To expect Sunday Dinner as the agreement?

[TipJarTroubadours]

Small details changed but the short of it is:

1. We allow people to stay in self contained accommodation for 'free'
2. The only 'cost' is attendance to Sunday dinner
3. Aibu to refuse to let someone stay (or charge them market rent) if they don't attend dinner

The long of it is

DH and I own a residential static caravan site. It has been in DH family a long time. It has great transport links to a major city.

We allow close family/friends to stay rent free whilst they attend uni in the city/start a new job. We have had 15 different people over the years, some for six months, the longest five years.

Currently house DS and nephew who are both at uni and DHs best friends daughter and her partner who has just started an apprenticeship. All four attend Sunday dinner, as have the 15 beforehand.

(For those that are interested, I cook the meal and then they take turns to make/buy a pudding and wash up (most goes in the dishwasher) I have had one with severe allergies who used to bring their own food, and one that was fussy so I used to make them beans on toast every Sunday. )

My sister's son has been living with us since September, I was very clear on the rules- it might seem odd but for a 10k saving a year I expect attendance at one meal a week.- they both knew about this.
Since starting he has attended one, preferring to go to the pub/gym/game on a Sunday. It has been raised with him and we have said if he doesn't attend then we will charge him rent (we have other uni students renting although they are all mature)

I have gone to my parents for half term and have just met my sister and told her the same. My parents and her think I am completely unreasonable to ask him to attend Sunday dinner, I think they are completely unreasonable to expect me to house him for free after agreeing to my rules ( there are costs involved for me, utilities etc plus not being able to rent it out)

I've said he has to attend tomorrow or I will bill them from now until Christmas and if it isn't paid will evict at Christmas.

Am I being unreasonable to expect my nephew to do what he agreed to in return for accommodation? (I don't think I am, even if expecting to attend dinner is unreasonable, he has agreed to the terms, he could have just rented halls)

It's controlling. There are other, more neutral ways that are less coercive. I have given examples in my post. Paying your mortgage is one such example. It is neutral. Not coercive. Are your mortgage lenders demanding that you spend every Sunday evening with them personally, socialising or they'll kick you out?

There are differences in this situation because it's attempting to dictate someone's emotional reaction and behaviour for the benefit of the OP and their views of how they want other people to behave and feel. That is coercive.This really isn't difficult.

Actually @TipJarTroubadours- as other family members have done this then moved on from your caravan park, if they still live close by, have any continued to visit you regularly once it’s no longer a condition of their accommodation? Or do they not actually want to spend every Sunday evening with you.

You could ask those who’ve moved out to be honest about how they felt about the Sunday dinners. Was it enjoyable on reflection or something they suffered through to get free housing. How did it make them feel about you?

Im sure if the alternative is homelessness, your DN will suck it up and turn up. Do you feel you’ll ever be able to enjoy Sunday evenings again knowing he hates it?

sorry, but even if the aunt/OP isn't much fun to be around, if you are living with her rent-free on condition of having one meal with her once a week, then that's what you do. If he can't do that one thing and plaster a smile on for a couple of hours once a week, he'll really struggle in the world of work, where he'll have to tolerate the presence of even more people who are not fun to be around, from 9 - to 5 Monday to Friday. And, no, I don't think it's a far-fetched comparison.

Also bear in mind it's not some creepy predatory stranger ogling him over dinner while seductively licking her lips and sucking on a chicken bone, these are aunt and nephew we are talking about, and it's for a limited period of time, aka couple of years max while he's studying. so let's say 104 times, minus holidays, Xmas, weekends away, Easter, staying with friends etc, it should be do-able.

OK, I'll clarify:

She is offering him the opportunity to be an active part of the family life of the people (including her) who own the caravan park. This is a tradition that goes back 20-30 years. About 15 other people have willingly partaken of it.

She allows people who are actively part of family life by way of a communal Sunday dinner, to live rent-free.

She does not offer rent-free accommodation to people who aren't an active part of this community.

Her nephew chooses to not be an active part of this community, which certainly is his right.

Therefore, the nephew is not offered rent-free accommodation. He can pay up, he can move. But he can't worm out of the agreement and still get his rent-free uni digs.

Why would OP and her husband want to offer ten thousand pounds a year for someone who has no interest in them? They aren't running a charity.

