Is it reasonable to be expected to let stepkids in bed with you?

[BecauseIWantTo]

My best friend just turned up at my house because she didn’t want to share a bed with kids that aren’t her own.

She has been with her fiancé for 4 years, she met his kids after a year, he moved in with her in July this year when they got engaged and he has his kids 50/50.

My BF has older children who live with her full time so her kids are two DD both 14 and 16 with their own rooms.

Her “step kids” (using this term for the thread but she says bonus kids) are DD 6 and DS 11.
They share a large room but it’s been cleverly partitioned as there is no way they can afford anywhere else.

My BF is ready to call off the engagement because despite the kids having their own space and beds that she spent a fortune decorating and making perfect for them they insist getting in bed with her and her partner.

She has just properly broken down saying her sleep is disturbed, the youngest still wears pull ups to bed, they come in and wriggle and chat, there is no room and on one occasion her DSS had got into bed between her and her DP and she rolled over to hug her DP and got a shock.
She said it’s completely inappropriate and as she’s 29 (8 years younger than her partner) she has questioned her SS’s motives for getting in bed with her.
My BF said her DSS is constantly bursting in on her getting changed but her DP says he’s young and nowhere near puberty so this wouldn’t be intentional.
She has insisted on him knocking when she’s in the bedroom but has resorted to having to put a bit of wood under the door as he “forgets”.

My mum is staying with me and implied my friend was some kind of wicked stepmother for hating this and said the kids are obviously seeking comfort and if she is unhappy to sleep on the sofa but not to do anything to threaten the bond with her DP and his kids.

My BF said she hates the idea of her kids getting into bed with an unrelated adult and thinks they are old enough to sleep in their own bed. Her DP said his DD occasionally co sleeps at their mums but they are both happy to sleep alone mostly.

I have no children and the thought of sleeping with older kids (especially an 11yo boy) is creepy as fuck and wouldn’t entertain the idea.
I haven’t outright said this as being childfree I’m not sure I have an unbiased view.

I suggested my BF post on here but she said she can’t face negative comments and to be ripped apart again so requested I post and read her some replies that won’t upset her.
She’s more then happy to hear a different opinion from hers but is just fragile - especially from lack of sleep.
I have name changed and changed a few details for privacy but have been here for years. I do know mumsnet can be hard on step parents so understand her hesitation to post herself!

My BF’s partner insists the kids stay in the bed if they get in. He said they obviously feel insecure and need comfort and he shuts the conversation down when my BF tries to discuss it.

It’s sometimes one kid and sometimes both but at different times. He sleeps through but my BF is often woken twice through the night.
It’s a standard double and really isn’t big enough for 4 people, she said she slept hanging off the edge initially but now sleeps on the sofa when it happens (most nights)

Her own kids are aware and said it’s weird but know it’s a source of arguments so didn’t say much else.

Apart from this as far as I know they have a normal amount of problems but things mainly work and everyone is mostly happy.

My BF said this is a major issue and she’s willing to call the wedding off if it isn’t resolved.
i know she’s angry and sleep deprived but that’s a constant issue due to this situation.

Does anyone have any advice please? Is she BU?

Sure, but it’s easy to read a thread arseways by accident, not noticing time stamps etc til you’re already knee-deep.
I usually ‘unflip’ so as to start at the beginning of the thread, but overlooked that just now and barged in at the top end.
Mea maxima culpa, MN .

I'd say that this man is grooming your friend to be the main carer for his children, expecting her to tolerate having her sleep disturbed by them etc, having to defer to what they want.
She should definitely end things because it will only get worse once she has made some kind of commitment to him and he has more leverage over her.
He's trying to subordinate her so that she will obey him.

I'll bet he was keen to move in with her.

She's not being unreasonable. They're incompatible due to his parenting practices and his ignoring her discomfort with his 11 year old's actions trying to catch her dressing and so on. If she really has 2 daughters, he could be doing this to them too. She's also becoming sleep deprived because of his parenting practices.

I'd have him move out ASAP. Find a new place and that's it. She's made a big mistake and she needs to put her daughters and herself ahead of having unrelated males in the home.

The step-children’s ages are relevant to the situation, even if the ages of your own children aren’t.

A 4 year old wanting to bed share is different to an 11 year old if you see what I mean.

Did you change the ages of the step-children too? The replies you’re getting mightn’t be accurate if you did.

If his children are up out of their own beds then he should be getting up with them. Not letting them climb in to bed with him if his partner is there. And if the 6 year old wants a cuddle with their dad before they get up then he gets up out of his bed and gets in their bed.

I bet he lets them get in his/her bed knowing she will get fed up and will then just get up. Giving him the opportunity to stay in bed for longer and go back to sleep while she is up with his kids.

And then of course, he and other people will wonder why she is then fed up of his kids and will label her the wicked stepmum. Same old story: The dad creates a shit situation and then everyone piles on the stepmum for not being happy about it. Your mum has made comments about her.

Just come back to the thread as I’ve been busy and can’t believe people are still commenting about the mistake I made with my friends age despite posting multiple times to clear it up and reporting my own post so mumsnet HQ needed to comment 🤦🏼‍♀️.

