Is this rude from a child? Age 6, furious reaction from teacher

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My DS was at school today and his teacher addressed the class saying “I don’t want to hear from you unless you need the toilet, you’re in pain or injured.” My DS raised his hand and said “I’m pain and injured is kind of the same thing.” Another teacher overheard and shouted at him so much he was crying and still crying about it at bedtime.

obviously I only have his account of the incident so this is all the detail I have. He didn’t think he had said anything wrong. I’ve noticed this year he’s complained of strict scary teachers and he’s becoming anxious about going to school. Would appreciate opinions on whether this apparently very big telling off was justified. He said his friends were comforting afterwards and he was crying and apologising whilst the teacher continued to shout.

Lots of children don't enjoy school. It's normal.

Just one more thought...

It would be lovely if school had no constraints, either for children or teachers. If only children could chat happily to their heart's content to their teachers and friends. If only teachers had all the time in the world to attend to everything their pupils wanted to say. Sigh.

It would be lovely! But please people, let's be realistic. Dealing with 30 children, some of whom will have additional needs and may be at very different stages of development/maturity whilst having to keep them safe and on task - because the National Curriculum is quite demanding - is challenging. It means that teachers cannot be all things to all their pupils. They have to do the best they can every day for all their students, and this involves making split-second decisions all the time. Occasionally a teacher might get it wrong, not because they're not professionals, but because they're not superhuman magicians. Being a teacher is not like being a parent AT ALL.

I hope OP can look at the bigger picture. It's healthy to teach your child to understand that they are one of a large group and the teacher has to be fair to everyone. This means they won't get the same level of attention as they expect with mum and dad at home. Going to school is about starting to negotiate the real world where you have to accommodate other people and this is hard for small children, but with parental support, they'll get there.

Of course we don't know what happened and if the little boy's punishment was totally out of proportion to his cheeky question then a word with the teacher might be justified. But if he simply got told off for not doing what he had been asked to do, I think OP should just use the incident to reinforce expectations at school and assure him that it was nothing personal.

And move on!

This is true.

And while I think it was rather odd that it was a different teacher who popped in and "shouted", this also makes me suspect one of two things op.

Either it was so obvious to the other passing teacher that things were escalating out of hand that she felt she needed to step in, OR your DS is already known as a bit of a cheeky chappy and the other teacher thought "OK that's once too often."

If it were really just an innocent comment and came across that way, I really don't think a teacher who was not in charge of the class would deign to interfere - I mean what would the actual teacher think if she flew into her class and interjected out of nowhere. So there's been something in the mix that justified or triggered that unusual response, and she has clearly felt the teacher in the class was not going to object.

Don't you call me a liar. I do not make shit up on the internet for fun.

The parent who witnessed it and went to get the head was actually a friend of mine (her ds and my dd were in the same class) and she told me about it.
The supply teacher had already been in place for about a week.

Yes I do have dc, who have managed to reach adulthood. And I don't tolerate smart-arsed backchat from anybody, let alone children.

Can’t believe we’ve had 34 pages discussing an incident which even the parent involved admits she doesn’t know the truth of. Fgs go and see the teacher if your child was that traumatised and find out what actually occurred. I’d be surprised if a year 1/2 teacher had ranted frankly, it’s not how most primary teachers operate these days. I really think we’ll have no experienced teachers soon, what with Senior Management and parents on their backs continually.

The teacher did not ask them to be quiet. They addressed the children in a manner more suitable for older and teenage children. ""I don't want to hear from you unless ....etc" is not plain or simple for a class of 6 year olds. Also, it's no use shouting and embarrassing a child in front of the class, that gets you nowhere. That is not bring strict, it's being harsh. Frightened infant school children do not learn. It's nothing to do with gentle parenting, it's common sense.

Sure.

