Autistic child attacking DD part 2

[HollandAndCooper]

Original thread here:
https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/am_i_being_unreasonable/5420774-autistic-child-attacking-dd?utm_campaign=thread&utm_medium=app_share

Hi Everyone,

me back again looking for advice, perhaps some last minute advice as I have a meeting scheduled with the head teacher this morning.

DD aged 4 has been very unwell and spent a week off school. She is really going through it at the moment. She returned to school yesterday after her time off, and I'd hoped that the boy in question would've got bored and moved on. I did have a meeting booked last week but couldn't go due to DD being poorly.

well.. it turns out he hasn't got bored and moved on. It's a very small school with 20-25 per class, one class per year from reception to year 2.

the event that happened yesterday, by DDs account.
it was play time and DD was playing with a couple other girls in the play ground. Child in question was calling DD names like 'baby' and 'you need nappies' and announced he was going to the toilet.
he came back out and proceeded to have faeces on his finger to which he wiped on her cardigan.

a staff member took her to the quiet room, swapped her cardigan for one in lost property and the cardigan was handed to me in a bag on pick up. With still an evident stain on it.

i have a meeting this morning.

I have a copy of the safe guarding policy, anti bullying policy. I just need some wise words from MN now with what I need to say but I'm going down the route of failing to keep my child safe, and this is a huge safeguarding issue, not to mention a biohazard issue.
please be kind, I'm a single parent doing my best, and she won't be returning until she is safe.

so far the child has:
kicked, punched, pinched, clouted her on the head with a metal water bottle, name called and taunted. And now this.

she will not be going back to the school until this is sorted and there are proper sanctions in place. I am so angry and utterly heartbroken for her. She has been so poorly last week and in and out of hospital and I cannot see her broken like this anymore.

i appreciate the old thread is 1000 posts but there's more information on there if needed.
My AIBU is I guess to want this child excluded and put as far away from DD as possible. But I know it's not that simple. I'm at a total loss and they are failing to safe guard my child. She will not be returning until she can be safe, I'm also looking at other provisions for her now.
thanks in advance.

In my experience, schools are fucking useless when SEND is involved. I wish I’d moved my son.

I really hope your school is better, OP.

The way some people on both these threads are talking about a 4 year old child with unsupported needs is disgusting.

I hope the meeting went well OP, and well done for looking out for your daughter, it's so wrong what is hapenning to her.

To those saying it's not possible to suspend or exclude a reception child, then it absolutely is, our primary just has. The behaviours this child is showing are targeted, pre mediated and intentionally meant to upset or harm your child. They are very different to a child who becomes massively dysregulated, has a meltdown and whoever is around them may get harmed as a byproduct of the meltdown, which is also really unpleasant for those hurt in the process, but can be more understood as part of their overall needs not being met.

We had a similar experience with a child targeting my daughter, the excuse of SEN was given, but strangely when she was moved into a class with older children who she couldn't intimidate so easily, these behaviours magically stopped - once she knew she couldnt get away with it.

Sorry, but where?
SEN doesn't exempt anyone feeling angry and upset about harm coming to their child.

smearing shit and assaulting children is disgusting. I have no doubt the boys needs are unsupported but that isn't at the forefront of my mind at the moment and quite frankly I don't care, I just want my daughter safe. She is my priority.

I also agree they should pay for a new cardigan too but the only way I can ask for that is by going to the mum directly, I just think it would add fuel to the fire :(

What does this extra training involve? It all sounds vague to me and like nothing is actually going to change except your daughter being allowed to go to the "quiet room." I'd be monitoring very carefully that they don't encourage her into there to keep her away from him - she shouldn't miss out on learning or playtime.

The school are completely and utterly failing the boy. It sounds like the wrong placement for him, entirely.

They’re failing to safeguard your daughter and other children too.

Forget it. Focus on your daughter.
I would move her OP. Their plans are wishy washy. Getting a Yr 6 child involved? Access to a quiet room? No, they need to take this child in hand and stop him from targeting your daughter. So he has special needs? One day he will have to have a job, and he can't go around smearing shit on his colleagues' clothes. He can't go around hitting and pinching members of the public or he will be arrested. If he is fit for mainstream, he needs to be able to conduct himself in a way that means all the other children and staff are safe.

What is the “buddy” expected to do? I’m not sure I’d be happy with that as a solution.