I changed a few details as I assume most people do.
As my friend is aware I posted then I’ll be open that I changed her age, her kids ages, the age gap between her and her DP and the length of the relationship.
I kept it as close to the truth as possible so it didn’t influence the post, it would have been pointless to say they had been together for 11 years when it was 18 months but I was trying to make it less outing which I’ve always assumed is pretty standard on here.

I didn’t change the ages of her step kids as multiple people have suggested because that would defeat the point in posting. If I’d put her DDS was 11 instead of 7 or 17 then it changes things a lot.

I mentioned the pull ups not because of her step daughters age but because it’s not that great to share a bed with an unrelated child but it does make it that little bit worse when the child isn’t fully toilet trained at night!
As I have mentioned I’m childfree and don’t know if this is like a child with a full nappy but I assumed it was and my friend didn’t go into huge detail about it but did mention it as one of the reasons she disliked sharing a bed with the kids.

I appreciate everyone who has commented without fixating on the error I made with the ages in my OP. I have talked at length with my friend and said that this needs nipping in the bud ASAP and read her some of the supportive comments that have been helpful because she’s going to speak to her DP about this properly today and if he isn’t willing to have a proper discussion she’s going to ask him to move out again and consider delaying the engagement.

She appreciated the fact people had picked up on the fact her DP isn’t tackling this for an easy life and it’s wrong that he isn’t considering her needs or feelings.
I doubt she’d have voiced this without that validation so it was worth the frustration of posting!

I have noticed recently when starting a thread (not that I start loads but I do occasionally) that some people seem so keen to find discrepancies or do an advanced search on a user name or just want to pick things apart to discredit the OP.
I used to find a lot of support and invaluable advice on here, I don’t know if things have changed or I’m just becoming more aware of the people who just want to be snide or question everything.
It’s a shame and I don’t think I’ll be starting any more threads as it’s just frustrating. I’ll stick to asking people’s opinions and advice in real life although I won’t get the honesty and mixed opinions from posting on an anonymous forum.

My friend didn’t want to post herself in case she read upsetting comments when she was feeling so vulnerable, I thought this was a bit extreme but understand her hesitation now.

I can understand why she's uncomfortable, I wouldn't like that either, but if her fiance isn't willing to stop them then she may have to decide whether it's worth ending the relationship over. Or I suppose they could stay together but live separately and she only stays over when the kids are at their mums?

Without a doubt!
OP has written that this friend didn't wish to know about any negative replies, because she feels vulnerable owing to her circs.
Is this any way for a woman to be feeling, just as she’s deciding to commit herself (AND HER DAUGHTERS 🤬) to life with this man and his children?

Who contemplates marriage in this frame of mind? (Silly question of course, because to judge from MN, every other young woman now believes she had no other choice in life)
This is so depressing to read, and I hope to God this poor overwhelmed friend is much bolstered by OP’s reports that over here, everyone is rooting for her to bin all that, and look after herself more.
It’s just not right; we oughtn’t to be bringing up girls to have such low expectations, and lower self esteem.

Your friend isn’t being unreasonable.

What her DP is suggesting is totally inappropriate. She should consider ending this relationship.

I wouldnt have problems sharing a bed with unrelated child

I would have a problem with getting zero sleep in my own bed - thats what she needs to focus on.

He could easily take kids back to bed and sleep with child in their bed but no he is making op share knowing she sint getting ny sleep

I cant share a bed with my own kids. I get zero sleep. So if needed dh would settle them ndni would tootle off to one of kids beds to get some decent kip.

Do they both get into their mums bed every night? Either way, it's not appropriate. Esp at age 11. A 6 year old with the occasional nightmare but that would be my limit.

I agree with your last comment OP, there are some people on here who think they are MN's answer to Sherlock Holmes...yet are such poor detectives they can't even be bothered to click the 'see all' button to learn all the "evidence", i.e. all the OP's comments.

I don't think that the vague plan that maybe your friend's eldest might move out and get an apprenticeship abroad is particularly great, or fair either. She might not want to do it in 2 years, or might not get on the scheme. Even if she does, she'll want to come home occasionally. 18 is still very young to be expected to move out permanently, and she'll probably feel resentful of her room being given up to on of the DP's kids.

Basically I agree with the majority. Your friend probably shouldn't have moved this guy in so soon, and, unless he's planning on stopping the Disney dad-ing and laying some ground rules down, would recommend postponing the wedding for a good while. If he's that keen, he'll wait.

I think you're being supportive of your friend. This relationship is leaving her sleep deprived, she's spent a lot of money on renovating her home for this move in, and she's contemplating more renovation that will devalue the home.

Her BF's son is showing inappropriate behaviour with her and she has teens in the home, at least one is a girl. Bf refuses to listen to her about his behaviour. That's really scary, because BF is ignoring what could become a massive problem.

She can't count on her daughter leaving the home at 18, although with her mom having moved unrelated males in, it could accelerate her leaving and mar her relationship with her own kids.

