The racism on the Huntingdon train threads is appaling

[Perplexed20]

Just as the title says. The blatant racism and jumping to conclusions on the threads has been terrible. Mumsnet used to be a more informed intelligent place.

When hardship hits, the weakest link gets blamed for the mess because they are an easy target.

This is not unique to the UK.

It's used in situations of a "marauding terror attack" where someone is moving with the aim of attacking as many people as possible.

It's YOU who is insisting that it's speculation. My comment was about reporting racist comments, not about seeing racism where there is none. I can see why you don't want to engage further, nor even attempt to answer any of my questions (and no, you haven't answered them so your understanding is faulty.)

Code Plato is for "marauding terrorist attacks". Not "including" anything else.

I was thinking of the Derek Bird case today, I remember it vividly as I’d not long had DC1 and would often go out for walks with the pram. I remember thinking how terrifying it must have been for the residents. I don’t remember anyone speculating about if the person carrying out the attacks was not white or an immigrant. That feels like a newer thing.

Yes they did at first.

The incident was initially designated a "Code Plato," which is used for marauding terror attacks.

Thr public are entitled to honesty which we have good reason to suspect us not always forthcoming from a government who places huge value on ‘narrative management’. The new Deputy PM even mentioned it in her speech - DH and I were listening and commented in surprise. Subsequent versions appear to have removed that bit ironically.

While people do like to get outraged on others behalf, I don't think that is what was happening here and I truly think you're being unfair in this instance.

And if someone who isn't ever going to experience racism in their lifetime calls out a truly racist post/thing said then imo, that is a good thing. It's the same way I think other men, if hear sexist or incel type talk about women, to call that out too. Same if hearing bullies, stop that behaviour. It's doing the decent thing by our fellow man and calling out unacceptable behaviour. Surely there is nothing wrong with that?

Actually you need to go back and read your own posts. You said "speculating and accusing". I am under no obligation to engage further, nor to answer any of your questions (not that any of them were genuine). I can see why you want to continue but you really need to find another target. I don't interact with bullies.

It's a "marauding terror attack" not terrorist.

It doesn't mean the exact same thing.

Narrative management is hugely important.

Think of the man who was arrested and has now been released.

Imagine if the police had bowed to the baying mob and released his name before they'd established he was innocent.

Imagine how safe he'd be once he was released. What if he had a wife, children? What about their safety? What about his colleagues at his workplace?

I'm sure you'll handwave this away with "but he's innocent so he'd have nothing to fear".

But if you're dumb enough to believe there is a big conspiracy theory around withholding information from the public because you read it on X then you're dumb enough to go after someone who is innocent because you don't trust anything the police say and someone on X says he actually did it.

None of those were mass stabbings.

Jake Davison (Plymouth incel) - shooting
Derek Bird (Cumbria) - shooting
Liverpool van driver - van (unusual he was white, no fatalities)
Michael Ryan (Hungerford) - shooting
Thomas Hamilton - shooting
Harold Shipman - injections
Lucy Letby - injections/intravenous

Stabbings aren’t inherently worse or better, they’re just a different means to commit an atrocity.

Statistically mass stabbings, as opposed to stabbing of only one individual in any attack, are seemingly not the murder means of choice for white British men. So it isn’t unreasonable for people to assume that a mass stabbing incident, if declared terrorism (which this was at first) is likely to have been carried out by someone who was neither white nor Christian.

@Yellowcardigan ’s statement “Of course British/white/Christians commit crimes, but generally not this type of crime in Britian,” is, I imagine, in reference to the fact that the victims were injured in a mass stabbing, not that they were attacked in general.

Yes, so they initially called it a terrorist attack, as I said.

Maybe read up on previous terrorist attacks and their similarities over the last few years. It was an entirely reasonable approach from the police. Which prompted reasonable concerns from the public. I’m not saying all responses were reasonable - some people say bad things.

and he's got around 11 other money spinners going on as well as his £94k MP's salary, apparently he's made over £1 million this year. He is rarely in the HoC and is even more invisible in Clacton. Yet his fans love him, there is something Trumpian about their devotion.

Mumsnet has been a absolute cesspit of racism for years and it's definitely getting worse. MNHQ couldn't give less of a shit if they tried.

Are you seriously suggesting there has not been collective outrage and revulsion for white sex offenders in this country?? The Catholic priests and the Scouts have almost become synonymous with sex offenders in the eyes of the public.

We have literally just sacked a prince for having bad associates.

This is why people don’t like the left.

If it was anyone else. Mainly white, English we could tear them apart. Say how it was obvious. The culture explains it.

My empathy, white, black, brown immigrant, whoever was harmed lies with them. Not the evil, uncultured, selfish people who did this.

If people make unkind comments about them. Good! I won’t be making a thread and defending them!

Signing out...

I didn’t read past the first two pages of that thread — it made me so deeply sad. I felt scared that maybe so many people really do hate people like me.

friends whatsapped me — saying that if the perpetrators turn out to be “other,” it will be awful.

Those poor people went through what must have been the most harrowing, petrifying moments of their lives, and they couldn’t escape. My heart goes out to every single one of them.
But instead of focusing on the victims and feeling grief and compassion, some people have chosen to weaponise this tragedy to push their own hateful agenda.

And yes — Mumsnet absolutely needs to review how they allow such disgusting bigotry, Islamophobia, and racist rhetoric to stand on their platform

It may not but once you get into that level of splitting hairs, I think your point has failed.

I am as pleased as the next person if it isn’t a terrorist attack. I remain suspicious because I don’t trust the government or much of the media like the BBC because we know they lie.

There is an important conversation to be had though. People are feeling the effects of the current immigration issues and there are murders and rapes as a result. That is not ok but attempts to shut down all conversation as many are doing with blanket accusations of racism just pushes people towards Reform and believe me, I don’t like them either.

No-one is attempting to shut down all conversation. Talk about DARVO.

Its just the racist bits that need shutting down.

No one was asking for names - that’s ridiculous. We just want to know we’re getting honesty from the government and authorities in bad situations and their track record is poor.

You insulting me just shows your low level of ‘argument’. We know that the government, police and media lie to us. I’m just amazed you still trust them so much….

Ah cool.

You know, as well as I do, I wrote about the protests, as in standing outside and well, you know, protesting. Cheers, enjoy your outrage and wrong end of the stick.

But it's not 'one horrific incident', though, is it? It's several. And since the police tend to turn a blind eye to sexual assault and the rise in violent crime for fear of being called racist, women need to do what they can to protect themselves. Great if you don't feel the need to - however, what another woman chooses to do couldn't be less of your business.

"No-one was asking for names"??

Social media (including MN) was FULL of people demanding the identities to be released.

I didn't insult you? I'm just explaining why narrative management is important.

If you mean the "if you're dumb enough to believe X" paragraph then that is a general "you" to illustrate the point and is not aimed at you specifically.

Is this where, despite you claiming that it is perfectly possible to discuss immigration without you calling ‘racist’, it turns out that there is no actual way it can be discussed without being deemed racist?

I have been called racist for quoting MI5 on the level of Islamic terrorist threat so…