Exactly the qualities the NHS is looking for in its employees, right?
JHound ·
29/09/2025 20:53
So poor moral code and laziness.
Quoting MissScarletInTheBallroom
Uggbootsforever ·
29/09/2025 20:27
Quoting Bumblebee72
MissScarletInTheBallroom ·
29/09/2025 20:26
If an unemployed British person has the necessary skills and qualities to be a nurse, why are they not already a nurse?
Quoting Digdongdoo
Bumblebee72 ·
29/09/2025 20:23
So Brits are too thick to be nurses? and reform voters are the racists?
Quoting Marshmallow4545
Digdongdoo ·
29/09/2025 17:15
Times have changed though haven't they? Nurses didn't used to need degrees. Different ball game these days. Not so easy to just train more of them, or to fund the salaries they would demand. If it was that easy, wouldn't upskilling Brits be Nige's big plan, his headliner?
Quoting MissScarletInTheBallroom
Marshmallow4545 ·
29/09/2025 17:12
This is exactly how things have worked historically in previous generations. Labour would ebb and flow into different industries and areas to reflect demand and shortages. I think you are naive to think this is no longer possible because we can now tap into cheap labour from abroad instead.
Quoting Marshmallow4545
MissScarletInTheBallroom ·
29/09/2025 17:08
I think you are staggeringly naive.
Quoting MissScarletInTheBallroom
Marshmallow4545 ·
29/09/2025 17:07
I think that we can definitely pay to train some NEETs to become nurses before we import nurses from other countries and start to brain drain less developed countries.
We should look to cover our skill shortages with British people first. This is just sensible! We have millions of competent people that are more than capable of being a nurse if they were trained properly. They will have the obvious advantages of being able to speak the language effortlessly and will understand cultural norms without having to learn them.
Quoting Marshmallow4545
MissScarletInTheBallroom ·
29/09/2025 15:54
Well would you agree that a foreign nurse is more qualified for a nursing job than a British layabout with no qualifications?
Quoting Unrulyscrumptious
Marshmallow4545 ·
29/09/2025 15:52
I am a working mother, of course I know mother's pay for wraparound care. This is rarely as prohibitively as expensive as FT childcare can be during the preschool/nursery years. I have friends that work in care roles and have kids at school. They pay for the very affordable after-school clubs and breakfast clubs and crack on.
I never said everyone that economically inactive is sat on their arse doing nothing. The reality is that many of them could be a hell of a lot more economically productive than they are now. Even some of those with disabilities or with caring responsibilities. It will require training, flexibility and investment but this will be cheaper in the long term than paying for their benefits, importing in Labour and then paying for these migrants benefits, pensions etc too.
Why do you think migrants are automatically more qualified or better suited to caring roles than British people? Don't you see how many completely unsuitable people will apply for these roles seeing it as an easy way to access Britain? You are naive if you don't realise this. Caring is a difficult job with crap pay. This is true for migrants as well as UK citizens. The idea that there are loads of passionate, conscientious carers living abroad just desperate to wipe the arses of old UK citizens is just ridiculous.
Quoting Marshmallow4545
Unrulyscrumptious ·
29/09/2025 15:35
I'm not writing them off because I'm not sitting here being naive that everyone out of work is sitting on their arse. Many are already engaged in caring for the children or family members, they do not have the time to work. Others have disabilities that prevent them from being able to do a lot of jobs. Others can afford not to work so good luck forcing them to do work they don't need to do. Are there a minority of able bodied people with no responsibilities sitting on their arse? Probably, but they aren't actually entitled to many benefits if that's the case. Who's going to pay for them to be trained and upskilled? I'm sure you're also aware that care wages are so low that many working in the care industries and the NHS have to claim benefits on top of their wages. I'm all for people being encouraged towards employment but into positions caring for vulnerable people? No
Lots of mothers work and raise children. The childcare argument is normally only relevant for the first 5 years of a child's life, even less if you're eligible for free hours
My mind is boggling at you typing this. You know working mothers pay for childcare right...? What exactly do you think a 5 year old does when school is finished at 3.30 and their parents are at work? They go into childcare, silly. Otherwise a parent needs a flexible school hours job, of which care work doesn't provide much of!
