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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

To tell them not to bother coming for Xmas?

533 replies

WantToHibernate · 08/12/2025 07:54

We are doing Xmas dinner this year for my husbands family and my mum and brother. We have a mix of vegans, vegetarians and meat eaters so dinner menu will reflect this.

I’ve been vegan for 20 years and my daughter who is 17 has become vegan this year. My husband and other child eat meat.

My mother and brother have always disapproved of me being vegan. Over the years they’ve told me I’m wrong and will be ill. They also do stupid things like make animal noises when they eat meat which I just roll my eyes at. Now they’ve found out, whilst discussing Xmas dinner menus at our house this weekend, that my daughter has become vegan and they’ve responded as expected, telling her she’ll be ill, that she shouldn’t listen to me ‘brainwashing and bullying’ her, quizzing her on why she has become vegan, telling her she’s mad and no better than them. My daughter remained calm, said it was her decision, that I obviously haven’t bullied or brainwashed her, that she doesn’t think she’s any better than anyone else, she just wants to be vegan. When they continued were quiz her on why she has become a vegan, they called her a ‘typical preachy vegan’. She wasn’t preaching, she just answered their questions.

Things got heated as my mother started shouting. I told her that she doesn’t get to shout at my daughter in our house about this, and that if they both don’t stop the comments they can leave and not bother coming for Xmas. My brother said our mum can say what she likes and that I owed my mum an apology for saying that. My daughter left the room. My son told my mum and brother that they were out of line and went to check on my daughter. My mum and brother left.

My brother text later on to say that when they come on Xmas day they don’t want to be seated by me or my daughter. I’ve not responded as I wanted to cool down before I did, but my husband has said to just uninvited them because they’re arseholes and he’s not risking them upsetting our daughter on Xmas day. My daughter says she isn’t bothered and thinks they’re idiots.

If I uninvite them, I think that will probably be the end of my relationships with them but I think that is possibly for the best. There have been lots of problems with them over the years and I think we may be happier without them. They have had issues with other aspects of our life, choices we’ve made, my husbands family (who are all lovely) who they see as ‘snobby’, so the vegan issue is just another thing. They are ok is small doses. My other siblings have low or no contact with them and although I invited them to dinner too, they won’t come because our mother and brother are coming.

OP posts:
Fdsew · 10/12/2025 09:01

OP, well done.
My advice would be to hold the line hard here.
He has apologised and both you and your daughter have very graciously accepted it, however it would be a huge mistake for it to be business as usual.

It is good he is going to his older brothers home some hours away, but I think you need to remain cool with him.
His behaviour was absolutely disgraceful and he made a holy show of himself being so nasty to your child.
I don't think it will be good for him not to feel the weight of the consequences of appalling behaviour.

Keep your mother blocked and involve the police if you feel harrassed by her.

She should no longer have access to your family in any way.

On the vegan front, I am not one, but know of several in meat eating familys, and it really goes without comment, as it should.
It's no one's business except yours.

My dear friend is one and I love the challenge of producing fab food she adores when we have a girls night at mine.
Its vegan for the 4 of us and we all love it.
I hope you have a lovely peaceful holiday and you hold your boundaries very firmly with your brother and your mother.
This is ALL on them.

"Fxxk up and find out".

Ladybyrd · 10/12/2025 09:10

OP, preachy vegans don’t serve non vegans meat in their home! As for your son speaking up, I think what hit me most about this story was that he had the balls to do that and good on him. Maybe this has sunk in a bit with your brother.

As for your brother, a clearer picture is developing as to why you feel the need to protect him. She’s obviously quite toxic and this is rubbing off. I think it will do him the world of good to spend Christmas with your older brother.

I think all in all, you’ve archieved the desired outcome without having to have another showdown. No doubt your mother will try to twist it that she is the victim, but the fact that none of you now want to spend Christmas with her says I all. It’s sad, but that’s the life she’s carving out for herself by being unpleasant, not much choice but to let her crack on with it.

Imdunfer · 10/12/2025 09:14

WantToHibernate · 10/12/2025 08:42

Thanks for all of your comments, most of them anyway. Just to address a couple of things.