All in all, she's really much worse off for progressing this relationship from health to finances to family and privacy. This has been a total life downgrade. She needs to look at reversing that.

Have only read your posts OP, so I expect I'm repeating what others are saying.

Whilst his kids coming into the bed is nominally the problem, to me the bigger problem is your friend's fiancé's reaction.

"My BF’s partner insists the kids stay in the bed if they get in. He said they obviously feel insecure and need comfort and he shuts the conversation down when my BF tries to discuss it."
It's not his call. If he wants his children to come into his bed then he has to be in a bed by himself - he doesn't get to impose this on anybody else (such as your best friend). He certainly doesn't get to refuse to discuss the effect it's having on her sleep (and therefore her health). He is the problem here because he is refusing to parent his children.

"It’s sometimes one kid and sometimes both but at different times. He sleeps through but my BF is often woken twice through the night."

I wonder if this is why he's being such an arse, the fact that it's not impacting his sleep. That needs to change, your friend needs to wake him as soon as her sleep is disturbed and tell him his child needs him and he should go and sleep in that child's bed with that child. Let's see his opinion then! I'd actually say she should forewarn him of this - 'Fred I'm not having my sleep interrupted again, it's affecting my health. Next time one of your children comes into our bed you WILL wake, take them back to their bed and stay with them in their bed. If you don't then it's clear the only way I will be able to sleep will be if you move out of my house and into a bed in a room you can share with them without impacting me.'

If he won't wake up and deal with his child's needs/wants, he absolutely needs to move back out. You mentioned "He lived in a two bedroom house before that his family own" so it's likely he'll be able to move back there. Even if he can't that's not her problem; it is his responsibility to put a roof over his head, not hers.

You are right that so early into living together there will be an element of 'on best behaviour' at play. This is as good as he gets, and it's not good enough, is it? They're engaged, I personally would put getting married on hold - possibly permanently, because he really is showing her what sort of a man he is, and she should believe him.

I’ve known two friends dating 50/50 dads where this exact same happened, and the dad making a big song and dance of permissiveness / the partner having to let the kids in their shared bed.

None of my divorced mum friends would ever have their kids in the bed with a new man. They’d go to the kids’ rooms or ask the man v kindly if he’d mind decamping.

I think it’s a weird dad guilt thing.

She has a cocklodger!!!! She needs to get her finance AND his kids OUT of HER - HER!! - house!!! She’s left her house because he’s taking over!! NO NO NO!!!
this will only be the start of things!!!

No way. This is ridiculous. The children are far too old to be regularly sharing a bed with parents, let alone an unrelated adult. Your friend is being deprived of sleep and privacy, and her partner is refusing to consider her needs at all, which doesn’t bode well for the future. She should put her foot down hard or call off the engagement.

My DH didn't want our own children coming into our bed at night. I respected that and one of us always got up to them instead. The DP can't make the decision unilaterally, he needs to respect his partner's feelings.

There are red flags all over his behaviour and attitude. Your BF - and her children - would be better off if he moved out.

She didn’t move in. He did - it’s her house. I think she should kick him out asap, then he can share a bed with his kids whenever he likes and she can sleep in her own bed undisturbed.

She is 100% REASONABLE.

Ewwww!

Yes, call a screeching halt to the relationship.

She is being taken advantage of by a cocklodger.
Where was he living before her home became conveniently available?
How long had they known each other before the question of accommodation availability came up?

What money if any did he contribute to the redecorating and redesign of her home so the children could move in?

Why is he doing 50-50?
Is it so he can avoid paying child support?

@BecauseIWantTo

Your friend should do much more than 'delay the engagement'.

This man refuses to discuss an extremely important element of their life together. He is not husband or partner material.

She needs to end the relationship.

Seems to me that the step children are not happy about their dad’s new relationship. They are physically separating their dad from the new woman in the most intimate, private place.

And he does not want to address this.

massive red flag.

The only thing your friends is being unreasonable about is continuing the relationship.

I’ve got two stepkids - 6&10

Both sleep in their own rooms no issue. Six year old occasionally climbs into bed in the morning between us for a cuddle or to watch videos on the phones with us and the dog. Ten year old will come and sit on the end of the bed and chat.

If either of them actually needed to sleep in the bed with Dad (ill etc.) I would vacate and make do with sofa for the night.

I wouldn’t feel comfortable with what you are describing at all.

I think it’s important for your friend’s partner to set boundaries, particularly with his son. It’s natural for young kids to be curious about what other people look like naked, and this may well be exacerbated by the fact that he finds it funny to burst in on her and get a reaction. But eleven is very much old enough to know what’s appropriate and what’s transgressing another person’s privacy.

Your friend’s partner needs to nip this in the bud. It’s relatively harmless at eleven, but it’s much less harmless at fourteen. Maybe he’ll grow out of it, but her partner shouldn’t be allowing him to behave in a way that ignores your friend’s privacy. It sets a very bad precedent, and it’s disrespectful to her.

If his kids aren’t sleeping through the night, then he should be going to them and leaving her to get a good night’s sleep. Echoing other posters here that she should give it much longer before marriage.