Quoting Unrulyscrumptious
Marshmallow4545 ·
29/09/2025 15:19
This is such a strange post.
Lots of mothers work and raise children. The childcare argument is normally only relevant for the first 5 years of a child's life, even less if you're eligible for free hours.
Why are you so desperate to write millions of people off? People can retrain and upskill, especially in sectors like care. We can look at making work more flexible and accessible. We don't need to jump to the assumption that millions upon millions of British people are completely incapable of working and we need to import labour from elsewhere.
Quoting Marshmallow4545
Unrulyscrumptious ·
29/09/2025 15:04
And if they're not? You have a really naive worldview if you think that the gaps in industries are going to be filled by everyone that's economically inactive. @MissScarletInTheBallroom made a relevant point that many women stay at home to look after their children, partly driven by the costs of childcare. Most of these women aren't claiming benefits or if they are it's to keep their NI contributions up, they're not going to suddenly go back to full time work just because they can't claim child benefit anymore. Most of the jobs we need filling aren't ones that can work around school hours so your school aged children point doesn't make any sense. Even if they were forced back into work by your genius plan, people can't do jobs they aren't qualified or trained for. Unless you have some stats about the % of our of work people that have their care certificate sitting idle, you have no point.
Quoting MissScarletInTheBallroom
Marshmallow4545 ·
29/09/2025 14:54
This is a small minority in the statistics. If the SAHMs are mums of school aged children then yes, ideally they should work. Why not? This is especially true if they are relying on state support to stay at home
Quoting Marshmallow4545
MissScarletInTheBallroom ·
29/09/2025 14:39
A lot of those economically inactive people are stay at home mums. Would you force them back into work?
Quoting MissScarletInTheBallroom
Marshmallow4545 ·
29/09/2025 14:36
No I don't think it's a particularly large number. It isn't 'very small' though. I do also think when you look at the number and in particular the number of young people that are NEET then we clearly should focus efforts on employing British citizens before assuming that we must rely on immigration. There are also a lot of economically inactive people that could be brought into the workforce that would dramatically increase the workforce available and provide additional economic benefit.
Quoting Marshmallow4545
MissScarletInTheBallroom ·
29/09/2025 14:32
OK, so you think it's a large number.
A large number compared to what?
What do you think would be a small number?
Quoting MissScarletInTheBallroom
Marshmallow4545 ·
29/09/2025 14:30
It's almost 5% of the working population. It absolutely isn't a small number.
We do need to try and keep a grip on reality when having these debates.
Quoting Marshmallow4545
MissScarletInTheBallroom ·
29/09/2025 14:28
For a country the size of the UK, it is.
Quoting MissScarletInTheBallroom
Marshmallow4545 ·
29/09/2025 14:27
Since when was 1.5 million people a 'very small' number of unemployed people?
Quoting Bumblebee72
MissScarletInTheBallroom ·
29/09/2025 14:19
No I mean good luck with forcing the very small number of unemployed people in the UK to do jobs they don't want to do and are not qualified to do.
Quoting MissScarletInTheBallroom
Bumblebee72 ·
29/09/2025 14:19
Restricting immigration drives supply of jobs, restricting benefits drives demand for jobs. This enables the states bill to reduce and stops the country going bankrupt. Seems smarter to me than continually bringing low cost labour in from aboard and keeping people at home on state benefits.
Quoting Bumblebee72
MissScarletInTheBallroom ·
29/09/2025 14:14
Lol, good luck with that.
Quoting MissScarletInTheBallroom
Bumblebee72 ·
29/09/2025 14:14
With the people who do not currently work. It is not that difficult. We do not need to import labour in order for Brits to sit at home.
Quoting JaneEyre40
MissScarletInTheBallroom ·
29/09/2025 13:54
I've no idea who they think is going to fill the ever increasing number of vacancies in care homes.
Quoting Bumblebee72
JaneEyre40 ·
29/09/2025 13:52
Idiotic. So goodbye teachers and nurses yeah?
Quoting PandoraSocks
Bumblebee72 ·
29/09/2025 13:50
£60k seems a sensible threshold.