Firstly, a couple of people said something about me leaving my son to step in instead of doing it myself, which isn’t true. My mum was shouting and I told her that she doesn’t get to speak to my daughter like that. I told them that the comments stop or they can leave and that they wont be coming for Xmas. My daughter left the room and my son then told them they were out of line. I didn’t go after my daughter myself because I wasn’t going to leave them in a room with my son when things were heated and my mother was being aggressive, so my son went to check on his sister. I dealt with them, my son just happened to make a comment before going after his sister when he realised I was going to try to get them to leave. When they refused to back down and apologise, I opened the door and they left.

Secondly the whole preachy vegan thing, that isn’t me or my daughter. My partner ate meat when I met him and still does to this day. We agreed that our children’s diets would include meat and dairy when we discussed having children. Our son still eats meat. Veganism isn’t a topic we debate between ourselves or with anyone else, we just get on with life. Our daughter only brought up being vegan because of my mother’s comments. There is no preaching or judgement about food here. Any discussion about veganism has always been brought up by my mother, not us.

Thirdly, I’m not ashamed of my mother because of anything to do with class. I don’t know what class she would be anyway or how that is judged in today’s world and I don’t care. What I do feel is disappointed in her as a person. She is unkind and has been a terrible mother to us all. If it wasn’t for my younger brother, I wouldn’t bother with her at all. It is offensive to link working class people with this sort of behaviour. Terrible people and parents exist in all walks of life. It’s not normal to make animal noises when eating meat to try to upset others.

My younger brother phoned our older brother yesterday. He was very upset and said he thinks he’s really fucked up and lost me for good. He was honest to our older brother about what happened, said he had upset my daughter and that it all went too far. Our older brother told him that we can’t keep doing this, that he is a man now and we can’t make excuses for his behaviour. My younger brother said he realises how bad it’s got and that he’s ashamed and embarrassed of how he treated my daughter, but he feels trapped and doesn’t know how to deal with our mum.

He has since text me to apologise for what he said and for the text he sent about not wanting to sit by us, which he said our mum actually wrote and sent from his phone. That is definitely something she would do. He asked if it would be ok to speak to my daughter to which I said I’d talk to her and let him know. She agreed to speak to him and he has apologised to her and said that he should have told our mum she was wrong and that he was a ‘twat’ for joining in. He told her he’s going to sort himself out and be better.

He is going to stay with our older brother for Christmas and New Year and my older brother has asked him to work for him for a while, then consider going back to uni and he’ll help him get his own place. Older brother lives a couple of hours drive from our mum so we are hoping that putting distance between the two of them will work. He hasn’t yet told our mum that he is going to stay with our older brother for Christmas or the other plans and I’m expecting trouble when she knows. He thinks she’ll kick him out, which won’t be a bad thing.

I'm in awe of what fantastic brothers and sisters your little brother has.

I hope this incident and your refusal to bow down to it will prove the making of that young man's life.

BMW6 · 10/12/2025 09:22

I'm so glad that your younger brother has realised and apologised for his awful behaviour OP.

Wishing you a peaceful Christmas!

XWKD · 10/12/2025 09:23

Fantastic! It's great when doing the right thing works out.

ChikinLikin · 10/12/2025 09:43

That's a very moving update. Good on your big brother.

TeatimeForTheSoul · 10/12/2025 09:49

Wow you and your siblings sound so mature and resourceful @WantToHibernate , including your youngest brother who has taken responsibility for his actions.
I’m sorry some posters made you feel you needed to justify yourself in other areas eg being vegan. That’s clearly their issue, not yours.
Good luck navigating your mother’s anticipated tantrum. At least you know it’ll happen and you have your family’s support.
Happy Christmas x

Couldyounot · 10/12/2025 09:52

Well done to you and your big brother, OP. That's a lovely update

lizzielizard · 10/12/2025 10:03

Can I just say that I think you and your siblings are marvellous? Your younger brother is very lucky to have you all supporting him. I so hope he grabs the support with both hands and can break away from your mother. Have a happy and peaceful Christmas, all eating exactly what you want! 😄x

Original poster
WantToHibernate · 10/12/2025 10:04

We are cautiously hopeful. He has had these moments of clarity before though and did move in with us a few years ago for a while and seemed to be getting himself sorted before our mum got her claws back into him. He is that bit older this time though, has had the opportunity to see more of her behaviour since then, and from how upset my older brother said he was on the phone, I think that maybe the thought of losing us all could mean it’s different this time. Getting some distance will definitely be a good thing.

