Would you have said something: feral kids at RSPB sanctuary

[TheWildZebra]

Realise I may get slated for this, but wanted to know what general etiquette was around this sort of thing

last night went to the local RSPB sanctuary in hope of watching the starlings come in to roost and do their murmurations. It is a beautiful , peaceful and awe inspiring thing to see. It happens at sunset.

it’s a 20 minute walk to the viewing platform from the car park between flooded fields and muddy paths. Lots of bird viewing (and listening) opportunities along the way.

from about 10 mins in, I could hear screaming kids about half a km ahead of me. Like proper high pitch playground style. To my horror as I caught up with them, I saw it was 6 kids and 3 parents also on their way (very slowly) to the viewing platform so knew we’d be in for a noisy night. Kids about 7-8 yo.

Anyway, long story short is that the kids were making so much noise on the way there, at the viewing platform and on the way back. peace disturbed for other birders, not least scaring the wildlife we’d come to see (and hear!!)

the parents made no effort to keep the kids within reasonable noise levels. I don’t care if they talk. I care if they scream as if they’re watching fireworks. It seemed so bloody inconsiderate that they’d just let them ruin everyone else’s experience? Kids need to experience nature if we want them to look after if as the next generation. But they also need some boundaries - eg. Alex the owls will fly away if you scream at the top of your voice .

in the future, I know not to go on a weekend, and I’ll take a half day so I can go during the week.

but aibu to think it was just mega inconsiderate and would you have said something (I did not, just stewed and left feeling irritated and not peaceful!)

I would have said something.
Maybe "Hi everyone, this is the viewing platform for birdwatchers wanting to observe the birds in the sanctuary. Could you keep the noise right down please so that the birds aren't being scared away? If you keep nice and quiet you might see...."

But honestly, the general public are shit. Some, not all, obviously. I went to a popular place to observe seals during the pupping season yesterday. There are volunteer wardens and a roped path to keep people well away from the seals. Except for the ignorant twats who climbed over the rope to get closer to the seals / get a picture of the family from the wrong side of the rope, etc. Also trampling on the delicate dunes at a SSS!. Thinking they were so clever, getting one over the wardens when they had walked past. My brother in law told them to get back over the rope, and got a mouthful.

I’d have said something. And I have done, in similar circumstances. Watching a starling roost is a time for quiet. Other people are there who want to watch the starlings, not listen to feral kids. I’m surprised someone else didn’t tell them off!

We’ve been RSPB members for years and have young children. By and large it’s ok for them to make some noise and run around within reserves HOWEVER they know to be quiet on viewing platforms at all times and if any of them have started to make noises/ become restless, we always move them away. The platforms should always be the exception but the rest of the reserves tend to be open space so I don’t care about children being children there.

Well then, that’s far more specific and yes you’d expect people to respect the wildlife. We have plenty of RSBP car parks near us which are no where near as specific as this sort of thing and most people are generally there to pay money to park and go for a walk.

That is true @MrsTerryPratchett and it is a bit much for people to disapprove of a child's noise on the beach-in that case, the adult beachgoer would be unreasonable because they went somewhere where one might expect noise.

In the same way, the Op was not unreasonable to expect quiet at a bird sanctuary and nor would she be unreasonable to expect it at a chamber music concert or a poetry recital.

I would expect to hear noisy children if I chose to have a meal at The Whacky Warehouse but not if I was having a meal at L'Enclume.

It is horses for courses. Adults should not expect quiet at areas where there are children and nor should children expect to run riot or be exaggeratedly noisy in what can reasonable be expected to be a quiet environment.

I'm afraid that children's rights-in these circumstances whether they are ND or not-do not trump the rights of adults to quiet enjoyment.

Being a child is not a carte blanche card to spoil it for others, no more than a grumpy adult has the right to complain about lots of noise on the beach.

Absolutely children, all children, need and deserve places they can be exuberant and be themselves, and loud.

An RSPC Bird Sanctuary and a viewing platform for people wanting to observe birds isn't it, just because it is outdoors. Like soft play isn't for peace and quiet just because it is indoors.

And as you say, you, with more need than many to find places for your Dc to be free, would not have taken her to such a place.

Boom!

