Aibu to try and overturn my son’s permanent exclusion

[ThatRealBlueQuoter]

So this year me and my 5 children have moved from Birmingham to another town due to domestic violence got my children into school my 15 ds has been through a lot with my ex husband one of the main ones been strangled until he passed and and cracked his head open on a table this I feel is relevant to the permanent exclusion my son has received from the school.On the day my son got permanently excluded him and another lad had been messing about in class as a “joke” this boy has pulled out the chair from under my ds making him fall and bang his head my son has then got up and punched the boy four times in the face,I’m in no way dismissing this behaviour he no’s he done wrong and is very ashamed he told the teacher been hit on the head is a trigger for him he knows he shouldn’t of reacted like that,I went to a meeting after a 5 day exclusion with my son to try and plead his case the headteacher wouldn’t budge and handed me the permanent exclusion letter she basically said my ds is to much of a risk ,I found her to be very dismissive and not understanding at all is this worth appealing?the student who done this to my son received a punishment but I wasn’t allowed to be told what it is,I know he is still attending the school my son will now have to go to a behaviour centre my argument is really that shouldn’t the school at least have offered help anger management etc he only has 9 months left before he leaves it is the first time he has actually enjoyed school now the school are trying to get me to sign a letter and they are saying if I do the permanent exclusion won’t go on my sons record?Im in no way condoning what my son has done,can anyone offer advice

Anyone replying on here who has no idea what impact adverse childhood experiences like domestic violence have - should just shut up and take their judgemental comments elsewhere

Yeah. It creates more violent men who end up murdering women.

@ThatRealBlueQuoter Im in no way condoning what my son has done

I am.

Geez. One punch is enough to kill someone. He needs to go to a PRU and learn emotional regulation skills.

They have to hold a panel meeting of Governors + clerk that you need to attend. It is very possible that his previous injuries and your living situation could represent SEND and those needs have not been met. After the panel, if they uphold the decision, confirm immediately in writing that you wish to appeal and go to independent review.

He should have a place at alternative provision by the 6th day of absence due to permanent exclusion, arranged by the local authority as it is their responsibility to do so.

Whilst I am not suggesting that he must go back to the school or that the school are acting in any way improperly, by following the process and stating that you require an Independent SEND expert, this maximises the opportunity for him to be assessed for effects of his horrible attack(s), any preexisting SEND that had been missed and PTSD/cPTSD. And it's your right to appeal, so do so.

Had he hit the idiot who caused him to fall once then it would probably have been treated differently, six and two threes. Both boys did wrong and should be punished, possibly the other boy being held more at fault but he hit him a number of times and that cannot be condoned.

I think your son punching the lad who pulled his chair out is reasonable. But, maybe not four times.

I wonder if the school would have excluded him for a single punch? I hope not.

The other lad assaulted your son. I hope he has been excluded.

Fucking hell, this is a laundry list of excuses. He jumped up and punched someone in the head 4 times because he had a concussion, what a daft suggestion. As to learning some "marginally safer" ways to respond to triggers, do you mean punch someone twice instead of 4 times?!? And claiming he felt his life was threatened because the boy he was messing about with pulled his chair away from him. What an utter joke. It wasn't self defence and there is no evidence he was afraid for his life.

This lad has clearly suffered a great deal being a victim of assault from his dad and being raised in a home with dv. It does him no favours if the adults in his life were to take this kind of minimising approach, ignoring his violent outbursts and worst telling lies to justify them.

@ThatRealBlueQuoter can you give a timeline of correspondence and meetings since day of incident? Have you been given details yet of the panel meeting?

From my understanding - the school hasn’t followed the correct procedures- please appeal - in the guidance it is clear that a suspension should not be followed by a permanent exclusion unless very clear and strict processes are followed - they can not also get you to sign a letter to avoid the PEX to be on file - the school must inform the local authority (for an academy or maintained school) this is national guidance - it seems they want your son out and will frame it as you agreeing to a managed move to a PRU.

if you want more info, please get in touch - please appeal if you are within timescale - disgusting behaviour from the school

@Watfordwoman that is what I am confused about.

Not going to comment on the exclusion but the other kid could have done a permanent injury on him too! Pulling a chair so he fell and banged his head is premeditated, at best to cause embarrassment at worst to cause injury. He also needs a severe punishment

op I’m glad you got away from you’re ex. You’re very brave

hopefully your son gets the help he needs and deserves ( ps could his anger be a physical issue from brain trauma?)

I also sit on PEX panels and independent review panels and disagree, - even if it was for a one off offence, mitigating circumstances would need to be evident of informing the Head teacher decision. Converting from a suspension to a PEX is also no longer allowed unless the school tells you it is based on new information in the investigation and it must be compelling information

and no school should ever tell a parent if they sign a form it won’t go on permanent record

unfortunately the provisions within a PRU vary widely across the country - there is absolutely no guarantee that the support your son needs will be available via a PRU

I haven't read all comments but I agree with this. I am always suspicious when a school tries to exclude by the back door - by agreement without having it on record. They are worried about their own exclusion statistics, not your son. It will not impact him long term having this "on his record".