My younger brother also has a girlfriend now who seems lovely. Our mum doesn’t like her, which is no surprise to any of us. She never liked any of us having friends or boyfriends/girlfriends and there was always something wrong with everyone. His girlfriend is really close to her mum and siblings and has apparently told him that the way our mum behaves isn’t normal, so that’s another sensible voice he is listening to. She lives about 30 minutes away from my oldest brother so if he does go and live near him, he will be closer to her which he will definitely be happy about. 🤞

OP posts:
surprisebaby12 · 10/12/2025 10:16

Their behaviour is odd and not something you have to tolerate

Bloozie · 10/12/2025 10:25

That's a great update - and I love that you took the time to update, because I was invested in the injustice of it all.

I really hope your little brother manages to make a clean break this time and you can all just move forwards without your mother in your lives, because you all sound like good people, and I doubt she can change. But - miracles can happen, so well done for standing up to her. Maybe she'll take a lesson from it.

grumpygrape · 10/12/2025 10:26

Thanks for the updates OP. I think most of us 'got it' from your previous posts but there are some people here who like to weave their own truths 🙄
Fingers crossed your older bro can help younger bro to move out and on and you can have good family times together in the future. 🤗

Swiftie1878 · 10/12/2025 10:54

WantToHibernate · 10/12/2025 10:04

We are cautiously hopeful. He has had these moments of clarity before though and did move in with us a few years ago for a while and seemed to be getting himself sorted before our mum got her claws back into him. He is that bit older this time though, has had the opportunity to see more of her behaviour since then, and from how upset my older brother said he was on the phone, I think that maybe the thought of losing us all could mean it’s different this time. Getting some distance will definitely be a good thing.

My younger brother also has a girlfriend now who seems lovely. Our mum doesn’t like her, which is no surprise to any of us. She never liked any of us having friends or boyfriends/girlfriends and there was always something wrong with everyone. His girlfriend is really close to her mum and siblings and has apparently told him that the way our mum behaves isn’t normal, so that’s another sensible voice he is listening to. She lives about 30 minutes away from my oldest brother so if he does go and live near him, he will be closer to her which he will definitely be happy about. 🤞

Brilliant updates, OP.
Stand strong when your mum kicks off!

Merry Christmas! 🎄 xx

Tortielady · 10/12/2025 10:54

The fact that your younger brother has expressed remorse about upsetting his niece is a hopeful sign. Formally, he's her uncle, but a coincidence of birth means that they are more like cousins or siblings in age; these are some of the most enduring relationships we have; they are with us before partners come on the scene and after our parents have gone. If the relationships are good, they see us through bereavement, divorce, all the ups and downs and can be a terrific ballast against loneliness.

It's quite possible that your mother's abrasive character has alienated her siblings and younger family members to the point where the only response she has is to encourage her children to be the same. You and your other siblings haven't taken the baton, you are refusing to be like her and she's doubling down on the one family member who is still young and impressionable enough to be malleable. None of that excuses his poor behaviour, but it underlines for him how much he has to lose if he continues to allow your mother to dictate how he relates to others. He could very well end up as lonely as she sounds, which would be terrible.

FollowSpot · 10/12/2025 11:09

Great updates, OP - and an example as to how putting your foot down helped your youngest brother see how bad things were.

Well done you, and your other brother. Between you you might have to support and coach your brother into how to deal with your Mum kicking off when he says he is going to his brother's for Christmas. Tell him about Grey Rock technique, and offer him a few phrases to have in his pocket to repeat, rather than engaging and getting drawn into her emotional blackmail.
e.g
We've had this conversation, no more to say
I am a grown up with my own mind - which is made up, and I have no more to say
That is your opinion, to which you are welcome.
I understand you are upset and I hope you can find an arrangement that suits you.

