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The reactions to the Bondi Beach terrorist attack has shown how racist many posters are here.

1000 replies

TheTamerShrew · 15/12/2025 09:24

I’m posting because I’m struggling with how racism against Jews is being talked about here following the recent terrorist attack in Australia. What I’ve seen, again and again, is minimisation: it wasn’t really about Jews, it was more complicated than that, let’s not jump to conclusions, other groups have it worse. All the familiar caveats come out remarkably quickly when the victims are Jewish.

I want to say clearly: racism against Jews is racism. Full stop. It doesn’t become less serious because it’s uncomfortable, politically inconvenient, or doesn’t fit neatly into how some people understand racism. And it doesn’t need to compete with other forms of racism to be real or worthy of being named.

What I find particularly painful is how often antisemitism is explained away rather than confronted. We would rightly challenge this pattern if it happened after an attack on almost any other minority group. Yet when Jews are targeted, there seems to be an urge to dilute, reframe, or downplay what’s happened.
I’d really ask people to pause and self-reflect on why that might be.

Why does naming antisemitism feel harder?
Why is there a rush to qualify it, contextualise it out of existence, or deny it altogether?
Why is Jewish fear so often treated as oversensitivity rather than a rational response to a long and very real history?

Acknowledging racism is not an accusation against everyone else. It’s the first, necessary step in confronting it. If we can’t even name antisemitism when it’s staring us in the face, we have no chance of challenging it, let alone preventing it.

We don’t make the world safer by minimising hatred. We make it safer by recognising it honestly, even when that recognition makes us uncomfortable.

I hope this can be read in the spirit it’s intended: not to shut down discussion, but to ask people to explore and self reflect.

See the attached photo: in order to become Anti-racist, one needs to first acknowledge racism

The reactions to the Bondi Beach terrorist attack has shown how racist many posters are here.
OP posts:
Thread gallery
23
jeffgoldblum · 15/12/2025 20:17

Genocide is the intentional destruction of a people, in whole or in part, targeting national, ethnical, racial, or religious groups through acts like killing, causing severe harm, imposing destructive living conditions, preventing births, or forcibly transferring children, as defined by the UN's 1948 Genocide Convention. Coined by Raphael Lemkin, it's considered the ultimate crime under international law, involving deliberate acts aimed at eradicating a group's existence, distinct from mass killings by targeting group identity
Key Aspects of Genocide
intent : The defining element is the specific intent to destroy a protected group, not just general violence.

protected Groups: Focuses on national, ethnical, racial, or religious communities.

five Acts: Includes killing, causing serious harm, inflicting life conditions to destroy the group, preventing births, and forcibly transferring children.
Examples & Context
holocaust : A primary historical example of genocide
Rhwanda Genocide: The targeted killing of Tutsi people by Hutu extremists.

kkloo · 15/12/2025 20:17

calminggreen · 15/12/2025 20:10

agree with this

during world war 2 even ordinary Germans attempted to help Jews to safety during the holocaust. Not one Gazan attempted to help the October 7th hostages

Ordinary Palestinians attempted to help Jews after WW2 too.

The hostages were being held by Hamas, how were ordinary Gazans supposed to help get them to safety?

kkloo · 15/12/2025 20:18

jeffgoldblum · 15/12/2025 20:17

Genocide is the intentional destruction of a people, in whole or in part, targeting national, ethnical, racial, or religious groups through acts like killing, causing severe harm, imposing destructive living conditions, preventing births, or forcibly transferring children, as defined by the UN's 1948 Genocide Convention. Coined by Raphael Lemkin, it's considered the ultimate crime under international law, involving deliberate acts aimed at eradicating a group's existence, distinct from mass killings by targeting group identity
Key Aspects of Genocide
intent : The defining element is the specific intent to destroy a protected group, not just general violence.

protected Groups: Focuses on national, ethnical, racial, or religious communities.

five Acts: Includes killing, causing serious harm, inflicting life conditions to destroy the group, preventing births, and forcibly transferring children.
Examples & Context
holocaust : A primary historical example of genocide
Rhwanda Genocide: The targeted killing of Tutsi people by Hutu extremists.

Yes, that's the same one I gave you.
And that's the exact definition that people are using when they consider this to be a genocide.

jeffgoldblum · 15/12/2025 20:19

kkloo · 15/12/2025 20:12

I'll give you one.

