To feel that DD2 has ruined ours lives

[Hoverflies]

She is 3.5. Every single day since she was born has been so hard. She fed constantly as a baby and if she was awake and not feeding she was screaming. She was never content as a baby, never slept well and ever since has been screaming at us every single day for huge portions of the day. She has a meltdown multiple times per hour, she screams at us all and hits us constantly and her sister. Every day involves her changing her clothes constantly and screaming that it's too tight, too loose, doesn't feel right. She won't wear any shoes. The car seat is too tight, its too loose, its wonky. She's constantly destroying things and throwing things. She's been screaming got most of the evening because she's hungry but won't eat any of the food, she's cold but won't wear any clothes, she's exhausted but she won't go to bed.

But then at other times and with other people she is a delight. Smiley, funny and happy. Very clever. People actually think we are making it up! Meanwhile we are actually thinking we might need to move house because the walls are so thin that the neighbours will be hearing screaming for almost the entire time we are at home.

We have basically spent the time she has been alive extremely stressed and exhausted. Our good relationship with DD1 was destroyed as we had hardly any energy for her and I end up taking things out on her and being too hard on her. We like to play games together and read and do crafts but it's so hard when DD2 is around because she just ruins it every time. I can barely hear what DD1 is saying to me most of the time over the shouting. My relationship with DP is in the toilet because of the stress.

I don't know if she has PDA or if she has got extremely high cortisol levels as she was basically starved as a newborn, she lost so much weight and took months to put it back on because she couldn't feed properly.

I constantly think of the lovely time we would all be having without her here which I know is awful. I do love her so much but our lives at the moment feel far worse for her being here.

No one but you is saying the OP is a "shit parent"! (sorry, another poster above was saying she was awful,but she was so hateful, I am hoping her post would be deleted)

SEN or no SEN, no one but no one parent 2 children the same way, and parenting the same way would never work.

It's irrelevant if DD1 is not showing the same issues, she's not the same child, and it has nothing to do with SEN or no SEN.

Sounds so much like my middle daughter, up until around 7 she was an absolute nightmare child. Didn’t sleep through until 5/6, made sure she was both seen and heard in every single situation. Tantrums, she’d have multiple a day, she’d hit, nip and scream. Now? She’s the most sweetest loving girl ever. I don’t know what changed but it was pretty much overnight.

There's absolutely no feasible way a second child has been parented identically to the first. It's literally not possible.

And please tell me where I said OP was a shit parent. I said sometimes kids are neurodiverse. Sometimes they're just little shits. Everybody jumping to give a toddler acting like a toddler a medical diagnosis over Mumsnet is laughable.

I know everybody's going straight to neurological issues, and it does look that way, but I wanted to chime in with the few mentioning allergies. I cared for a nightmare baby like this. We eventually worked out that he was intolerant to wheat & dairy. Appropriate diet fixed his problems.

Also, OP, it's not impossible that she may have a genetic disorder making life painful for her. You really need to clarify all these issues with your GP and/or pay for a paediatric evaluation.

Even if she has a psychological problem originating from her difficult early months, expert help is available. Good luck

Take her to a Dr and ask for a referral to a pradiatrician asap. There has to be a reason for this behaviour.

My daughter is almost 16, and whilst we have suspected in passing that she may be ND, it is only becoming more obvious now. She was high needs for first year, but basically an easy kid. Learning to how to behave and mask doesn’t mean they aren’t ND, it just means they are coping for now.

You didn’t use those words but you did strongly insinuate that poor parenting is the reason the child behaved the way she does. Own it, at least.

No children are parented identically but it would be very unusual for one child to emerge without any behaviour issues at all and one to be riddled with them.

And possibly will continue to cope.

Lets not assume the worst.

god this takes me back. My DCs are 5 years apart and I had hell with DC2 for very similar sounding scenarios. I strongly suspected PDA when I found out it existed (when she was 10). She was diagnosed autistic when 14. It’s been really really bloody hard! Is a young adult now , fully aware of why she struggles the way she does and I’ve done loads of reading up in autism, pda and others. There are lots of books available to help parents. It’s really important, in my non- medical but mother experience, to work with her and parent her the way she needs to be parented and this will be very different to the way you parent your other child. Ignore all the tut-tutters who tell you you’re too soft, need to be firm etc. they haven’t got a clue. if your child has PDA she needs desperately to feel in control and everything is a battle . Please get as much knowledge help and support for each of you in your family .

Not poor parenting, no. But certainly not putting boundaries in place, or being firm enough. You don't like your socks? Fine, no socks for you today.

