To not want SC to move in?

[Phylllis]

This is uncomfortable to write but I’ll put everything down so I don’t drip feed.

I’ve been with DP for 12 years, meeting his SC when they were 2, 4 and 5; they’re now 14, 16 and 17. We have our own kids aged 7 and 5 (their mum also has a 10yo). We’ve always had them every other weekend and half the holidays. Their mum lives 1.5hrs away.

Relations with their mum have always been polite on the surface but difficult underneath. She’s never encouraged SC to apply themselves, to do homework, to stick to any hobbies or to work hard. They’d arrive with nits for months on end and not touch a book between fortnightly visits. I’d hear rumours of her badmouthing me through mutual friends. The children consistently did very badly at school. Nonetheless DP (and the schools, the SEN leads, CAFCASS and social services) never thought it bad enough to move them to us.

I’ve always said the children would always be welcome to move into ours. They’ve never wanted to.

In the past year, they’ve all repeatedly said they’re expecting to move in with us when they’re 18. They have bedrooms here and their mum is apparently planning to downsize and has told them that it’s fair that they live with their dad at that point as she’s had them until 18. The older two are in college, but barely attend, having failed all but 1/2 GCSEs, and the younger is on track for the same. The older two are exceptionally messy. They’re fundamentally nice kids but wilfully uninformed and screen-addicted, and can be entitled and demanding (as I’m sure all teenagers can be).

The thing is, I don’t want to be responsible for housing three lazy adults with zero work ethic indefinitely. Life is expensive and busy, and I don’t think it’s fair that their mum’s unilaterally decided this without discussing it. I’ve raised it to DP and he thinks it’s not ideal but that we have no other option. I don’t want it.

AIBU?

Because they don’t, that’s the bottom line.

Having empathy for the kids doesn’t mean that you consider this OP’s problem to solve .

Why on earth would anyone plan their lives around the possibility of grandchildren? Oh, no, we can't go travelling because we might have grandchildren one day!

FFS

No, it’s the dad’s problem to solve. But after 17years he is still not willing to do any actual parenting. When he told his oldest about the conditions on her moving in did he say it with love? With warmth? Did he tell her he would like her to move in but there had to be boundaries in place? Or did he just follow what the op wants (not knocking you for that op)

Also, these are the ops dc siblings - they will grow up seeing how their older siblings were treated.

But as you said their mother has equally let them down.

They weren’t discussing travelling they were suggesting moving abroad.

The children would also have lots of guidance from school as well. Attendance would have been chased. They were only with op and dad one weekend a fortnight so what was happening in the home on the other days.

There are plenty of children who have come up through rubbish home lives and made their way in life. I know because I am one - rubbish dad fucked off when I was child and paid bugger all in child maintenance for his three kids.

But why is moving abroad a problem?

Yes there are many kids that do well despite their upbringing and I am pleased that you managed it too - but what are the odds on all 3 dc managing it? It’s possible sure, but not likely. I really hope the 14 year old, at least, has good teachers around them. That can make the difference.

Yes in my case all three us of did. It is possible but our mother had a strong work ethic which was instilled into us. We also accepted advice and help we received.

I dare say that the children in this case have been subject to lots of in school support which has not been supported within their home life.

You had at least 1 parent there instilling a work ethic in you though.

I really hope you are right with the school support and they can do well just like you and your siblings did. It is heartening to read your outcome against posters saying these dc have no future, can go on benefits and will be unemployable.

Equally? I don't think so. Both OP and the dad tried to get them to their house when they were younger. Both the kids and mum refused. They chose to reject the help when it was at an age when it would have made a huge difference. That is why OP feels it's not her problem now to fix. I agree with her.
The mum and dad are not equally at fault. Not one little bit.

OP has zero legal connection to these children.
She has tried, but rightly doesn't want to sacrifice her children's home and peace to a chaotic home full of non working/studying young adults.

If OP splits with her childrens father, she might never see his other children again.

Her obligations are to her own two children.
Their father has failed his older children and there is no reason to believe he will do more for OP's children.
She needs to prioritise her own childrens future.
A house full of chaos is not conducive to a good education and positive routines.