Quoting Bumblebee72
PandoraSocks ·
29/09/2025 13:47
So it is piss taking if a person is a lower earner (the threshold to qualify for a visa will be £60k according to the Times) and has been working here for decades?
Edited
Quoting PandoraSocks
Bumblebee72 ·
29/09/2025 13:44
Nope. If they are contributing they will be able to stay, if not they can go back home. You know when you're a piss taker. and can plan accordingly.
Quoting Bumblebee72
PandoraSocks ·
29/09/2025 13:41
What about all the people who will have their ILR rescinded? Don't you think they should be worried?
Quoting MissScarletInTheBallroom
Bumblebee72 ·
29/09/2025 13:35
It is already certain with this government, and a possibility with Farage. I'd take the chance on some possibility of a better outcome. The only people who really need to worry about a Farage government are those who are taking the piss and will have their benefits cut if they don't accept a job offer.
Quoting Bumblebee72
MissScarletInTheBallroom ·
29/09/2025 13:25
It's always possible to be even more fucked.
If you want to guarantee it, vote for Farage.
Quoting MissScarletInTheBallroom
Bumblebee72 ·
29/09/2025 13:23
Well we might as well try. We're fucked under this government.
Edited
Quoting EasternStandard
MissScarletInTheBallroom ·
29/09/2025 13:21
Quoting MissScarletInTheBallroom
EasternStandard ·
29/09/2025 13:20
Ok great I hope it helps you somehow. If what you’re saying happens they are more likely to get in.
Quoting EasternStandard
MissScarletInTheBallroom ·
29/09/2025 13:15
People who think it's clever to vote for more Farage are dimwits. They deserve to be insulted.
Quoting MissScarletInTheBallroom
EasternStandard ·
29/09/2025 13:09
Whatever. If it makes you feel better to post insults. Don’t you have your own issues in France?
Quoting EasternStandard
MissScarletInTheBallroom ·
29/09/2025 13:07
Yes, OK. Whose votes? Dimwits who think Farage'll fix it?
Like I said, FAFO.
Quoting MissScarletInTheBallroom
EasternStandard ·
29/09/2025 13:03
You keep responding to things I haven’t posted. If Macron is out and we get a flood of what you call ‘undesirables’ it will be Starmer who is still in.
If that happens it will impact votes for our GE.
Quoting EasternStandard
MissScarletInTheBallroom ·
29/09/2025 12:59
What on earth makes you think Reform will be able to deliver where Labour can't?
Farage famously can't even be arsed to go to meetings.
Quoting MissScarletInTheBallroom
EasternStandard ·
29/09/2025 12:18
Macron is out first. If what you’re saying re ‘undesirables’ will happen then it’s Labour still in not delivering mode.
Quoting EasternStandard
MissScarletInTheBallroom ·
29/09/2025 12:14
What could be the solution to Farage not delivering? Oh yes, more Farage.
FAFO.
Quoting MissScarletInTheBallroom
EasternStandard ·
29/09/2025 12:11
Ok I haven’t seen that, their policy was pretty tough on R4 recently. We’ll see what the French decide.
And if they do ‘dump all their undesirables’ as you put it that will only drive up voter reaction here.
Edited
Quoting EasternStandard
MissScarletInTheBallroom ·
29/09/2025 12:09
Oh, trust me, the French far right would be absolutely delighted if they can dump all their undesirables in the UK.
Quoting MissScarletInTheBallroom
EasternStandard ·
29/09/2025 12:08
We’ll see. Depends who the French elect. It could be to the right and their policies are tough on the channel.
Quoting EasternStandard
MissScarletInTheBallroom ·
29/09/2025 12:07
For EU member states, border control is an EU wide issue. The UK is now on its own.
Quoting MissScarletInTheBallroom
EasternStandard ·
29/09/2025 12:06
No one is doing anyone favours. If Germany or anywhere else gets a gov that has a mandate to have strict border control they will do the same.
Plus wait to see the policies, to the right here and there could change things anyway.
Edited
Quoting EasternStandard
MissScarletInTheBallroom ·
29/09/2025 12:03
Brexit means they owe us fuck all and have no incentive to do us any favours.
