To think family members should turn up before guests at a funeral?

[Porkyyorkylass]

I went to a dear friends funeral last week.
service started at 1pm. One of his daughters was there when I arrived saying hello etc at about 12.45ish. However his other two daughters were nowhere to be seen. They dashed into the chapel at 5minute past one - they had to delay bringing in the coffin to wait for them. They they were the first out at the end of the service and huddled in a corner together not talking to any of the invited guests. They didn’t look particularly upset or distressed so I don’t think that was the issue. I managed to talk to one of them and said ‘I’m so sorry etc and politely asked if they had hit traffic and how stressed they must’ve been trying to get to the service - they looked a bit non plused and said they weren’t stressed and arrived exactly as planned. At the wake again they just sat on a table chatting amongst themselves with their husbands and made no effort to mingle - again didn’t look particularly upset. I was just so embarrassed for my friend who I know would be upset if he saw his daughters being rude like this at his funeral. Also, I felt a bit sorry for the youngest daughter who clearly was making an effort and had to essentially ‘host’ alone. Maybe I’m being a prude - what do people think AIBU or were they incredibly rude and disrespectful to their father?

I 100% agree with you OP

You don't know what their relationship was like, what their greaf is like or what their feeling. If there's one time someone should be cut slack is at the funeral of a close family member. It was mean and uncalled for to bring up their lateness

I can't believe you asked a grieving daughter why she was 'late' to her father's funeral. How tone deaf and intrusive.

You were very rude and passive aggressive to ask about traffic. If they arrived when they said they planned to it was maybe because they didn’t want to ‘host’ people at their parents funeral, maybe they just wanted to turn up to say goodbye and didn’t want to make small talk with judgemental busy bodies like yourself.

This.

They are not there to host you.

They are their to mourn their dad.

You are there to pay your respects to the family. Not sure why that means they need to chat to you.

I don’t get why funerals are a social event. I’ve been lucky enough to only have attended one funeral in my life (my grandfather’s) and I don’t have fond memories of it. I distinctly remember three old ladies I didn’t know (I spent a lot of time with my grandparents, so if they had been close to them I’d definitely had known who they were) not getting off the three only chairs in the room and out of such room when I entered to say my last goodbyes. I found the whole event distressing and couldn’t understand why we were putting on a performance for other people instead of allowing close family to grieve. All of this is to say that people should stop worrying about themselves when they go to a funeral that does not involve a close family member of theirs. Attendees are not owed a performance from people who are grieving the loss of their loved ones. Stories like these make me seriously consider whether I will host a funeral when my father passes. He is beloved by many and I know lots of people would love to pay their respects, but I also know I’ll be devastated and I won’t need people judging me while I grieve the loss of one of the most important people in my life.

It is quite possible for a person to be a lovely, upstanding pillar of the church, a genial friend and neighbour, whilst also being a vile, cruel and abusive parent to some or all of their children. It may be that these members of the family had been terribly hurt by the deceased and it cost them all the courage they could muster in order to turn up and quietly attend the funeral.

Ordinarily, yes, barring unforeseen circumstances and delays the family that aren't processing behind the coffin SHOULD be in place by the beginning of the service. But without knowing the dynamics in this particular circumstance it's impossible to either comment or judge.

@Porkyyorkylass This person may have been a dear friend of yours, but surely you must realise that people can have a different side to them with friends than the one they exhibit to family members.
You have no idea what their family life was like, or whether there were any rifts or discord between members of that family. So please do not judge other people for how they behave at their relative's funeral. You do not know the whole story.

Do you really want to get a bunch of strangers slagging off your dear friend’s children?

No, family members should not arrive before 'guests' at a funeral. Close family members arrive with with the coffin, having been part of the funeral procession.
They also follow the coffin into the church so they even enter after the deceased.

And you're not really a 'guest' at a funeral service. Anyone can attend if the details have been shared publicly. Maybe at the wake you could be considered a guest but there should be no expectation of family mourners, whether they look upset enough or not.

I don't think you were prude I think you were nosey. I understand that you fell bad for your friend as it is normal to think that every daughter or son will love their parents and vice versa, however family dynamics differ a lot and between those daughters being ungrateful daughter or your friend being a awful parent there are millions of possibilities that you may not be aware of.

You were being goady asking about the traffic just to make a point about them being a tiny bit late. Why would you care and why would you bring this up?

