Aibu to try and overturn my son’s permanent exclusion

[ThatRealBlueQuoter]

So this year me and my 5 children have moved from Birmingham to another town due to domestic violence got my children into school my 15 ds has been through a lot with my ex husband one of the main ones been strangled until he passed and and cracked his head open on a table this I feel is relevant to the permanent exclusion my son has received from the school.On the day my son got permanently excluded him and another lad had been messing about in class as a “joke” this boy has pulled out the chair from under my ds making him fall and bang his head my son has then got up and punched the boy four times in the face,I’m in no way dismissing this behaviour he no’s he done wrong and is very ashamed he told the teacher been hit on the head is a trigger for him he knows he shouldn’t of reacted like that,I went to a meeting after a 5 day exclusion with my son to try and plead his case the headteacher wouldn’t budge and handed me the permanent exclusion letter she basically said my ds is to much of a risk ,I found her to be very dismissive and not understanding at all is this worth appealing?the student who done this to my son received a punishment but I wasn’t allowed to be told what it is,I know he is still attending the school my son will now have to go to a behaviour centre my argument is really that shouldn’t the school at least have offered help anger management etc he only has 9 months left before he leaves it is the first time he has actually enjoyed school now the school are trying to get me to sign a letter and they are saying if I do the permanent exclusion won’t go on my sons record?Im in no way condoning what my son has done,can anyone offer advice

He has only been there since September and clearly things have not gone well. If you turn around the suspension I fear things will not improve until he goes off for ‘study leave’ in May. With such a low attendance in year 10 the outcomes are unlikely to improve as staff are heading towards the final sections of their courses and will struggle to plug his knowledge gaps whilst trying to meet the targets of all the other students. What has his attendance been like this term so far?

Year 11 will have mock exams at the end of December/ beginning of January. How will he cope if his grades are low in comparison to other kids? Will his attendance dip? Will he be disruptive in class if he is struggling?

I think you need to go into the meeting and insist that the PRU place is guaranteed and that he is not sat at home on a waiting list. PRUs because they are small and have more specialist provision tend to operate at capacity so a place is not a certainty. Having nothing in place would be the worse position @ThatRealBlueQuoter so you need to be clear with the headteacher.

Bollocks.

If one of my sons did the chair thing and the other kid had lashed out at them - a punch, kick, slap, whatever - yep, fuck around and find out.

Punching someone in the face FOUR TIMES is excessive and disproportionate. That's a total lack of self control, a dangerously extreme overreaction and a sustained attack. In a school.

It's sad what op's son has suffered but if you speak to any violent criminal, they often have a long sad history of an awful childhood and/or some kind of abuse they suffered.

Op's son absolutely deserved the expulsion and needs keeping away from other kids for their own safety.

If one of mine was attacked at school like this and I was told the school were fannying around with anger management for them i'd go fucking wild.

@ThatRealBlueQuoter what's happening with DS's education at the moment?

A violent outburst like this would have caused chaos in a year 11 classroom. I dare say created concern for member of staff as well as the other students. Potentially quite a frightening experience for the onlookers. Obviously we have only heard one side of the story and we don’t know it any other incidents. We don’t know what the member of staff wrote in the incident report. Normally both pupils will be punished but schools do not typically share that information - the other boy may well have a short term exclusion or a couple of days in the time out room.

If my child was assaulted in this way and the school allowed the attacker to stay in school, I would go to the police. The school may have saved you this by excluding your child.

If someone pulled a chair out from under your son making him hit his head on a wall, causing a lump on his head, how would you feel? Would you want the perpetrator punished ? Or what if your son was the chair puller, and caused injury to someone? What then.....

Respectfully, the school has an obligation to keep the children safe. Your son has shown himself to be violent and unpredictable- a lot of that is due to trauma but that isn’t the schools problem.
if he had given the child a dig, they might’ve let it go as it was retaliation but he punched him 4 times. That response was disproportionate and showed a lack of control.
From the schools perspective, if they reinstate your son and another child is hurt by him they’d be on very shaky ground. Also, even if they empathise with your sons experience, him having trauma is going to be of no comfort to the next child who gets a smack to he face. That child and their parent have no responsibility for your sons experience.
You can appeal but even a single act of violence can trigger a PEX so I don’t think you’d have too many grounds. It’s likely the governors won’t sacrifice the wellbeing of the children in the school for your son

@Grapewrath if school haven't followed process governors will have no choice but to reinstate OP's child, no matter the level of violence. That's why schools need to ensure they follow the guidance

I have a younger child who is sometimes violent at school, although for different reasons.

