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AIBU?

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Original poster

To want Prince Andrew to lose his title and go to prison?

228 replies

Fandango52 · 21/10/2025 00:28

I read an extract at the weekend of Virginia Giuffre’s book and it really shocked me. I was aware - like lots of people - of her case against Epstein, Ghislaine Maxwell and Prince Andrew, and also watched Emily Maitlis’s interview with Prince Andrew when it came out a few years ago.

We know that Epstein and Maxwell went to prison and I think Andrew should also go to prison. He raped Virginia Giuffre and lied about this, repeatedly denying he had actually met her. This would definitely lead to criminal charges for non-royals (even if the case was later dropped, as it often is with rape - which is another story).

I know it’s likely Andrew won’t go to prison - mainly because he is a prince - and I find that so grim. I know he’s lost some of his titles, like his dukedom, but I don’t think that is enough.

I have no connection to the case at all and no reason to be particularly invested in it, apart from the fact it’s shocking and quite unique, and because I think it’s hugely unjust that Andrew probably won’t be brought to justice because he was born royal.

AIBU to think Andrew should at least be tried in court - and if found guilty, should lose his titles and go to prison?

OP posts:
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winter8090 · 21/10/2025 09:36

Ukisgaslit · 21/10/2025 08:48

Unbelievable.

Thankfully your sort of attitude is rare today .

Virginia Guiffre was trafficked . That means she was raped . Trafficked women cannot give consent .
Andrew lied about having no more contact with Epstein . He emailed him pledging his allegiance and wanting ‘ to play more soon’

Epstein made various plea bargains so was in prison ‘only’ for soliciting sex with a minor- (while further investigations went on behind the scenes )
Fergie and the daughters went to his prison release party . And you are now trying to argue that despite all of this ( and we know only a fraction) Andrew should be given the benefit of the doubt ??
Have you totally lost your moral compass ?

Show quote history

I’m not sure you fully understood my post.

My moral compass is intact, I clearly made reference to the fact I considered Andrews behaviour to be completely immoral.

How do you know Andrew knew she was “trafficked” or the full seedy details that later emerged about Epstein?

winter8090 · 21/10/2025 09:44

sashh · 21/10/2025 07:48

Come off it.

There is no age of consent when someone is trafficked.

No reason to believe she was trafficked? Do 17 year old American girls normally accompany their employer on trips to London?

Show quote history

Plenty of high end escorts willingly accompany their clients on trips at all ages.
is this now considered trafficking?

Letsbe · 21/10/2025 09:49

Fandango52 · 21/10/2025 00:28

I read an extract at the weekend of Virginia Giuffre’s book and it really shocked me. I was aware - like lots of people - of her case against Epstein, Ghislaine Maxwell and Prince Andrew, and also watched Emily Maitlis’s interview with Prince Andrew when it came out a few years ago.

We know that Epstein and Maxwell went to prison and I think Andrew should also go to prison. He raped Virginia Giuffre and lied about this, repeatedly denying he had actually met her. This would definitely lead to criminal charges for non-royals (even if the case was later dropped, as it often is with rape - which is another story).

I know it’s likely Andrew won’t go to prison - mainly because he is a prince - and I find that so grim. I know he’s lost some of his titles, like his dukedom, but I don’t think that is enough.

I have no connection to the case at all and no reason to be particularly invested in it, apart from the fact it’s shocking and quite unique, and because I think it’s hugely unjust that Andrew probably won’t be brought to justice because he was born royal.

AIBU to think Andrew should at least be tried in court - and if found guilty, should lose his titles and go to prison?

Who would give evidence?

JackandSallySkellington · 21/10/2025 09:50

Meadowfinch · 21/10/2025 01:41

Could you honestly sleep nights, knowing that someone had been locked up, deprived of their freedom, without you knowing whether he deserved it or not?

We may be regressing on some fronts at the moment but we don't need a modern day prince in the tower. This is not the 15th century.

Not in my name anyway.