They obviously aren't following your rules for grieving the death of a parent. Why on earth were you embarrassed for your friend? Would he judge his daughters because they weren't performatively grieving to your standards?

I can't really think of any situation where it would be polite to point out someone's tardiness.

Occasionally it might be necessary, if it was inconveniencing you, but I have no idea why you felt it was appropriate in this situation.

Of all the things your friend hoped for his funeral it seems unlikely that his "friend" embarrassing his DC would be one of them.

Its commonplace for the family to arrive with the coffin, after all the mourners are already there and seated.
It is not the job of the immediate family to host and usher in the mourners as if they were invitees to a party.
It is not the job of the immediate family to perform grief to your satisfaction.

Your role was to be there in good time, find your place and take it. Then be as supportive as you can whilst sharing any of your own memories.

Snarky comments about “traffic holdups” and insufficient tears are not part of your role, you should have held your tongue.

Family usually arrive with the coffin.

It’s not a party and they’re not hosts. They didn’t owe you anything. You’ve no idea their state of mind, or state of relationship with the deceased (or other family members).

Yes some bluntess needed here: are you sure it is your place to make such comments and judgements on someone else's relative funeral

This ^ 100%
you don’t know the reality of their relationship it’s very easy to look as a devoted parent for friends.
So maybe they didn’t want to mingle as couldn’t bring themselves to lie about their late father.
Also we don’t know what they knew/ thought about your friendship maybe they didn’t know who you were hence their reaction or maybe they knew and didn’t like you hence their reaction.
So I wouldn’t judge so harshly.

Wow, so you didn't get your special handshake or be told how special you are at a funeral for someone else's parents.

Unbelievable from you. It's not about you.

Always best not to judge the bereaved as it’s impossible to tell how they’re feeling.

In our parts, the family arrive last in a funeral car or cars at the same time as the hearse.

You are judging mourners at a funeral because they aren't grieving and hosting in a way you deem adequate. That's very judgemental and passive aggressive of you, and unkind. Also absolutely none of your business and you should have kept quiet.

Immediate family members often arrive at the funeral service last. They are frequently in the funeral limousines (or some in their own cars) and following the hearse. That means they will then walk in behind the coffin and the service will begin after it is in place and the family are seated. That's how it has been at every funeral I have been to, and how it was at my own Dad's funeral too.

As for hosting at the wake, flexibility is required there. Grieving people might not feel confident hosting and mingling even if they are normally comfortable with that sort of thing. Guests should to some extent be willing to look out for themselves and be considerate.

How odd of you. Both your thoughts and your actions.

At the funeral of one of my grandparents i thought I should do the rounds chatting to those who had come for the post-match tea. At least two of them bent my ear about their own losses and ailments. I missed out on talking to my own cousins before they had to get on the road. I resented my decision as it was the last time all of us cousins were in the same room, over 10 years ago.

Also not everyone gets to take off as much time as they like for a funeral.

Judge not lest ye be judged.

You friend might also be upset that you are judging his child at a difficult time OP. You have no idea how she was feeling or what held her up or why she didn't feel like mingling. I can't believe you would ask someone why they were 5 minutes late at their father's funeral! No wonder she was brusque. Maybe she was talking to the funeral directors or maybe she had to steel herself to go in. Who knows?

Personally I think "shoulds" should go out the window at a funeral. Who cares if the family 'should' get there first or whatever? Can't imagine policing a funeral and wake.

A friend of mine went to a service recently of a friend of theirs (and an acquaintance of mine) who had died unexpectedly and suddenly. There was a private funeral and no wake but a few weeks later a church service was held for them. Apparently their partner appeared as the service started and left immediately afterwards not talking to anyone. We understood why they did this and it was not rudeness or a lack of etiquette

Close family usually arrive last, as they follow the hearse from home. Wider family, friends and colleagues etc arrive first before the hearse.

Any mingling or greeting is either at home before the hearse arrives or at the wake. At the church / chapel / crem there is only time for the odd squeezed hand and hello.

I think you’ve made a faux pas and been really rude here.

I would hate mingling at the best of times, let alone when recently bereaved.

At my father's funeral, it was my bil who went around thanking people for coming. I have no memory of what I did at the wake, except sitting in a chair and being given a cup of tea by dp's cousin. I probably didn't look upset to someone who didn't know me well, I was in shock. If anyone judged me for that 🤷‍♀️