To think my friend was racist, rude or both?

[RicottaOtter]

I was talking to a friend this morning. This friend is very concerned about excessive immigration to the UK, and plans to vote reform at the next general election because she believes only reform have the guts to tackle the problem properly. I was listening and not saying anything when this friend suddenly said, ‘Don’t worry - you’ll be okay, because of your husband, and you’re a mother to English children…’

I was gobsmacked at first - then realised she was talking about my ethnicity (one quarter English/one quarter white South African but originally English/half East European Jewish). I’ve lived in England my entire life and as far as I’m concerned I’m as English as this friend who was talking to me - whatever my ancestry might be.

Now, remember, this friend was (I think?) trying to be nice and reassuring (‘Don’t worry, you’ll* be okay’) - but I felt quite horrified and angry to have this said to me - am I being unreasonable?

Also you know how she sees you. That foreign ancestry makes you “less than” in her eyes.

So I assume she expects those without an English husband / English kids to “not be ok”

Friend may have simply been concerned that you might think Reform would be coming for you - I know some people that feel this way.

However, your friend should really be shouting loudly that if labour don’t implement a Danish-like system then Reform will get in, not adding support to Reform.

This.

This is where Reform leads where billionaires divide us and laugh all the way to their money.

If people think unleashed hate will be safely contained see ICE and all the tourists etc...they are detaining etc. etc..

I’m guessing she’s always been at least a bit like this, but you’re only noticing/ offended because it was semi-directed at you. Sad.

The words in the OP about "you will be ok" implying others will not be

OP is British. That’s what you are missing.

Implying that other Britons, of foreign ancestry, that don’t happen to have English husbands / children won’t be ok is what you are missing

. And the fact that so many “patriotic English” wearing their poppies and waving their flags, can’t see that the “war our boys fought for our freedoms” was against exactly this sort of disgusting bullshit, is ASTONISHING to me.

I often wonder if people confuse racism with fear of other religions:. unless we are careful with allowing certain religions 'customs' to take hold ' as a woman we may end up losing our freedoms.

Yep the whole “Reform has ethnic minority members” is so weak. They are politically expedient. So many candidates / members have been caught saying racist things - they have shown us time and time again who they really are.

I won't lay out the facts about the Tories' failed "reforms" of the NHS and how much money they wasted - because theae have been available for years and you clearly haven't been interested enough to look them up.

I have to use the NHS every month. The last time was two weeks ago, the next time is in a fortnight. It works smoothly every time. It is not teetering on "total collapse" - and anyone who spouts tabloid cliches in lieu of reasoned, fact-based argument doesn't merit attention.

You want health insurance? You're free to buy it. It's quite suprising, given your views, that you haven't already. What's stopping you? Meanwhile, the vast majority who actually care about this country - and everyone in it - will continue to fight for the NHS, and other areas of vital infrastructure, and against the grifters of Reform - and the fools who support the grifters - who view the UK only as a cash-cow, profit making venture

Yep its generally a cipher for I'm about to say something foul

Is she concerned about ‘excessive immigration’ or illegal immigration? Did you point out you’re not an illegal immigrant?

What religious customs have we let take hold?
I’m old. My freedom has been curtailed by totally British customs and institutions for most of my life - it was getting better. It’s getting worse again, and not because of ‘certain religions’. U less you mean fundamentalist Christian ones -Farage is in favour of the moves against birth control and abortion in the US (or has said he is in speeches over there).

Others unlike the OP will not be 'ok' and the friend is fine with that, indeed voting for Reform on that basis. Also, the whole conversation indicates the friend spent quite a bit of time calculating if the OP is indeed going to be 'ok'.

I see your point if not for the Reform voting friend, people in international friend groups like mine will often calculate their likelihood of various issues with immigration, racism, political trends and tend to speak more openly about these things, but my friends in these groups all hate Reform and that's the difference. My friends are also highly educated and often hold dual citizenship so have places to go and options, not everyone is going to be 'ok' in that type of world the Op's friend is so keen to create.

Freedoms? Have you clocked our rape conviction rates? The free speech arrests being made of women speaking about genocide or climate change? The wage disparities? Women at the BBC being sacked as they get old? Seriously I think you've fallen for Islamophobia

What are you dribbling on about?

grooming gangs for example, hidden and allowed for years because to question it was deemed to be 'racist' . Look at how women are treated in any country in the world that is governed by a certain religion to see the lot of a woman.
I said we have to be careful about letting them get hold..

The OP was born here as a citizen? It’s her ancestors who are from other countries. Not the same thing at all.

That was a scandal, yes. But there are many, many white grooming gangs too it’s not a ‘religious custom’ ffs
Look at how women are treated in any country if the world where any religion gets a hold. Look at the southern US states where fundamentalist Christian’s have got a hold. Religion is no friend to women. Any religion.

And here we have another example. Nobody can ever possibly have said a racist thing. Do you really think there are no racists? And if there are, none of them support Reform? Or if they do, they keep their opinions to themselves?

Oh goody. Another tedious, parochial bore who isn't brave enough to openly state that they're Islamophobic and/or racist. You have freedom of speech - have the balls to be open about what you really think for once.

Alongside fears of being seen as racist, a large factor in grooming gangs (you raised the subject) not being tackled two decades ago is that the police - majority white - and large numbers of the workers in involved agencies dismissed the girls coming forward to make reports as "slappers", "troublemakers", "prostitutes", "criminals", and didn't bother, for far too long, to take the reports seriously or follow them up. In their eyes, there was no need; what did the girls "expect" for daring to come from difficult backgrounds, or for not attending school, or for drinking alcohol underage...Strangely, the SaVeArEKIdZ contigent seem to overlook this. But it stemmed from a belief about which type of girls, and women, are not worth treating well, which has fk all to do with any religion. And it's a belief a (large) part of the SaVeArKIdZ contingent also hold. Because they're not aerated by the murders of av. two women a week in the UK by their partners/ex-partners. Or the shockingly low level of prosecutions of rapes committed by British "Christian" men against British women. These indicate an awful lot about how British men view, and treat, women today but srangely enough, Farage and his fellow-travellers don't ever talk about this.

Another tedious, parochial bore who isn't brave enough to openly state that they're Islamophobic and/or racist. You have freedom of speech - have the balls to be open about what you really think for once.

I have! didn't you read my original post?

Your friend has confirmed that she (as no doubt many other reform voters will) sees you as "other".
There is absolutely nothing to indicate you would be "fine" if Reforn ever got into power.

First they came for the communists...

Couched in the coy, twee circumlocution of "a certain religion" which no doubt you think passes for being "clever" in whichever dreary bit of middle England you inhabit. All it does is indicate that you know very little about Islam, very little about the subject of grooming gangs and that you are not motivated by concern about the protection of vulnerable girls (or boys) in our communities.