To be honest it wasn't really elaborated on. The head didn't actually confirm the child had any SEN so I don't know if the training is specially surrounding SEN.

it is vague isn't it.

I think I'm just going to move her. I agreed to send her back once the training is in place but since coming away I just don't want her there. I don't want to make any irrational decisions based on anger or upset. From what it sounds like it would be quite an easy transition to the sister school which is a full primary. I'm now thinking that's the best thing to do here.

Thanks for the update OP, I hope things improve.

And to those who are saying it's terrible to talk about excluding a young child - sometimes it's the best option for them

Our school excluded a child after trying many many options to support - during which 3 staff required hospital attendances for stitches, concussion and a fracture. The parent and school acknowledged the placement was unsuitable but SEN wouldn't offer other options. Excluding effectively forced their hand and they found this child a specialist placement where they are now thriving. The head got a call from their parent the other day thanking for 'giving the push necessary to get what he needed'.

The push for inclusion at all costs is often harmful to both children with SEN and those without, and to schools and their staff. Schools so often say they cannot meet need but are forced to take a child anyway.

You shouldn't have to but it's probably the only way to save your daughter from further trauma. Do you know anyone from the other school so you can check if there are violent children in her year group there?

Not to mention I would not be happy if I was the parent of the Year 6 'buddy' having to be responsible for a child like that.

Research other schools close by, ready to use if necessary.

Your daughter should never have to accommodate the abuser.
The boy has to be fully monitored and stopped as soon as any abusive behaviour is likely to happen.
His parents could supervise him, or pay for a minder, until he is civilised and trustworthy.
It is him who needs to be withdrawn, suspended.
He can't be allowed to hamper others' educations.

Involve the Police. Report any abuse even if you shift schools.

The school should be approaching the mum and asking her to pay the damages- surely she's being told about each attack?

I'm rather shocked she hasn't offered to pay- quite disgusting behaviour from her to have to not have addressed the matger herself. If your child destroys property by smearing poo on it then she should be paying for it.

The 'buddy' can accompany her during some play times. There are a few Y6 students that come down and help 'buddy' the children as a whole during forest school and lunch times, but they said they'd get a buddy specifically for DD. Perhaps the boy would think twice about attacking her with a much bigger child present.

but saying that, if my DD was being used as a buddy for a deterrent for a bully I wouldn't be happy.

I just don't know what to do. I'm so deflated. I'm a single mum and I wish I had another person here with me to talk this through with but such is life.

im going to start making plans to move her. I need to put her safety first.

Absolutely agree with you, the school are failing to support OP's 4 year olds need and right to feel safe at school, which is terrible

Well done for being such an amazing Mum to your little girl.

Even if you don't intend it, I'd be threatening legal action if it happens again, and letting the school know that I'll be making sure other parents know to keep their children well away from this child for their safety. Over to them now!

Hi all,
We've made a couple of deletions on this thread and we would ask that everyone be conscious of their language and the fact that, when all is said and done, we are talking about a child. We would be grateful and it would result in fewer deletions.

OP, you are doing amazing. You are so strong, honestly. It’s sometimes harder with another person. I wanted to move my son but my husband is completely against it.

I would say though, it’s better to move her now before strong friendships form. Part of the reluctance to move my son is because he has the loveliest group of friends and my husband doesn’t think it’s fair.

Omg, your poor DD. 💔
It really brings back memories, I was bullied at school by a boy who was later (much later) sent to a specialist school. He punched me in the face several times, caused nosebleeds, spat on me, kicked me… he just enjoyed tormenting me. I cried so many times. My parents went to the school, but all I got was “she needs to learn to stand up for herself.” 🤦‍♀️
It’s been 35 years, but I remember every detail. They eventually moved me to another school, and while it helped, it left a deep mark, that feeling of being completely defenceless.
It’s horrible, and honestly, I feel that even now, if my DC were bullied, I’d have little power other than to move them and hope for the best in the new place.
Huge hug, OP. I really hope you can protect your little girl. If it comes to it — please, please move her. No school is worth your child’s sense of safety or self-worth. ❤️

I would sit on it for today, let things sink in before planning next move. Whilst technically you aren't privy to his needs, every instance makes it everyone elses business whether the school or his parents like it or not. They want confidentiality, they need to make sure he doesn't impact any other child.