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AIBU?

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Original poster

I dread phone calls with my deep thinking daughter

429 replies

Isthatmyleopard · 30/12/2025 02:56

My daughter is in her mid-20s and an incredibly deep thinker, she studied philosophy, religion and ethics and a MA in philosophy, she is considering a PhD. She was baptised/first communion as a child but we've had little engagement with the church lately, she however has returned, goes to mass often but not weekly. She is incredible, and I am very proud of her, but she never seems to be able to approach a topic lightly. It makes me dread phone calls as seemingly the most basic conversation can be turned into philosophy, theology or sociology. She isn't forcing a belief on me at all more so she is inquisitive, the adult version of a toddler who can't stop asking why and loves to play devils advocate, or have deep conversations about a totally abstract topic. In particular she loves to discuss how different philosophical schools of thought intertwine or compete with religion, the theology of various Christian denominations and the roots of breakaway churches/schisms. I often ask for a lighter phone call just about her life as she has friends and is social and sporty, but after a brief overview it always goes into ... and we spoke about this, followed by her asking questions on my thoughts on the topic. Even discussions about books go far deeper than I can handle. She also does it with sport, we both enjoy tennis but I can never just comment on a match without it turning into a conversation on the sociology of women in sports, the psychology of competition etc.
All that's to say I find it exhausting, if she were just sharing her thoughts I wouldn't mind so much, but it often comes with lots of questions such as what are your thoughts? Why do you think that?

Today we met for lunch and she told me it makes her sad I don't show the same interest in her interests as I do her brothers or call her as often, I explained why and that her brothers are more content with small talk so I find calling them requires less mental energy, she apologised and said she doesn't know how to turn off the deep thinking. She has a long term boyfriend who seems to be interested in the intellectual sparring so I'm not sure why she is so keen to get it from me.

AIBU to find this exhausting? How do I handle it before it damages our relationship?

OP posts:
Cherrytree86 · 31/12/2025 11:16

lizzyBennet08 · 31/12/2025 10:55

Honestly this threat is mad. It's fine that the op doesn't want to discuss deep philosophical issues every time they speak. Some times she might just want to know how the dds tennis match went ? . It doesn't make her a airhead or any other terms that have been bandied about on this thread. Of course there is also nothing wrong with sitting down over a glass of wine of a lazy meal and talking about the big life issues , it's how you really get to know someone but it's all about give and take and it does sound like dd struggles to have any conversation that's not 'meaningful' .. To be able to balance both us an important live skill and it doesn't mean you need to talk about Love Island or the going's on at Easyenders. It's likely this dd while super smart and interesting might struggle socially if she continues to be only have one type of conversation .

Yassssss! Some common sense! Who could possibly argue with this??

theunbreakablecleopatrajones · 31/12/2025 11:18

She sounds rather brilliant

But it's good for her to understand she needs to adapt conversations to different people and situations, so when it goes too deep steer it and tell her you're steering it. When she's physically with allow a few deep ones in the mix.

For many people this is an early adulthood phase, and once life - bills, career, kids, housing - intrudes, then a desire for lighter conversation for relief comes with it.

But do be honest and steer her - it will be good for her interactions with others.

Tessisme · 31/12/2025 11:24

FlockOfSausages · 31/12/2025 10:07

I have someone in my life like this and I also avoid them. There is something really off about trying to intellectually wrestle or question someone who doesn’t have any knowledge about the subject.

I’m laughing at your username🤣🤣 In a good way of course!! It paints a picture.

phoenixrosehere · 31/12/2025 11:29

I’m curious, OP.

You have written that she asks about your own thoughts and what you think about things. How much does your daughter know about you beyond being her mother?

Still reads to me she is trying to connect to you and learn about you as a person, and cares about what you think, your thoughts, and why. If she didn’t, she doesn’t seem like she would ask otherwise.

NeverDropYourMooncup · 31/12/2025 11:34

noidea69 · 31/12/2025 09:33

"I don't understand this post. Teaching other people the thing is a job in the field, as far as theology and philosophy are concerned. What other jobs in those fields do you think there are, apart from becoming a professor? I suppose with theology you could become a minister, but isn't that just another form of teaching people the thing?"

