only. What is your husbands motivation in encouraging the 4 year old to do this activity, is he trying to normalise the touching of private areas? Is he teaching trust with her now - because honestly in the cold light of day, this is how it looks.

helping change a nappy, absolutely. Encouraging a 4 year old to rub cream into a babies private areas whilst he watches, and then defends it saying ‘she likes it’ absolutely not.

OP think of this as if someone else explained their husband had done this to their own baby. Even without your own history of abuse, anyone would see this as a huge red flag and immediately be concerned as to the man’s motivation. Surely the 4 year olds mum can not be happy with this happening and especially not with the explanation ‘she enjoys it’. Not to put too fine a point on it, paedophiles truly believe the child enjoys the abuse and want to take part, so him saying ‘she enjoys it’ would be hugely concerning for me

Fetching things and maybe positioning and doing up the nappy I would think fine. Doing actual cleaning or creaming no.

Before your update I was in the YABU gang as my eldest 5yo does this occasionally as she wants to play part in looking after sibling - it’s a bonding thing. Friends kid, nah I draw the line.

OP, after your first post I was going to say YABU but for good reason, in other words it’s probably a bit of an extreme reaction but I get why you feel that way.

After reading your second post, YANBU as the scenario you have given is weird. The fact that she’s not a family member but your partner is insisting she does it doesn’t sit right. If she were a sibling and maybe a bit older, maybe. A non-related 4 yer old, nope.

You are quite right about teaching children about what is acceptable and what is not. At 4, they need to be learning that there are boundaries about other people’s bodies.

If I had a baby and a friend’s 4 year starting changing my baby’s nappy and started smearing Sudocrem on them I wouldn’t be accepting of it.

(There will probably be lots of people saying “Oh for goodness sake, take help where you can get it and stop being so precious. Babies don’t need to be asked if they want their nappy changed! No wonder society is crumbling if this is how we pander to children…”. Ignore them. The don’t get the subtleties of what you’re concerned about)

You are in the right and he should listen to your advice. How does the child’s parent feel? Cos I wouldn’t be happy if my 4 year old was doing this. At 4 years old pre schools and schools are teaching them that pants are private - Google the NSPCC Pantosaurus video. My kids know pants are private - what’s in them is private etc. so your husband is giving this kid very confusing ideas.

I am questioning why the husband wants to ‘normalise’ the touching of another child’s genitals, could this be so the 4 year olds boundaries are blurred when someone else touches the 4 year old?

I know no one wants to consider this as a possibility as it’s horrific, but that’s where my primary concern lies. What is his motivation in removing those boundaries from the 4 year old, potentially so she won’t see it as strange if he does the same thing to her?

Safeguarding of a child can never be taken too seriously, he needs to have no unsupervised access to this 4 year old.

OP, think back to when you were 4. Then imagine a friends dad had supervised you spreading cream on a babies genitals. Surely you can see this is concerning from an adults point of view, despite his clear attempts to gaslight you into thinking you are the weird one and you are over reacting due to your own history.

You know you aren’t over reacting, because you are posting here. You know this isn’t right.

Not unreasonable, pressed with my fat fingers though and ut went to yabu on the voting 🤦🏼‍♀️.

As the other parent, my dd watching your husband wouldn't bother me so much fir curiosity - my eldest and friends used to and used to change their 'babies' (dollies) at the same time. But the creaming/changing the nappy is a no no and could defo confuse them, especially as at Reception they'll learn PANTS.

She can help by bringing things needed and distract the baby by waving a rattle for her or something if that's needed.

Only this morning I was chatting with my 4 year old sons who can now recite that only Mummy, Daddy or a dr with Mummy or Daddy there touch their penis. We've been telling them that since they were under 2 and we also tell it to our younger child when he tries to grab their pens when on the toilet. Definitely wouldn't be happy about anyone physically helping with nappy changes so that everyone understands what is safe touch

Only this morning I was chatting with my 4 year old sons who can now recite that only Mummy, Daddy or a dr with Mummy or Daddy there touch their penis. We've been telling them that since they were under 2 and we also tell it to our younger child when he tries to grab their pens when on the toilet. Definitely wouldn't be happy about anyone physically helping with nappy changes so that everyone understands what is safe touch

@Hedgehogtimeagain exactly.

The DH’s response of “she likes it” made my eyebrows raise.

That is unusual, to say the least. Why would that be relevant? That’s not how 4 year olds work. They aren’t absolutely dying to put Sudocrem on babies and if they are it should be discouraged as it’s not hygienic nor appropriate.

How does the DH know she likes it? Why is he advocating for her to continue doing it? His response to being told it has to stop will be interesting and telling.

Impressed with all of the YANBU responses!

I think this is extremely concerning. If your husband genuinely thinks this is ok he needs educating in safeguarding. I would see this as a red flag from him in all honesty. Sorry OP.