I absolutely support the rights of women, but not by shredding the rights of others in the process.

Show quote history

Fgs they said they wanted him to go on trial. Have you even read the OP or are you just instantly enraged by the thought of a rapist going to jail

NoArmaniNoPunani · 21/10/2025 09:52

When have the royals ever been bastions of morality? I'd get rid of the lot of them. But I'm not sure having a voted for president would give us any better option.

Guildford321 · 21/10/2025 09:57

winter8090 · 21/10/2025 09:44

Plenty of high end escorts willingly accompany their clients on trips at all ages.
is this now considered trafficking?

Show quote history

Willingly is problematic in itself. Women with choices don't choose to be bought by men. Theres typically trauma of some kind in their background. Does high class make it more palatable in your eyes? Large amounts of money change hands, therefore it's OK for me to buy permission to do whatever I want with a woman's body.

Vaxtable · 21/10/2025 09:59

There are two sides to every story and the truth is normally something in the middle

as someone else said it’s normally innocent until proven guilty in a court of law and ‘evidence’ in a book won’t cut it. VG is not here to provide any actual proof.

I just keep remembering Harry and Meghans truth in his book and their interviews which a lot being proven they were wrong so how do we know everything VG wrote us actually truth?

There are the emails now showing Andrew lied about the relationship with Epstein and he has now given up his titles. To a man who thinks they are the be all and end all it’s a big blow, along with no formal protection and no real income. Now if he can be made to move from Royal Lodge to somewhere much smaller and can take no part in any events private or not that’s about the best that can be done

Aluna · 21/10/2025 10:04

Vaxtable · 21/10/2025 09:59

There are two sides to every story and the truth is normally something in the middle

as someone else said it’s normally innocent until proven guilty in a court of law and ‘evidence’ in a book won’t cut it. VG is not here to provide any actual proof.

I just keep remembering Harry and Meghans truth in his book and their interviews which a lot being proven they were wrong so how do we know everything VG wrote us actually truth?

There are the emails now showing Andrew lied about the relationship with Epstein and he has now given up his titles. To a man who thinks they are the be all and end all it’s a big blow, along with no formal protection and no real income. Now if he can be made to move from Royal Lodge to somewhere much smaller and can take no part in any events private or not that’s about the best that can be done

That’s not actually true. Sometimes truth is on one side and not the other. Particularly when something unethical or illegal is involved.

Aluna · 21/10/2025 10:05

winter8090 · 21/10/2025 09:44

Plenty of high end escorts willingly accompany their clients on trips at all ages.
is this now considered trafficking?

Show quote history

Trafficking has a specific legal definition which you could discover online instead of asking disingenuous questions online.

Aluna · 21/10/2025 10:09

Fandango52 · 21/10/2025 08:50

He did commit a crime in the U.K. He had sex with VG in Ghislaine Maxwell’s London flat - which is a crime, as @WaryHiker says in the post from 05:34 (having sex with a trafficked woman is still a crime in the UK, whether or not she is or over the age of consent).

Show quote history

The loophole aiui is that it wasn’t a criminal offence in the U.K. at the time as it was before the current sex trafficking laws were introduced.

Smallsalt · 21/10/2025 10:10

Meadowfinch · 21/10/2025 01:31

What happened to the process of law? To innocent until proven guilty? Have the standards of 'beyond all reasonable doubt" been met?

I don't think they have. It is his word against hers.

Did she write that book, to maximise her financial legacy for her family? Did she exaggerate through anger and trauma? Did she tell the absolute truth? As she saw it, or as it was? Was her book a final act of revenge? I don't know and neither do you.

Just because you don't like someone, because he is an arrogant entitled fool and you are jealous of the advantages he has had in life, does not make him a criminal. Proof is needed to deprive someone of their freedom.

I prefer to live in a country where being sent to prison depends on a high standard of proof, and it applies to everyone equally. Trial by broadsheet is nothing to aspire to.

Edited

Well we don't have the option for innocent until proven guilty because the police have continually declined to investigate. Not even, investigated, then decided not to proceed.