I know it’s hard to accept but I wouldn’t appeal the decision here. Looking at long term adult outcomes for your son, the PRU is going to be the best place for him to learn to manage that trigger response and to access counselling to enable him to take a different path from his father.

What I would do is begin speaking to both the pru and the school to negotiate the best possible outcome for your child, in exchange for not appealing. Pp has suggested dropping back a year which sounds sensible. I’d also try and push for therapy using the exclusion as evidence of need.

Exactly
As I have said upthread we are there to check process etc. We Can ask School to reconsider (I have done this) but if its all been done properly we cannot overturn anything.
One thing I would also say is that the wellbeing of other pupils has to be considered. My DS was 6ft by age 15 and lifts weights, seeing him and someone else a similar size going at it would be pretty terrifying for the rest of the class.

Leaving an abusive partner, restarting life elsewhere, picking up the pieced as best she can?

Which is why I am wondering if this is the whole story.

As much as thats sad as Hell and I truly do sympathise, his reaction was still overly hostile, yes as he's experienced that too, but they can't risk other kid's safety because he needs help

A PRU may not be the worst place for your son if he has anger issues. They have trained professionals who are used to this behaviour.

While it sounds like your son has had a horrible time lately( and been deeply affected), the school were in the right. How would you feel if your son was punched four times in the head? If I was the other parent, I’d be pushing for a criminal record, regardless of reason. He could have seriously injured or killed the boy.

Thank you

Oh do me a favour! It was a practical question. The OP is asking is she BU to try to have an exclusion overturned. To overturn an exclusion you have to be able to demonstrate progress regarding the issue causing the exclusion. If her son has punched someone in the face four times and his anger issues are not being addressed there’s no point appealing the exclusion.

Stop being offended on other people’s behalf. The OP answered my question no problem, and I followed up with my advice/opinion.

I think a PRU may help him more than mainstream school.

I agree with other posts highlighting that schools are no longer allowed to convert fixed term exclusions to permanent. I sat on a panel whose exclusion was over-turned by a local authority panel solely on that basis. This case was a longer term pattern of behaviour, the head had issued another fixed term exclusion and then concluded actually this is the final straw, I can’t continue to put other pupils and staff at risk and changed it - but this was ruled by expert panel as not permitted.

Someone pulled a chair out from me once (over 15 years ago) and I can’t can tell you how embarrassed, shocked and hurt I was, I still think about why someone would do that to me occasionally! Wish I had punched her in the face 4 times. You can definitely appeal, I’m not sure you’ll win though. Don’t sign anything if you’re not happy with it, if you get offered a PRU in the meantime I would take it so he can continue his education.

Have you ever been in a fight? Have you ever punched anyone straight in the face, even once? This isn't the type of thing most people find easy to do, let alone four times - watching a face become increasingly damaged each time. It's the type of thing that might roll off the tongue but which takes a particular type of person to do.

Oh fuck off. Such a lack of empathy in my understanding.

He is remorseful he said he is scared he is going to end up like his dad I have promised him that I will get him all the help he obviously needs and deserves and he will be nothing like him,I will continue with appeals but my son does have a place a pru that he will start this week which is good and it actually seems quite decent and the staff seem genuine

I am trying to turn things round I have made a lot of mistakes and have failed as a mother I am trying to sort my children out I have moved to a better city we have family around us after been isolated for over 15 years my eldest have gone to university to study law my other children are doing ok in school I’m trying to undo years of damage

I’m sorry to hear that he has been offered a place at PRU it actually seems quite decent so at least he can sit his exams there if need be ❤️

I’m assuming this would be a second PEX if you’re saying he’ll go to a PRU. Otherwise it would be another mainstream school through in year fair access panel.

what was his first PEX for? This would be relevant.