This is exactly my point, there are no jobs in this field, beyond teaching. Its just a pointless loop of teaching people to teach people to teach people something that outside of teaching as no real world application.

Show quote history

When is the ability to think and reason a useless skill? Many politicians have a PPE, as do people in Finance, Law and Business. The ability to understand complex societal structures, motivations, discourses and consider ethics is vital for healthcare policy, military/security strategy, for considering consequences in technology, domestic policy and data analysis that is used for myriad purposes.

To suggest that the only use of the skills gained from study of Theology or Philosophy is to become an RE teacher or lecturer in the same subject (ignoring the fact that teaching others who will go on to gain employment in the fields I've listed in my first paragraph is incredibly important - somebody in a position of power who cannot see beyond a feeling that the world is picking on them and somebody else must be to blame for their woes is at best useless, at worst catastrophic) is extremely shortsighted.

LighthouseLED · 31/12/2025 11:50

Many politicians have a PPE

That’s not exactly a ringing endorsement for the degree given how generally useless most politicians are!

carlchem · 31/12/2025 11:55

FlockOfSausages · 31/12/2025 10:07

I have someone in my life like this and I also avoid them. There is something really off about trying to intellectually wrestle or question someone who doesn’t have any knowledge about the subject.

Yes, I agree.
I mentioned it upthread but it would be like me talking in depth about what I did for my chemistry PhD and asking people for their thoughts on the matter. If one person is extremely well-informed about a topic and has studied this in great depth and the other has perhaps a basic general knowledge there's too much of an imbalance there. If a mathematician starts talking about their latest theorem in detail, the vast majority of people are not going to be able to keep up with them and it's going to become boring quickly.
The same applies to things like Philosophy. It's the imbalance of knowledge which is the problem. The OP's daughter should reign it in a bit and be more aware of the other person and where they are coming from.

ThatFairy · 31/12/2025 12:06

Whizzingwhippet · 30/12/2025 05:54

Just because what she wants to rabbit on about is seen as intellectual, it doesn't make it any more interesting for the other person than someone who won't shut up about types of car or their football team. She's indulging herself and ignoring the social rules of conversation. I agree that as her mum you need to let her know when she's doing it.

I agree. My SIL is like this, but about politics. Anti trans and feminism, constantly. I don't have much to say on the matters but if I voice a different opinion just for something to say instead of just agreeing for an hour she gets angry. I wish every conversation wasn't like this it's annoying

InterIgnis · 31/12/2025 12:07

blueskyblueseablue · 31/12/2025 02:32

It genuinely makes me laugh that someone in this thread wrote that we need more “normies” in the world. The idea that deep thinkers lack emotional intelligence, must be neurodivergent, or are somehow unable to attune to others is just as absurd as the opposite stereotype, that people who are comfortable only with small talk are unintelligent.

We live in a world where complexity is increasingly dismissed as boring, pretentious, or arrogant, simply because many people want things to be easy and immediately digestible. Ironically, this is also why so many struggle in real life: they have little tolerance for the complexity of the world we actually live in.

The hostility towards this young is appalling. If I were her mother, I would feel deeply sorry for her, not because there is anything wrong with her, but because she appears to be a decent, thoughtful human being who has been casually labelled by complete strangers as neurodivergent, emotionally unintelligent, or arrogant, without anyone knowing her at all.

For genuinely concerning topics, people often show far more indulgence. But apparently, being “deep” has now become a flaw. We already live in a world dominated by “normies”, many of whom also set the global agenda. If a mother cannot tolerate one daughter who enjoys deep conversations as much as another who prefers constant frivolity, then yes, we really are living in a very sad world.

Those deep thinkers that cannot socially engage with those they’re trying to socially engage with do indeed lack emotional/social intelligence. Much like their middling and shallow counterparts that struggle with the same.

Being ‘deep’ isn’t a disadvantage, and no one has said it is. Being unable, or refusing, to read a room and adapt to the people and environment you’re trying to engage with, is. Something being a positive and valuable quality does not mean it cannot be expressed poorly, which is the issue here.

ThatFairy · 31/12/2025 12:52

Jamesblonde2 · 30/12/2025 16:47

She lacks emotional intelligence if she’s not capable of changing her conversational style to suit the moment. Just tell her you can’t be arsed listening to it.