They haven't investigated.
That in itself reeks.
The man got his mother to pay 12 million to shut up a person "he never met". He has "voluntarily" given up titles due to allegations from somebody "he never met"
Really?
There are people in jail on less evidence.
If I was innocent I would be demanding an inestigation from the police and demanding my day in court .

KeepAwayFromChildren · 21/10/2025 10:11

Fandango52 · 21/10/2025 02:18

No, I agree. VG did bring a lawsuit against him a few years ago - as I mention earlier - and Andrew paid her £12m, as reported in the media, so that’s probably the closest thing to justice that will be achieved. Which is horrible.

Show quote history

It IS horrible but...the effect on him must have been and continues to be extreme. He is probably an arrogant, thick asshole but I imagine he wants to be liked and admired. All that is gone now. His mother is no longer there to protect him, the king is loosening A's entitlements and William will be far more extreme in his treatment of him.

I too would love to see the full extent of the law used against him and I think he should be made to shift for himself but he's a national joke and not a funny one. That must be eating him alive.

Sadcafe · 21/10/2025 10:11

From a legal perspective though, is there enough evidence to gain a conviction, it is her word against his and she isn’t here anymore to testify, I don’t pretend to know the legalities around trying to prosecute someone when the lead witness is dead, but surely it’s a non starter. What he should do is help give evidence against others if he knows things. Not read her book, not going to , but I’d be interested to know why so little is said about the other men who allegedly raped her and in law it is alleged, regardless of what anyone thinks, until proven guilty.

Ukisgaslit · 21/10/2025 10:13

winter8090 · 21/10/2025 09:36

I’m not sure you fully understood my post.

My moral compass is intact, I clearly made reference to the fact I considered Andrews behaviour to be completely immoral.

How do you know Andrew knew she was “trafficked” or the full seedy details that later emerged about Epstein?

Show quote history

Oh I understand your post perfectly well.

Its the old ‘ oh Andrew is disgusting but but but’
What do we know ?
As others have already made clear on this thread :
-Andrew pledged to help the police - once the scandal broke of course not before - he didn’t help the police in any way .He hid from them .

Andrew said in his interview that he had no more contact with Epstein after his stay with Epstein ( this was after Epstein had been convicted) when we now know he emailed him to say ‘they’d play soon’

We know that Sarah and her daughter went to Epsteins release from prison party ( convicted of soliciting a minor )

We know Andrew asked his tax payer funded protection officer to dig up dirt on Virginia after somehow obtaining her US national insurance number

We know Elizabeth paid her multiple millions to go away.

We also know some of Andrew’s behaviour as a trade envoy

Ultimately we know that Andrew despite protesting his innocence has never sought to clear his name or to help the police as an innocent person would

But sure keep attempting to muddy the waters - we see you

Ukisgaslit · 21/10/2025 10:23

@KeepAwayFromChildren

William will do what William wants to do and nothing more .

That William is some sort of avenger is another PR line .
When the scandal broke 5 years ago William was happy to be photographed on several occasions with Andrew beside him in the front seat . Kate smiling away in the back .
They knew what he did and didn’t give a damn. They thought they’d brazen it out as they’ve done with all the scandals.

Note it’s always the next Windsor up who will clean house . Once William has the hat it will be George and so ad infinitum until we get rid of the cancer that is the Windsors

winter8090 · 21/10/2025 10:32

Ukisgaslit · 21/10/2025 10:13

Oh I understand your post perfectly well.

Its the old ‘ oh Andrew is disgusting but but but’
What do we know ?
As others have already made clear on this thread :
-Andrew pledged to help the police - once the scandal broke of course not before - he didn’t help the police in any way .He hid from them .

Andrew said in his interview that he had no more contact with Epstein after his stay with Epstein ( this was after Epstein had been convicted) when we now know he emailed him to say ‘they’d play soon’

We know that Sarah and her daughter went to Epsteins release from prison party ( convicted of soliciting a minor )

We know Andrew asked his tax payer funded protection officer to dig up dirt on Virginia after somehow obtaining her US national insurance number

We know Elizabeth paid her multiple millions to go away.