It wouldn’t be if you’d spent your children’s childhood preparing them for independence, Knowing that you could go and live your life having ensured they’ve had the best possible education, gained qualifications, work experience given them a few years living at home to build up a deposit to buy or rent a home, taught them how to cook, taught them how to Plumb in a washing machine and do a bit of wallpapering, change a nappy etc

If you’ve done none of that then you’re a bit of a Cunt wouldn’t you say for leaving them to their own devices, And yes, I would say that about the mother as well.

You can’t expect to have much of a relationship with your grandchildren and your children as adults moving forward if you’re not even in the same country as them even if you’ve done everything right up until that point.

I think there’s less support now than there was during the 90s and the 2000s and there was bugger all then.
If I could go back knowing what I know now about career options and universities and apprenticeships, you’d be laughing.
It really does rely heavily on parents advocating for children and getting them to navigate the system as to what the outcome will be.
If you don’t have that, you do everything in life the hard way.

I disagree. There is more structured support for careers more so than there has ever been. Pupils have access to careers fairs, talks etc. Plus there is more structured supported in terms of pupil premium support, extra Maths and English support. Schools get judged on NEETS so they do put effort into reducing that number. The problem is the engagement of pupils especially those who all think they are going to be social media influencers or the like.

The op needs to ensure her two dc are not influenced by their older half siblings in this respect

Sadly I think you might be right. But there are still some teachers out there supporting kids with less than ideal home lives. I know one teacher at my dc school and the teacher is really going over and above even though the child in question (my dc friend) is no longer at that school.

I was a teenager in the 90s and needed school support due to my home life but sadly they did nothing. I would love to go back and advocate for myself and make different choices at school but I was knee deep in grief and my surviving parent was also in shock. That’s why I feel so frustrated with this thread because these dc have 2 living parents who have no reason not to raise them properly with good ethics but all they care about is downsizing/retiring early and money.

The pp who said what could the dad do when only having them eow - well how much contact with the schools has he had? What has dad said at parents evenings? Why did he work all the time and leave most of eow when his dc were visiting with his wife? Why didn’t he increase how often he saw them to every week (doesn’t even have to be for the whole weekend) so he is a more regular presence in their lives? If he is tradie why isn’t he teaching them these skills? My youngest (11) goes to their dad eow and goes to work with his dad (who is a tradie) and is already picking up skills.

Same point. The children are equally, if not more, likely to move away.

Shit! How did I ever get on in life by not being taught how to plumb in a washing machine? (clue: I never got taught because my parents couldn't afford one)(answer: I read the manual that came with the machine)
Never got taught wallpapering either. Or how to change a nappy. And I'm a self taught cook. Never went back to live with parents after Uni either. But hey, according to you my parents were cunts. Thanks for telling me!

Don’t do it OP, you will regret it. Put your foot down, they should stay with their mother

I get the impression some posters think the OP and her DH should never expect his DC to be independent ever. Or if that’s not what they’re saying, when would they not be ‘despicable’ to expect them to be independent? When they themselves need support?

Normally, MN posters are keen to tell us that children should be independent at 18. Apparently these 3 should be under no obligation to support themselves?

Yes, we can’t have the real children tarnished can we?

@Dorosomethingbeautiful why, maybe time for Dad to step up.

And posters aren't saying they should never be independent, but it's not like either parent seems to have given them any life skills yet, so maybe time for dad to start parenting. Get the impression he thinks throwing money at the problem will sort out parenting deficit

The idiots that say children should be independent when they’re 365 days past their 17th birthday are usually handed their arse.
But nobody is suggesting if you have raised them with any kind of input whatsoever that you shouldn’t be able to release them into the wild at some stage
It’s when you’ve done fuck all for the first 18 years you’ve got work to do for that little bit longer to ensure a successful launch
Or not depending on how you feel all about it
And whether you’re bothered or not, if people think you’re despicable.

I accept that the OP and her DH should support the SC, until they’re in a position to look after themselves, but that doesn’t mean they owe them indefinitely, certainly not until any GC have grown up, which seems to be what some of you are implying.

Apart from anything else, they shouldn’t be having DC until they’re in a position to take the responsibility themselves, not rely on their dad and his DW.

Who has said they expect the dad to house them indefinitely until imaginary GC have grown up? 😂