Genocide means the deliberate destruction, in whole or in part, of a national, ethnical, racial, or religious group, encompassing acts like killing, causing serious harm, inflicting deadly living conditions, preventing births, or forcibly transferring children, as defined by the UN Genocide Convention

I have already done the job but obviously your own example shows that Gaza is not a genocide but a war.

OmNomShiva · 15/12/2025 20:22

kkloo · 15/12/2025 20:17

Ordinary Palestinians attempted to help Jews after WW2 too.

The hostages were being held by Hamas, how were ordinary Gazans supposed to help get them to safety?

How many Israeli civilians help repatriate the many more Palestinians held hostage by Israel ?

The reactions to the Bondi Beach terrorist attack has shown how racist many posters are here.
jeffgoldblum · 15/12/2025 20:22

Gaza is a war , started by Hamas terrorists , they are not being targeted for religious reasons or any other reasons listed and if you don’t understand the difference then I’m afraid there is no educating you.

kkloo · 15/12/2025 20:23

jeffgoldblum · 15/12/2025 20:19

I have already done the job but obviously your own example shows that Gaza is not a genocide but a war.

Nope, it shows that is a genocide. Obviously there's no point in us debating this point and filling up the thread, but you just need to understand that people are in fact using the same definition as you when they say that this is a genocide.

kkloo · 15/12/2025 20:26

jeffgoldblum · 15/12/2025 20:22

Gaza is a war , started by Hamas terrorists , they are not being targeted for religious reasons or any other reasons listed and if you don’t understand the difference then I’m afraid there is no educating you.

You realise you posted a UN definition right?
And UN linked bodies have called this a genocide.

I'm not the one who needs to be educated here.

OmNomShiva · 15/12/2025 20:26

jeffgoldblum · 15/12/2025 20:22

Gaza is a war , started by Hamas terrorists , they are not being targeted for religious reasons or any other reasons listed and if you don’t understand the difference then I’m afraid there is no educating you.

I think that the situation on October 7th was a reaction to Israel’s treatment of Gaza rather than an isolated incident out of the blue.

I mean, somehow Israel forgets all context and justifies its genocidal treatment of Palestinians by pretending that October 7th happened in a vacuum.

The reactions to the Bondi Beach terrorist attack has shown how racist many posters are here.
jeffgoldblum · 15/12/2025 20:29

kkloo · 15/12/2025 20:23

Nope, it shows that is a genocide. Obviously there's no point in us debating this point and filling up the thread, but you just need to understand that people are in fact using the same definition as you when they say that this is a genocide.

This will be my last post to you on this subject,
was Afghanistan a genocide?
was iraq a genocide?
do you know how many civilians died in those wars?
now we all know that those were wars but obviously as you clearly think that Gaza is a genocide and not a war then obviously you must class those as genocide too!
and if you do, you would be wrong.
and if you don’t then you are wrong about Gaza .

kkloo · 15/12/2025 20:30

OmNomShiva · 15/12/2025 20:26

I think that the situation on October 7th was a reaction to Israel’s treatment of Gaza rather than an isolated incident out of the blue.

I mean, somehow Israel forgets all context and justifies its genocidal treatment of Palestinians by pretending that October 7th happened in a vacuum.

I always remember an article following the Charlie Hebdo attacks, when the journalist said he believes news articles should carry a little history corner as a reminder to show that nothing happens without a past, it's always stuck with me and I think 'what's the history here?' but unfortunately there are many people in the world who think they can treat incidents like they just happened in a vacuum like you said.

jeffgoldblum · 15/12/2025 20:30

kkloo · 15/12/2025 20:26

You realise you posted a UN definition right?
And UN linked bodies have called this a genocide.

I'm not the one who needs to be educated here.

Did you actually read all the reasons? 🙄
you have no experience of war do you.

MsSmartShoes · 15/12/2025 20:30

I said to DH - “how bad must the comments be that every news outlet has removed them!”.

NorwegianinLondon1 · 15/12/2025 20:32

jeffgoldblum · 15/12/2025 20:22

Gaza is a war , started by Hamas terrorists , they are not being targeted for religious reasons or any other reasons listed and if you don’t understand the difference then I’m afraid there is no educating you.

