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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

To wonder if UK lycees sometimes hinder the integration of French immigrant kids?

206 replies

Carla786 · 11/11/2025 18:53

I was reading Ben Judah's excellent book This Is London recently, about the relative integration of different immigrant groups in London. The focus was mainly on non-Western European immigrants, but there was some mention of the French immigrant population of Kensington.
I went to school there - my school was very near a lycee but I never thought much about it. I'm quite interested in France myself (my mum's a French teacher) and have several French friends (my school had a lot of European immigrants' children), I'm definitely not opposed to French people coming here. I'm just wondering if lycees are always helpful for integration. (Yes, I'm Gen Z- I know people will want to know why I'm on MN : I came for GC issues and stayed for the rest).

Generally we emphasise that it's important for immigrants to integrate with the existing population as much as possible. Lycees give French immigrants' children an education that follows the French curriculum, and I understand from what I've read are generally now composed of almost solely French children, though I understand the pupil cohort used to be more mixed in the past and maybe included more British children. If you grow up in a mainly French immigrant community and go to a lycee with mainly other French immigrant kids, how integrated will you be into the mainstream British population?
Generally when we talk about integration we focus on immigrant groups where sections are involved in crime or who mainly low-skilled. French immigrants are generally neither, so the lycee system isn't much remarked on. While I agree it's not a major concern, I still think it's worthy of comment.

We don't (I think) have lots of similar schools worldwide for the kids of Italian, German, Greek, Spanish, etc immigrants where they learn non-British curriculums. Yes, there are faith schools which sometimes overlap with ethnicity and have different curriculums (though I'd question that too- that topic's not for this thread, though).. I understand that lycees' educational standards are highly regarded & Brits or other immigrant nationalities sometimes send their kids there for that reason, esp since some run a parallel English curriculum(though as I said, the number of non-French pupils is much less now).

Still, I wonder how positive it is to have them if they're increasingly becoming nearly wholly French, and often used by families who are constantly on the move so that their kids can easily switch between lycees?

TLDR : AIBU to wonder if lycees may hinder integration of French immigrant kids if they now teach a French curriculum under the auspices of the French government to mainly French immigrant pupils who live generally in French immigrant-dominated areas? I'm definitely not saying they should be banned or anything, especially as UK state schools are generally bad at the moment..maybe there should be a push for a more mixed pupil cohort though?

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Swiftie1878 · 13/11/2025 12:09

Carla786 · 13/11/2025 11:55

That's really strange: why would areas receiving funding not vote Remain? Did they feel the funding wasn't being used efficiently?

I get London received less, however people who came due to EU would have benefited from that, also businesses who employed EU workers

There must be more to the story : was the vote a cultural protest them? Seems odd to vote something like that solely on cultural issues if the economy is going well.

You don’t know why people voted for Brexit?

Carla786 · 13/11/2025 12:12

Swiftie1878 · 13/11/2025 12:09

You don’t know why people voted for Brexit?

I've said that I thought many felt they were not economically benefiting from EU, didn't have same travel opportunities as other countries had to come here, wages undercut by cheaper workers etc.

This challenges those ideas. I must research more later..

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Carla786 · 13/11/2025 12:12

Swiftie1878 · 13/11/2025 12:09

You don’t know why people voted for Brexit?

I know it was a cultural issue to some extent, but I thought that element was less important than economics (also dislike of EU encouraging migration from other continents)

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Oriunda · 13/11/2025 13:40

Carla786 · 13/11/2025 12:12

I've said that I thought many felt they were not economically benefiting from EU, didn't have same travel opportunities as other countries had to come here, wages undercut by cheaper workers etc.

This challenges those ideas. I must research more later..

Ok, so now you’re just trolling us! How can you say that people voted for Brexit because they didn’t have the same travel opportunities as other countries?! The whole point of being within the EU was that British people had exactly the same freedom of movement. Whereas now, they don’t.

Still, I hope we’re helping you with your essay.

Carla786 · 13/11/2025 14:32

Oriunda · 13/11/2025 13:40

Ok, so now you’re just trolling us! How can you say that people voted for Brexit because they didn’t have the same travel opportunities as other countries?! The whole point of being within the EU was that British people had exactly the same freedom of movement. Whereas now, they don’t.

Still, I hope we’re helping you with your essay.

Sorry, I didn't explain that very well! What I meant was that, for instance, we got many Polish and Romanian workers, to name two nationalities, coming here, whereas their economies were bad then and not as good places to travel to work (which was ofc a big reason WHY they came) so it benefited nationalities like those more than us, in that sense.
Also, I explained language issues on a previous post. Our government has been very poor at encouraging languages (GCSE foreign language not compulsory since 2004) so obviously Europeans would have a linguistic advantage in that sense.

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Carla786 · 13/11/2025 14:35

I have a Polish online pen pal & was actually debating this with her. She agreed that Brexit had been fuelled by valid issues (probably Brexit wasn't the answer for them, though). However, she argues that Poland, for instance, didn't benefit a lot more than the UK did, and that in some ways UK did benefit a lot. I think I'm coming round to this way of thinking.

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