Er, I'm doing none of those things. Some VERY weird projection going on here, are you quite well?

Yes. I think you’ve put your finger on what’s off. The OP clearly has no need of the rent, or she simply couldn’t afford to keep letting people stay there for free, or it would be in return for something that saved her money or freed up time, like the other examples, and there’s no actual ‘need’ for particular people to attend Sunday dinner. It’s all about power and control.

It also reminds me of when you host foreign students

Why don’t you just charge them a reduced rent? Surely no rent plus you making Sunday dinner costs you even more.

Despite reading all your responses I am still really confused as to why you want any of them to Sunday dinner in the first place???
it’s not even you expecting them to make Sunday dinner in exchange for something but you wanting to do something else for them.
Are you really close to these people? Why do you want to spend time with them every week?

Its not an ask though, it's a demand on pain of eviction.

Why can't people see that there's a massive difference?

Maybe he has good reasons. Maybe he initially thought it sounded a nice idea but is now finding it cloying and uncomfortable. People have a right to change their relationships if they're not working for them - otherwise we'd all be married to our teen sweetheart.

@TipJarTroubadourswhat do you get out of people attending your Sunday dinner when they might really not want to be there, they feel they have no choice because they can’t afford to rent and may actively dislike coming?

Well, if he agreed to the terms and conditions, he should stick to them. But it seems a rather strange condition to set.

Are you in advertising?

"15 other people didn't mind"

So? Sounds like "my last gf would do it, why won't you?

Shudder

@TipJarTroubadours if your DS doesn’t attend, will you evict him?

I think it is great that you are upholding a family tradition and building bonds between famlly and friends. Nephew should attend, he is being an entitled twat.

This is a very sinister thread.

I love the mortgage comment. I love that it appeared to be serious 😂

Yes, those are both obligations and if you want your family to resent you as much as they do a high street bank then fill your boots.

I am intelligent and mature enough to comprehend that things evolve, and that, as the OP has undoubtedly observed over the decades, people may balk at something and then evolve to find value in it.

Little kids have to be taught table manners. Adolescents need to be supported in forming good study habits. Young adults need to learn to consider others besides themselves and the discipline to follow through with things that are less than exciting.

Sometimes young people do not immediately value family connections but they come to learn over time the value, and as they get to know people as human beings rather than "aunt" "grandmother" etc., they actually like them. I am sure that consistent contact strengthens these bonds. OP clearly believes it's worth a try and is willing to lose out on thousands of pounds in rent to give nephew the opportunity.

If that doesn't work out for the nephew, he is free to move along. No one, including the OP, owes him free accommodation in return for disdain and disinterest.

Attributing sinister and nefarious motives to the OP, and calling her names like "old bat" and "crazy aunt," really say more about the toxic background of certain posters than they do about the OP. Sorry you have been conditioned to see a straightforward and wholesome scenario as "coercive."

@Consideringparttime- I don’t see that as equal as the elderly neighbour needs to go to those appointments so if his niece didn’t take him, he’d have to pay a taxi or a carer to take him.

The uncle got something from this arrangement. The question is, what does the OP get from this arrangement? She must feel the benefit of this enforced social occasions or she’d not mind it not happening.

So @TipJarTroubadours- what do you get from this to make it worth you enforcing it/insisting on each guest doing it?

Do you resent the bank that took a chance on lending you money to buy your property? Why?

That's perplexing. Do you think you should have been given a house for free?

I don’t think that’s what they’re saying.

I think they’re saying a bank is very different to a family member. The relationship.

But these aren’t little children requiring guidance and parenting, they are fully grown adults, and bribing and blackmailing them in this way is extremely unreasonable, exploitative and toxic as hell.

Goodness me @TipJarTroubadours you’re getting some ridiculous responses on here. It is not a big ask, asking your guests (as this is what they are) to attend one meal a week, which you are kind enough to lay on. Where are you? I’d gladly live there and attend meals. I’d also pay some rent! Goodness!

He is her nephew! Her sister's son. Why does the OP expect anything in return? My nephews are important to me. If I had a free caravan I didn't need, I would lend it to them, no problem. I certainly wouldn't demand anything in return.

Someone had it right earlier and I can’t find the post - but that it’s power play (the dinner thing - not the thread!).

Follow the rules or go.