There should be no circumstances of extended shouting at children in that age group and if it's frequent it will be first dealt with techniques to help the teacher regulate, and if that doesn't work it might lead to disciplinary action. Teachers are taught to use constructive communication and to de-escalate such situations, especially on their own side, since they are the adults in the room. If this really happened it doesn't matter if your child was cheeky, the teacher was in the wrong and surely knows it. If it happened in another teacher's classroom I'd be very surprised if that teacher did not bring it up with them afterwards. It's just not on. Put his teacher on the spot to explain what happened. Don't tell them your kid's version first. Get their version and if it doesn't match say that is not how your child saw it and give them the version you heard. Teachers can be bullies, just as kids can. Dig in to this and find out as much as you can, then keep an eye on things.

I’ve thought about this some more since my last reply. I’d be so upset and would 100% be requesting a meeting with the teacher and the head. The fact that two teachers were involved and your son talks of lots of having to sit quietly woud make me worry there was a negative, bullying culture in the school. The teachers remark was not appropriate for use with young kids. It might be ok if said with a jokey tone with post primary kids but not 6 year olds. The second teacher wading in intimidating and shouting at a little child even as he was crying and trying to apologise really is contemptible and I’d be wanting their guts for garters. I’m not a soft character at all but it makes me sad to think of the little fellow. It must been quite scary and shocking if the little classmates were trying to comfort him. In my opinion your child done absolutely nothing wrong. Normally we encourage children to be inquisitive and ask questions and engage with teachers. He was just making an observation that would have we

Could be a lot going on here.

1. Rambunctious group and teacher needs to maintain control.
2. Son is quick witted but sometimes uses at the wrong time. Think Robin Williams.
3. Teacher is sleep deprived and short tempered.

You need a good balance here. Teacher needs to be in charge of the class, however, you don’t want to break your child’s spirit. Walk this one carefully. You have to support the teacher and your child at the same time. Good luck!

The child was rude. He knew he was rude. Got pulled up on it and now faking his sadness. If you’ve ever worked with groups of children, you will know this to be true.

It's a mighty dim year 2 who can't understand that!

I remember a Y! class I had once. It contained 3 bright but cheeky little boys. I liked them but I had to keep the lid on a bit. They were very much capable of wasting time with 'clever-clever' come-backs and banter.

That's all very well from their point of view (and parents find it hard to understand why teacher's can't allow this to run unchecked) but it wasted precious time which maybe other less able children truly needed and distracted the class when they'd been settled nicely into a task.

Very hard to explain to non-teachers. It always make the teacher sound like a kill-joy automaton. But you have to consider the needs of all the children, not just some the most confident and articulate.

Playtime is the place for these funny conversations with the children - happy to banter back and forth with a 5/6/7 year old in the playground!!

It depends how he was pulled up on it, doesn’t it?

We don’t really know.

If he was yelled or shouted at, then that is unacceptable. Right? Teachers shouldn’t be yelling especially at little kids. Deeply unprofessional. Or perhaps it’s cool with you.

But it’s such a seriously non crime for a little kid anyway. Just a brisk, “Yes dear,” would have sufficed.

Did you shout at them?

That's a funny question! Why do you think I shouted?

Aaarrggh awful typos in that post. Teachers, not teacher's etc etc.

Apologies.

I think that’s very smart for a 6 year old! As the teacher, I’d have had a little snigger.

Each incident had to be judged individually in the moment, but I'd do one of the following:

• give them a stern look
• say 'Yes, but I've asked you to be quiet and do x, Freddie'.
• say 'Let's talk about that later'.
• say 'We're not talking about x just now'.
• or similar!

I didn’t think anything.

I asked if you did.

Yep!

And also this!

Although on MN people tend to the view that parents choose private schools for snobbish reasons, in my experience it’s hardly ever that.

It’s CLASS SIZE, stupid!

In a class of less than 20 the experience of both students and teachers is utterly transformed. As a teacher you have more time for everyone and children don’t have to wait so long for the teacher’s attention. This is a massive issue, I think. A few minutes is an age to small children and they can get completely turned off by having to wait so long to be heard or to have their questions answered. My personal view is that it would be money well spent-spent to have mush smaller classes in KS1. It would set children up so much better for later years and enable them to cope with a class of 30 once they can read and write fairly confidently.

Very hard to explain to non-teachers.

It's not in the least bit hard to explain to non-teachers. Anyone with a modicum of common sense would understand the difference between a classroom full of children and a 1-1 with little Johnny.