My own son who is adopted and had emotional issues - the school tried to exclude him aged 5 "by agreement" for the same reason. They tried to push me into it by saying they didn't want it on his record. I said it would help - I wanted him formally excluded as I thought we would be entitled to more help. Guess what - they backed down and actually refused to exclude him even though I said it would be the better thing. I am still angry about this hypocrisy years later.

maybe it's not the right school for him. Maybe he's better off staying. I can't comment. But don't be pushed into something you feel is wrong.

@Owly11 plead trauma? Are you being serious. Do you have any idea how witnessing domestic violence impacts children? It is most definitely trauma that he has gone through. He most probably has PTSD. Having specials list support and therapy is most definitely the right way to go.
Yes it was disproportionate what he did and I hope the other boy is ok but what he did was wrong too.

Exactly this.

How many times do we impress upon children how dangerous it is to pull a chair out from behind someone? We tell them that it might just be a silly joke in their heads, but that it could result in life changing injuries for the person sitting down. I’m not seeing that there’s a huge difference between what either of the boys did, and the potential consequences of their actions. Coupled with the crowing texts he’s sent the OP’s son, the other boy sounds like a horrible little shit who picked on the wrong person, and who still hasn’t learnt his lesson.

OP, I hope that, whatever happens, it turns out to be the best possible thing for your DS.

If a woman pulled her husband’s chair out as a joke and he hit his head and he punched her four times in the face, would your stance be the same? A full grown man who has learnt with age how to regulate his emotions, with far more upper body strength hitting someone far weaker? Or two hormonal fifteen year olds, presumably similar sizes with similar levels of strength? I don’t think your analogy holds up.

Yeah. It creates more violent men who end up murdering women It also creates men who don’t punch people without reason, but who also won’t take any shit from bullies who try to hurt them.

You know how you, rightly, left your abuser and would never want to have to see him again? Well, that’s how your son’s victim feels 🙄 Course it is. I’m sure he was trembling in fear as his innocent little fingers were typing out texts taking the piss out of the OP’s son for being excluded. And he’s not a victim ffs. He wasn’t sitting quietly, minding his own business, while some brute came up behind him and physically attacked him. He wasn’t even just having a verbal altercation with him. He did something that could have put the OP’s son in hospital and he had the consequences for that.

No never managed moved maybe a behaviour unit would be better for him I have found the schools over here a lot more stricter them Birmingham but that’s a good thing

Is your son getting help for his violent behaviour, which could be partly due to and influenced by trauma he has witnessed or learned behaviour. What are you doing to address these issues? You cannot blame the other boy and dismiss your sons actions.

I'm really sorry that you are having to deal with all this OP, your son also.
I don't have any knowledge of the appeal process and likelihood of your son being allowed to return to the school.
The priority is your son's education now. I have a friend whose son went to a PRU and did very well.
Hang on in there
Wishing you and your family well

This is a sad story to read . I am a firm believer that children communicate through behaviour and clearly your son is struggling after going through something so traumatic.

However, he clearly has anger issues that need to be addressed , the other child was very cruel with what he did but your son’s reaction - as you know - was extreme. It’s surely a natural defensive reaction, last time he hurt his head he probably thought he was going to die and that’s horrendous so I don’t blame him for his reaction but this could have been so much worse . Your son should not be in this situation. Neither should other children. Punching 4 times sounds to me like a bit of a “ seeing red “ situation - this could have been worse , the other child could have been seriously injured and that would also have had severe repercussions for your son. Things like this are going to happen in secondary - others will remember this, for some it would make them more likely to try and get a reaction. The school can clearly not support your son.

Is it a PRU they are sending your son to ? You will hear all sorts - they’re full of “naughty” children, they all run riot - but it’s not the case . They have specialist staff, who will support your son , recognise his triggers , keep him safe and work with him to be able to manage his emotions. Honestly, it’s probably the best thing for him . He will still get his education and in all honesty he will have more support and a higher pupil : teacher ratio meaning he will get a better standard of education if he can accept the support offered .

This is desperately sad OP. I hope you all get the support you need and your son is happy in the new setting. Agree with others it's probably best for him

Violent 15 year olds turn into violent men.
Particularly those whose behaviour is excused.

I wonder if you’d be so sympathetic if it was your child on the receiving end of his fists.

No it isn't how he feels... the boy sent texts to OPs son taunting him and gloating about the exclusion.... he's just as much of an abuser. He's a bully.

If they have followed the process correctly and his violence is as bad as it sounds you have no chance of overturning it. You need to look at the policies and processes in detail because that’s where they will fall down (although given the severity of the consequence I imagine they have tried to follow it to the letter).

the thing is if it is overturned what will you expect, how can the other boy and those who witnessed it feel safe.if he only has 9 months left probably worth focusing on getting his education and exams elsewhere rather than battling for a school to retain him.

your sons background is absolutely horrific, but other children shouldn’t be subjected to that violence because he is yet to receive therapeutic interventions. I appreciate he is still a child, but surely he knows how damaging violence is?

ad an aside has he had incidents of violence at his previous schools?

Ahhh ok

I know loads of people who have died because of texts. Never heard of anyone being killed by a punch to the head though.