That would go well ...

"What do you think of the theory that we are all one and that consciousness is all that really exists ?"

"I can't be arsed with this !"

LighthouseLED · 31/12/2025 12:55

ThatFairy · 31/12/2025 12:52

That would go well ...

"What do you think of the theory that we are all one and that consciousness is all that really exists ?"

"I can't be arsed with this !"

Show quote history

It’s answering the question perfectly though 😂

Cherrytree86 · 31/12/2025 13:31

ThatFairy · 31/12/2025 12:52

That would go well ...

"What do you think of the theory that we are all one and that consciousness is all that really exists ?"

"I can't be arsed with this !"

Show quote history

@ThatFairy

i think it’s a perfectly fair response tbh.

NeverDropYourMooncup · 31/12/2025 13:33

LighthouseLED · 31/12/2025 11:50

Many politicians have a PPE

That’s not exactly a ringing endorsement for the degree given how generally useless most politicians are!

Yes, how funny. The ability to take the piss in a quick soundbite isn't in any way how some of the most awful ones have got into positions where they can do the most damage, is it?

Jinglejells · 31/12/2025 13:45

She sounds incredibly exhausting and I think she thinks she is interesting and fascinating, when she probably bores the hell out of people. I can’t imagine her having many friends, or even a partner? Does she? Someone needs to tell her to pack it in.

Jinglejells · 31/12/2025 13:46

And I think she thinks she sounds intelligent but she doesn’t.

ThatFairy · 31/12/2025 13:59

My mum's always talking about how we are all one and I hate it. The concept in itself annoys me but she goes on about it and then follows it saying nothing is real but love and I don't know why but it makes me angry. I steer clear of philosophical talking because it always ends up like that

phoenixrosehere · 31/12/2025 14:17

Staringintothevoid616 · 31/12/2025 08:25

Actually. I think if anyone had emotional intelligence they would most likely observe that the world these days is set up for superficiality. Debate is discouraged (see the increasing focus on binary thinking - which feeds into algorithms), lack of nuance etc. Many people’s brains aren’t wired in this way and not having an outlet to be themselves it very stressful. Anyone with emotional intelligence would be able to spot the issue of telling this group it is unreasonable to be themselves. The DD presumes a conversation with her DM is a safe space to be herself.

Show quote history

I agree with this and I find this thread disappointing.

Understandable that others would find such talk frustrating just like some would find constant small talk the same and yes, there are time and places for both. Saying that, I would hope a bit of both would be possible when talking to your own parent on the phone. This isn’t exactly as if this is some random friend or group the daughter is talking to, it’s her mother.

Posters ridiculing her daughter and coming out with all sorts of reasons including throwing out neurodivergent is ridiculous. I disagree with many others and think the major issue is actually that daughter is poorly trying to connect with her mum. I don’t think she would have mentioned her brothers and apologised for her behaviour otherwise if she was like what too many posters are deciding she is.

OP was also asking for suggestions not for people to just insult her daughter and people they assume are just like her.

It’s seems more to me different talking styles. OP has said that they do small talk first and then it goes into her daughter wanting to do deeper conversations.

“I often ask for a lighter phone call just about her life as she has friends and is social and sporty, but after a brief overview it always goes into ... and we spoke about this, followed by her asking questions on my thoughts on the topic.”

I can see it being tedious yet it also sounds like basic conversation and trying to connect with her mum since daughter is asking her questions vs just talking at her.

I’m not sure what the compromise is OP because I don’t think either of you are wrong.

Daughter obviously cares for you and about what you think if she is asking you questions and your thoughts and wanting to hear them.

Cyd4 · 31/12/2025 14:19

phoenixrosehere · 31/12/2025 11:07

I think it’s the assumption that someone is ND that people loathe going off an OP’s feelings/perspective about their own child.

Her daughter could be poorly trying to connect with her mother without her needing to be classed as ND or suspected ND.

If she was doing the type of talking OP would prefer, I think fewer would be claiming ND because such talk is considered normal, every day, surface level, expected chat from what several posters have written.

Show quote history

Well, quite. But - she isnt doing the type of char that the OP would like. Which, if she is unable to, can actually be problematic, as a young person trying to navigate the world.