Did you only start paying attention on October 7th ?

jeffgoldblum · 15/12/2025 20:32

OmNomShiva · 15/12/2025 20:26

I think that the situation on October 7th was a reaction to Israel’s treatment of Gaza rather than an isolated incident out of the blue.

I mean, somehow Israel forgets all context and justifies its genocidal treatment of Palestinians by pretending that October 7th happened in a vacuum.

You are aware that the concert goers and victims were not all from Israel? , the woman famously paraded dead and naked on a flat bed truck to cheering crowd was from Germany.

Livelovebehappy · 15/12/2025 20:34

OmNomShiva · 15/12/2025 20:22

How many Israeli civilians help repatriate the many more Palestinians held hostage by Israel ?

They’re not hostages though. They are prisoners awaiting trial for crime. People seem to think that just because they haven’t yet faced trial that they are hostages. They’re not. All the Palestians in confinement in Israel are in prisons, not held in tunnels.

jeffgoldblum · 15/12/2025 20:34

NorwegianinLondon1 · 15/12/2025 20:32

Did you only start paying attention on October 7th ?

No I have given more information to the background further up thread ! This has been ongoing for 20 to 30 plus years.

OmNomShiva · 15/12/2025 20:36

jeffgoldblum · 15/12/2025 20:32

You are aware that the concert goers and victims were not all from Israel? , the woman famously paraded dead and naked on a flat bed truck to cheering crowd was from Germany.

Do you imagine Hamas were checking passports when they indiscriminately murdered people ?

The point - which you missed - was that October 7th did not occur in a vacuum, yet Israel often adopts the false premise that it did.

SpaceRaccoon · 15/12/2025 20:37

I mean, somehow Israel forgets all context and justifies its genocidal treatment of Palestinians by pretending that October 7th happened in a vacuum.

Which context I wonder? The wars Israel didn't start, but had to fight against its neighbours? The intifadas where its civilians were blown up on buses? The constant rockets launched from Gaza? That context?

OmNomShiva · 15/12/2025 20:38

Livelovebehappy · 15/12/2025 20:34

They’re not hostages though. They are prisoners awaiting trial for crime. People seem to think that just because they haven’t yet faced trial that they are hostages. They’re not. All the Palestians in confinement in Israel are in prisons, not held in tunnels.

Oh

Israel’s underground jail, where Palestinians are held without charge and never see daylight

Exclusive: Detainees at Rakefet include nurse deprived of natural light since January, and teenager held for nine months

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2025/nov/08/israel-underground-jail-rakefet-palestinians-gaza-detainees?CMP=Share_iOSApp_Other

OmNomShiva · 15/12/2025 20:39

SpaceRaccoon · 15/12/2025 20:37

I mean, somehow Israel forgets all context and justifies its genocidal treatment of Palestinians by pretending that October 7th happened in a vacuum.

Which context I wonder? The wars Israel didn't start, but had to fight against its neighbours? The intifadas where its civilians were blown up on buses? The constant rockets launched from Gaza? That context?

The context was attached to the post you quoted.

BackToLurk · 15/12/2025 20:41

OmNomShiva · 15/12/2025 20:39

The context was attached to the post you quoted.

I think the point is that yours is a very selective ’context’.

SpaceRaccoon · 15/12/2025 20:41

OmNomShiva · 15/12/2025 20:39

The context was attached to the post you quoted.

In which case you left rather a lot out, but I've expanded on it now.

IAmAHomewardBounder · 15/12/2025 20:41

OmNomShiva · 15/12/2025 20:26

I think that the situation on October 7th was a reaction to Israel’s treatment of Gaza rather than an isolated incident out of the blue.

I mean, somehow Israel forgets all context and justifies its genocidal treatment of Palestinians by pretending that October 7th happened in a vacuum.

I don't know if you're meaning to but this comes across like you think October 7 was an acceptable thing to do. You don't think that, do you?

BackToLurk · 15/12/2025 20:43

IAmAHomewardBounder · 15/12/2025 20:41

I don't know if you're meaning to but this comes across like you think October 7 was an acceptable thing to do. You don't think that, do you?

Oh come on. They’re just ‘explaining’. Every atrocity aimed at Jews has ‘an explanation’.

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