Quoting MissScarletInTheBallroom
EasternStandard ·
29/09/2025 11:59
You keep diverging. Yes a new French President will have policies that their electorate want. It won’t be Macron. It could change things a lot. It’s nothing to do with Brexit still. Each new PM in the EU impacts others as it means borders are more hardline or not.
Quoting EasternStandard
MissScarletInTheBallroom ·
29/09/2025 11:53
Yes, OK, which means that France is full of migrants whom right wing parties in particular are desperate to get rid of.
Do you honestly think that Le Pen would say, "Oh, we have to keep them here and stop them from travelling to the UK because of the Le Touquet agreement?"
She'd probably charter a ferry and pay for it herself.
Quoting MissScarletInTheBallroom
EasternStandard ·
29/09/2025 11:51
Ditto for your posts. EU countries are all
facing the same pressures, none have left the EU. It is down to border control which each imposes as much as they can.
Quoting EasternStandard
MissScarletInTheBallroom ·
29/09/2025 11:49
Not sure what you mean by that tbh.
Quoting MissScarletInTheBallroom
EasternStandard ·
29/09/2025 11:48
What are you talking about? Your initial point on Brexit doesn’t stand even with Macron out soon.
Quoting EasternStandard
MissScarletInTheBallroom ·
29/09/2025 11:47
Did you miss the part about Macron's days being numbered?
Brexit means that no one will really care if France stops cooperating with the UK over this.
Edited
Quoting MissScarletInTheBallroom
EasternStandard ·
29/09/2025 11:46
Is that you realising yes the French do do a lot now. Switch to this.
And of course it could change, it probably will a fair bit, still nothing to do with Brexit or not.
Quoting EasternStandard
MissScarletInTheBallroom ·
29/09/2025 11:41
Macron has 18 months left as President. Do you really think any of the candidates who might replace him are going to be interested in stopping migrants they don't want in France from travelling to the UK?
Quoting MissScarletInTheBallroom
EasternStandard ·
29/09/2025 11:37
Obviously that’s not true. Drones, surveillance, police in riot gear. The French did a few photo ops with tear gas and knifing boats but there’s no way this kind of force should fall to them.
Any EU country that has lowered numbers has used barriers at their borders. Nothing to do with the EU or Brexit, more outside that.
Quoting EasternStandard
MissScarletInTheBallroom ·
29/09/2025 11:32
The difference is that we can now no longer count on any cooperation from France at all to stop people crossing the channel in small boats.
Quoting MissScarletInTheBallroom
EasternStandard ·
29/09/2025 11:24
Are you sure? Why are other countries still in the EU facing the same pressures? Which of those countries have lowered the numbers, take a look at borders
Quoting BundleBoogie
MissScarletInTheBallroom ·
29/09/2025 11:21
Well now we have even less ability to control it than we did before, thanks to Brexit.
Slow hand clap for Farage.
Quoting MissScarletInTheBallroom
BundleBoogie ·
29/09/2025 11:20
Europe was being used as a route into this country by people from those Islamic countries. But as we were part of the whole, we couldn’t control our borders at all.
Now we at least have the possibility of control if our government took it.
Quoting Uggbootsforever
MissScarletInTheBallroom ·
29/09/2025 10:53
Goodness me, so why did Nigel Farage spend more than 20 years campaigning for the UK to leave the predominantly white, Judeo-Christian EU then?
Why was that a priority if the real threat to our way of life is people from Islamic countries?
Quoting MissScarletInTheBallroom
Uggbootsforever ·
29/09/2025 10:48
Because the alternative to Reform is such high levels of immigration from predominantly Islamic countries than an eventual change is Islam could well be in the future of the UK?
Quoting Uggbootsforever
MissScarletInTheBallroom ·
29/09/2025 10:46
Why is that your comparator?
Quoting ChocolateMagnum
Uggbootsforever ·
29/09/2025 10:46
More or less fascist than the Islamic countries in your view?
ChocolateMagnum ·
29/09/2025 10:45
So those of you voting Reform because Labour and the Conservatives are crap; and you're worried about immigration are happy with the risk that a Reform government is highly likely to lead to a fascist state?
Edited