And why is she poorly connecting - only with her mother? But other interactions are entirely, consistently as one would expect from a student (who sounds very lovely, has many other hobbies and interests, by the sound of it). Just saves the hugely intense ‘chat’ for her dear Ma?

I do not know the OP or her daughter personally. But I DO know what masked autism in smart girls can look like. And only being able to discuss special interests is a big flag.

AgingLikeGazpacho · 31/12/2025 14:20

Jinglejells · 31/12/2025 13:45

She sounds incredibly exhausting and I think she thinks she is interesting and fascinating, when she probably bores the hell out of people. I can’t imagine her having many friends, or even a partner? Does she? Someone needs to tell her to pack it in.

OP literally says she is social, has friends and a long term boyfriend. They say the bf enjoys this type of conversation and I'm guessing she's also found friends who do too (just like I have)

Cyd4 · 31/12/2025 14:30

AgingLikeGazpacho · 31/12/2025 14:20

OP literally says she is social, has friends and a long term boyfriend. They say the bf enjoys this type of conversation and I'm guessing she's also found friends who do too (just like I have)

Show quote history

That is terrific that she has found her ‘people’ (and you too!).

But she might need some support on how to not inflict the intense chat on others, who may not be into it. That does not come naturally to many people but is a very worthwhile skill in navigating one’s way through society. And having a relationship with her (very caring and supportive) Mum.

phoenixrosehere · 31/12/2025 14:34

@Cyd4

OP says others have no issue with this in her post so she isn’t saving it just for her mother.

OP says she prefers lighter chat like plenty of others have said on this thread yet they’re not considered ND but daughter is because she prefers/wants deeper conversation with her own parent?

I’m going off what OP has written in her posts about what her daughter has told her and what her daughter has mentiones.

I’m not assuming ND and not going to because it doesn’t change the fact that the daughter has mentioned the relationship between her mother and brothers.

LilacFinch81 · 31/12/2025 14:51

This reply has been deleted

Message deleted by MNHQ. Here's a link to our Talk Guidelines.

blueskyblueseablue · 31/12/2025 15:21

phoenixrosehere · 31/12/2025 14:17

I agree with this and I find this thread disappointing.

Understandable that others would find such talk frustrating just like some would find constant small talk the same and yes, there are time and places for both. Saying that, I would hope a bit of both would be possible when talking to your own parent on the phone. This isn’t exactly as if this is some random friend or group the daughter is talking to, it’s her mother.

Posters ridiculing her daughter and coming out with all sorts of reasons including throwing out neurodivergent is ridiculous. I disagree with many others and think the major issue is actually that daughter is poorly trying to connect with her mum. I don’t think she would have mentioned her brothers and apologised for her behaviour otherwise if she was like what too many posters are deciding she is.

OP was also asking for suggestions not for people to just insult her daughter and people they assume are just like her.

It’s seems more to me different talking styles. OP has said that they do small talk first and then it goes into her daughter wanting to do deeper conversations.

“I often ask for a lighter phone call just about her life as she has friends and is social and sporty, but after a brief overview it always goes into ... and we spoke about this, followed by her asking questions on my thoughts on the topic.”

I can see it being tedious yet it also sounds like basic conversation and trying to connect with her mum since daughter is asking her questions vs just talking at her.

I’m not sure what the compromise is OP because I don’t think either of you are wrong.

Daughter obviously cares for you and about what you think if she is asking you questions and your thoughts and wanting to hear them.

Show quote history

Amen 🙏

MissyMooPoo2 · 31/12/2025 16:12

Jinglejells · 31/12/2025 13:46

And I think she thinks she sounds intelligent but she doesn’t.

Very good point!

MissyMooPoo2 · 31/12/2025 16:18

phoenixrosehere · 31/12/2025 11:29

I’m curious, OP.

You have written that she asks about your own thoughts and what you think about things. How much does your daughter know about you beyond being her mother?

Still reads to me she is trying to connect to you and learn about you as a person, and cares about what you think, your thoughts, and why. If she didn’t, she doesn’t seem like she would ask otherwise.

This all reads to me like DD is trying to exert an assumed academic weight in a very boring and inappropriate way.