No it’s an honesty box to use the car park that’s all

I feel your pain and completely agree - parents do need to keep their children quiet when attempting to watch wildlife. And, if they know they can't keep them quiet, then they need to be respectful of others and take their child to a playground or other outdoor space which isn't a sanctuary meant for unsuspecting critters and those who love to watch them.

I've been on both sides of this. Went 'badger watching' with my son and his friends (when they were 7-8 years). Managed to keep my son quiet but the other parents didn't or even make a serious attempt to. Needless to say no self-respecting badger would have come out given the racket the kids made, and they didn't. I was part of this group, said nothing and stewed in silence. I've learnt that this isn't a group activity so I take my son by himself for critter watching now.

The ridiculous noise kids make in general is irritating. Screeching and screaming everywhere. We used to get told off as kids if we made stupid noises and if our parents told us to be quiet, we bloody well listened!

The hides being empty or not is irrelevant. You are meant to be quiet so that you don’t disturb the wildlife. There are signs in hides that make this quite clear.

If parents can’t keep their kids quiet in places that NEED to be quiet, then they shouldn’t be taking them there.

We spent a huge amount of time at RSPB reserves as children and we knew what the rules were. If we made any noise in hides we would be told off by our parents. This is what parenting used to look like.

Whatever flipping diagnosis your kids might have, parents should use their noddle and realise that it's just not the place for screaming and shouting. If you can't keep them quiet(er), take them somewhere else! Really simple.

This.

Unfortunately OP, a lot of parents are useless and make no effort with their children. YANBU.

I always say something in these situations.

“Hey, kids! Do you like owls? If we’re really, really, really quiet, like little mice, we might, if we’re really lucky, hear an owl here. Who can be a mouse?”

I’d start in a loud-ish voice to get their attention, then quieten to a stage whisper.

It usually works. If they then engage nicely, and I’m in a friendly mood, I might even point things out.

When you start with 'flipping diagnosis' I am minded to say that neurodiversity isn't voluntary, but being a twat is.

And 10 years later teenage DD is a delight. You'd be stunned. People only ever talk about the 'feral' kids they think were 'gentle parented' with 'flipping' diagnoses. The actual children turn out great, thanks.

Love this!

UNICEF rights of a child" - good grief 😂

That told me all I needed to know about that poster and their parenting style.

They also clearly have a massive chip on their shoulder and are essentially saying that working class people don’t know how to behave in public. Awful.

One of the great pleasures of retirement is that you can choose to go to places when everyone else is in work and school.

Really, you need a sign up to tell you that screaming like a banshee when out and about isn’t appreciated?

OP, yes I would ask/tell them to be quiet and have done so before. Last time in a bird hide of all places, watching red squirrels. The parents were as bad as the kids. Maybe they were just so thick they didn’t realise that shouting would scare the squirrels off. In fairness they did zip it when I pointed this out to them.

I hope all the people on this thread deeply concerned about children disturbing the birds don’t keep outdoor cats 👀

Maybe. I was in the forest with my mum once in Canada. She was shushing DD. I advised her that it was a bear area and singing, shouting and making lots of noise are actually encouraged so you don't quietly happen on one.

Sometimes people don't know about wildlife.

On sunday in our local Tesco two kids (looked nursery & reception ages) were racing up and down one aisle to see how far they could slid on the floor. Lots of excited squeeling. I assumed the parents weren’t around but no, they were laughing and saying do it again, faster! But I did that British thing of just being annoyed and not saying anything

I cant believe how harsh some people are being. I spend most of my life walking round shushing kids- parenting just has to look very different for different children and I'm so glad it's no longer one size fits all.

Our local RSPB place has an outdoor music making area where there are signs up encouraging kids to hit things with batons to make noise. I.e. the RSPB themselves are encouraging families to come in and be noisy.

Being silent in an otherwise empty hide seems somewhat unnecessary when its a few meters down the path from an area where there are signs encouraging noise.

Thankfully the world has moved on significantly and is now far more inclusive than it used to be- I am very grateful that the RSPB offers us a lovely space where we can go and enjoy the outdoors without having to be silent.

As I said in both of my posts, we don't go to our second nearest reserve- much more like the OP described, where there is nothing but toilets, a path and hides. We're happy to leave that to the serious birders and I agree, that wouldn't be a good place to be loud.

But I'll be forever grateful to the RSPB for providing more relaxed, child friendly spaces to use. It's been a lifesaver for us over the years.

😁 Very good!