Second children are notoriously worse behaved than the first, who have a huge chunk of time being the centre of their parents world. Golden first child and all that.

Mine aren’t. No1 is the wild child. No2 is easy.

It really isn’t about socks.

she might well, like my dad did. But he also cocked up his marriage and made bad choices with his kids which I can see were driven by his autism.

my sister is a single mum of two, lived abroad for 15 years, super capable. But unable to keep a job for much more than a year, needs support on finance arrangements at uni. You don’t know what people will need support with in adult life. Sometimes when you realise they need support, the wait for diagnosis is too long, better to get it done whilst there is no issue, and hope you may never have as issue, than scramble if you do have an issue.

Funny, because it’s DC1 we’ve had no end of issues with and, lo and behold, is autistic. DC2 is an angelic toddler despite probably 50% of the parenting time and effort we had available for DC1 at the same age. I’d love to say we smashed it a second time round therefore he just needed far less parenting overall, but it’s got naff all to do with us. He just has a compliant, sunny, easy going personality. It’s easy with him to look like an ace parent.

What I would like to add, as the parent of an ASD and neurotypical children is;
Neurodivergent children can seem badly behaved because of sensory issues, or just because they are being a little sod. Even ND children need discipline even if its not standard. Nothing pisses me off more than lazy parenting.

The assessment processes for ND are quite prolonged and frankly a bit intrusive. If "experts" like pre school and reception teachers flag the behaviour its taken more seriously. There's quite a lot of effort made to rule out shit parenting.

If the child is neurodivergent being firm and having strict boundaries will drastically backfire. My DC2 displayed near identical behaviours for years. I’ve had to step back completely from the way I had been parenting and find ways that worked. I would never have believed I would have to change so much to suit a child, but if I hadn’t she would have completely gone off the rails.

Far too much bending over backwards to accommodate those naughty children. I think a more firm and stricter approach is needed. If people disagree they can crack on while the whole family's lives are made a misery.

While both of mine are NT as far as I know, I relate to this. (I think our DC2s were born within days of one another actually IIRC.)

DS is more challenging, just is. Climbs on things, charges towards things first and thinks later, used to randomly attack other children (I could never go to those lovely church hall toddler groups with him as he’d just wander around hitting and snatching and shoving) woke at 5 every day for ages. PITA. He’s mostly fine now to be fair.

DD is … easy, just is. Plays with her dolls, very cutely says ‘need help!’ when confronted with something she can’t do, might boss a younger child around a bit but certainly wouldn’t swipe at them.

Same parents. Funny, isn’t it?

Agree, I feel sorry for her sister. Hitting your siblings and parents is unacceptable behaviour and needs firmly responding to.

Sounds like your child has extra needs...please see a paediatrician.
Shes not ruined your life, you just haven't learnt to live with her

Yes, I am right.

If it’s PDA she will get better as she gets older and gains more autonomy. Please don’t resent her. The world is hard for her. Practice low demand parenting, it will really help, advocate for her, and explain to the older sibling why you parent your kids differently, as it’s confusing. Even if she isn’t PDA, it’s worth doing a seminar with the PDA Society as the tactics will work and help, even if she isn’t PDA. Don’t think in what ifs, deal with the hand you’ve been dealt, you have no choice! And have empathy for her. Apply for DLA, you don’t need a diagnosis, and get some play therapy, an OT, a teenage or ND informed babysitter, whatever works for her. My daughter is PDA and loves a teenage babysitter. Have some time to yourselves to get away and appreciate her assets rather than focussing on the negatives. And I promise things will get better.

She could be autistic or ADHD or both. She could just be a difficult bright child who is responding to a child-parent-child effect relationship. My youngest son was like this and I felt like you. By the time he was five he was a different child and a delight. He is an angel now. We got him diagnosed and I did Circle of Security parenting course and Triple P parenting course. It helped me manage my part of the dynamic.

I find it hard to believe that when things are so hard you've only consulted a health visitor? Baffling.

Don't just try to "learn more". She needs professional assessment asap.

Moving house would cost you so use that money to get her assessed for ND.

Allergies and autism can be comormid. My dad, sister and brother were all autistic, all had allergies and eczema. My sister in particular had egg, dairy allergies, gall bladder issues, IBS, eczema, sensitive to food colourings etc.

A snapshot into someone's life is never grounds for a clinical diagnosis. Correlations are not a way to determine causation.

Moreover, two things can be true at the same. Neurodivergence isn't grounds for dismissing parental boundaries.