We also know some of Andrew’s behaviour as a trade envoy

Ultimately we know that Andrew despite protesting his innocence has never sought to clear his name or to help the police as an innocent person would

But sure keep attempting to muddy the waters - we see you

Show quote history

I’m not attempting to muddy the waters. The waters ARE muddy hence why there has been no conviction.

Ukisgaslit · 21/10/2025 10:36

Nonsense !

There has been no conviction because the Windsors protect their own - no matter what they have done

What have they said about Mountbatten never mind Andrew ?! Nothing .
Not a word
And they won’t .

WhyamIinahandcartandwherearewegoing · 21/10/2025 10:48

Fandango52 · 21/10/2025 01:58

Yes, that is very true that she has accused him of rape (her US lawsuit says she was forced to have several sexual encounters with him) and he has denied it.

However, he has paid her a multi-million settlement (estimated to be £12m). Why did he pay her?

And why did he have sex with her? She was less than half his age (41 compared to 17, which is just a year over the U.K. age of consent and still seen as a child in terms of U.K. law).

Show quote history

The whole thing stinks yes, and I believe that he did have sex with her. If this was in the uk and she was 17, is that grounds for a UK prosecution, given the age of consent? The issue of consent/coersion is certainly up for debate.

whilst the US out of court settlement payment also stinks, had that not been accepted might we have seen him stand trial?

he’s an arrogant disgusting pig and I hope Parliament are guided by the royal family to legislate for removal of the Prince title, currently a mechanism does not exist.

Franpie · 21/10/2025 10:56

Apparently the met police looked into the case on 3 separate occasions following VG’s claims and concluded there was not enough evidence to charge. Cressida Dick said that no one was above the law.

PA was being sued in the US. £12m is small fry compared to how much would have been spent in US legal fees defending himself.

As much as I can’t stand PA, paying off the civil case was the sensible thing to do as it was a lose/lose situation whether he was guilty or innocent.

Ukisgaslit · 21/10/2025 10:57

@WhyamIinahandcartandwherearewegoing

Why one earth should parliament be guided by the corrupt Windsors ??

Arent we always told the Windsors have no power and they are just figureheads?

The last people we should be guided by are the Windsors - they lie and cover up and cannot be .

Voters would be grateful to any party or individual MP ( some have tried ) that takes action on this and other Windsor abuses

KeepAwayFromChildren · 21/10/2025 10:59

Any light shone in will expose what the Queen knew.

I imagine PA will benefit from any distaste for that.

Franpie · 21/10/2025 11:01

Smallsalt · 21/10/2025 10:10

Well we don't have the option for innocent until proven guilty because the police have continually declined to investigate. Not even, investigated, then decided not to proceed.

They haven't investigated.
That in itself reeks.
The man got his mother to pay 12 million to shut up a person "he never met". He has "voluntarily" given up titles due to allegations from somebody "he never met"
Really?
There are people in jail on less evidence.
If I was innocent I would be demanding an inestigation from the police and demanding my day in court .

Show quote history

Apparently they did investigate…

https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2021/oct/10/uk-met-police-reportedly-speak-prince-andrew-accuser-virginia-giuffre

Met police drop investigation into Prince Andrew in Virginia Giuffre case

Officers made decision after reportedly talking to Giuffre and a review of documents

https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2021/oct/10/uk-met-police-reportedly-speak-prince-andrew-accuser-virginia-giuffre

Ukisgaslit · 21/10/2025 11:03

@Franpie

Lol- are you seriously suggesting that it was frugality or shortage of funds that led Elizabeth to pay off Andrew’s accuser ?

An innocent man would not hesitate to have his day in court- never mind the rest of the damning details that we now know !

Ukisgaslit · 21/10/2025 11:04

@Franpie

There have been several MET investigations re the Windsors

Nothing to see here