And each time, change the subject or walk away. Calmly.

Fingers crossed OP. Once your brother is safely away you can block your mother over the Christmas period and relax.

ChristmasMantleStatue · 10/12/2025 11:21

ChikinLikin · 10/12/2025 09:43

That's a very moving update. Good on your big brother.

Yes this.

OP, you sound like someone I'd want to be friends with. Sensible, reflective, thoughtful and generous.

I hope so much your brother can break free.

Merry Christmas. Thanks

Rivendellcarrot · 10/12/2025 11:32

JoClogs · 09/12/2025 23:41

It's not misogyny to point out that virtue signalling and veganism are both predominantly female pursuits. We call out toxic masculinity all the time - it doesn't mean we hate men.

I don't "hate" anyone - calling out classism is not hatred any more than calling out racism is.

In my experience, people who accuse other people of "hate" or "hate speech" are usually not very tolerant of different perspectives which they see as "hate".

Edited
Show quote history

Hahahahahaha. As if you are talking about being tolerant.

sprigatito · 10/12/2025 11:37

What a lovely group of siblings you are, in spite of your appalling mother. I’ll be rooting for your brother. It’s so hard to break away.

secretrocker · 10/12/2025 11:39

What a great update @WantToHibernate - hopefully things will work out well.
I can't believe that some people are so anti-vegan that they will invent imaginary scenarios to defend your hideously toxic mother though ( @JoClogs ).

labamba18 · 10/12/2025 11:47

I tell you what, why don’t you be seated at home because that’s exactly where you’ll be.

And your brother sounds like he’s pushing you to tell them to stay away, which is telling!

Hopingtobeaparent · 10/12/2025 12:32

WantToHibernate · 08/12/2025 10:20

Thanks all.

The weekend has definitely changed things. It’s the first time that they’ve crossed the line in directing their nastiness towards our children and not just us and that is a step too far.

I have just sent a very short and to the point text telling them that they’ve crossed a line to speak to our daughter that way, that they’re no longer invited for Xmas, and from now on they’re not welcome at our house.

My husband and I have also just had a conversation with my older brother, who is low contact with them, to put him in the picture in case they contact him. He is really angry that they’ve involved our daughter. He said to leave it to him and that he’ll speak to our youngest brother in a few days to say we’re all here for him IF he gets mum out of his life, but until then, we’ve all had enough and can’t keep doing it.

Perfect!

ChristmasMantleStatue · 10/12/2025 12:33

TBH Every time I read an anti-vegan post it reminds me that veganism is both possible and utterly normal and naysayers tend to be at best slightly ignorant and at worst have a massive chip on their shoulder that has nothing to do with veganism per se.

Hopingtobeaparent · 10/12/2025 12:39

WantToHibernate · 10/12/2025 10:04

We are cautiously hopeful. He has had these moments of clarity before though and did move in with us a few years ago for a while and seemed to be getting himself sorted before our mum got her claws back into him. He is that bit older this time though, has had the opportunity to see more of her behaviour since then, and from how upset my older brother said he was on the phone, I think that maybe the thought of losing us all could mean it’s different this time. Getting some distance will definitely be a good thing.

My younger brother also has a girlfriend now who seems lovely. Our mum doesn’t like her, which is no surprise to any of us. She never liked any of us having friends or boyfriends/girlfriends and there was always something wrong with everyone. His girlfriend is really close to her mum and siblings and has apparently told him that the way our mum behaves isn’t normal, so that’s another sensible voice he is listening to. She lives about 30 minutes away from my oldest brother so if he does go and live near him, he will be closer to her which he will definitely be happy about. 🤞

@WantToHibernate Sounds like there is hope yet for the younger one!! Really hope he can get away, get some clarity, and some assertiveness against her!!

Have a lovely Xmas!!

saraclara · 10/12/2025 13:05

Thank you so much for updating. What an amazing bunch of siblings you are, and congratulations on becoming such great adults, when you had such a poor role model.