I have gone NC with PIL and feel great. DP is sad.

[amispeakingintongues]

NC with them for last 7 months, and have felt huge relief. I don’t let them in my house anymore, at least while I am here. Kids are welcome to see them whenever but I don’t trust PIL to look after them unattended because;

FIL shouted at me/ us in his house over the fact I gently reminded my own children (ages 1 and 3) to be careful of the boiling hot cup of tea stupidly placed by MIL on a side table right behind them. He heard me say this, then spat out “No what (dc) needs to do is go next door to get his snack)”. I was taken aback by this blatant undermining but ignored it as he’d already been rude to me over something else and I didn’t want to give him the satisfaction of a response. 30 secs later, my partner walked in, saw the hot tea. Without a thought, he moved it immediately and the unhinged outburst from FIL went something like “NO DON’T MOVE MY TEA. YOU DON’T CHANGE EVERYTHING YOU DO WHEN YOU HAVE KIDS THEY MUST BE TAUGHT TO AVOID THINGS” (again, kids are 1 and 3) to which I managed to reply, whilst stunned “They are my children and they are so little, if I see something dangerous I will protect them” - and he replied “DON’T TELL ME HOW TO RAISE CHILDREN WHEN I’VE HAD X5/6/7” (he’s estranged from half his kids all with different mothers so)
… afterwards I just found the car keys and politely asked MIL (who heard all of this and didn’t say a thing) to let me out the house. I sat in the car and burst into flames (and tears). Never seen them since.

Some context: They felt (their own words) that I wasn’t good enough for their DS when we met over 10 years ago. Since then their opinion according to my DP has changed, and they apparently think i’m a good mum to their grandkids etc but never once have they said anything positive about me to my face about my character or anything that made me feel genuinely liked and respected, rather than tolerated. Even though I have bent over backwards in my people pleasing ways cooking, hosting, long heart to hearts with MIL, taking her out on lunches, taking the kids to see them etc, there has always been an undercurrent of disdain towards me. Which has worn me down in more ways than i can explain in one post.

Anyway. My DP is getting pressure from them to nip this all in the bud whilst maintaining they absolutely will not apologise to me. And that somehow, I am in the wrong. DP disagrees with them but that doesn’t change much because they are withholding attention/love/affection which is upsetting him. This master manipulation is no surprise but my DP is not well attuned for seeing this for what it is. DP wants me to put it all behind me for his sake, just so they can come to the house. I don’t want to not uphold my new found boundary but also don’t want DP feeling upset. I know i’m not being petty, just feeling like I don’t know what’s best in the long run.

Not me, I am the DIL.

I just know that there is always another side to the story and would caution against encouraging anyone to go no contact with her in laws without knowing the other side.

I think what is really making me suspicious here is the thread title. "I feel great but my husband feels sad."

OK but it's not all about you. I'm pretty sure my SIL also feels great about destroying my PIL's family and her son's relationship with his parents.

They are not just her kids, they are their father's kids too and he has equal say. Even if they were divorced he could take them to see his parents.

I would probably allow the PILs in my house as long as they behaved, rather than let them go without me to PIL's house, if they can't be trusted to keep them safe from things like hot tea (or worse).

As part of a family you need to consider others' points of view. Your DPs, your children's when they're old enough to have one. Maybe MIL's.

Of course your 4 year old won't talk eagerly about grandad, because he's worked out you don't like him. He'll want to please you.

At the moment you still expect your children to have a relationship with them as your DP is taking them to visit. So your stance "protects" no one but yourself. To me, that's not appropriate where a partner and children are involved. After the experience you had, you know that you need to be proactive in both ensuring your children are safe around the PIL AND managing situations to avoid conflict. (See earlier advice to move the child, not the hot drink).

If you automatically always disbelieve the OP's version of events, what is the point of even being on Mumsnet? We only ever have one side of the story.

OP's language and description of events sound credible to me and I think her FIL sounds like an overbearing arsehole who deliberately put OP's small children at risk of serious harm by refusing to move a hot drink so his grandchildren couldn't burn themselves and then shouting at his own son who did move the drink. A one year old can't be trusted to avoid a hot drink within their reach yet OP's FIL was willing to risk his grandchild being burned as long as his authority was recognised and his instructions followed.

DP wants me to put it all behind me for his sake

What about you? What about your wellbeing? Respect? Basic safety of your children?

For your sake (and your children) I suggest he grows a pair.

Yeah I hope he grows a pair and tells the OP that he and his children are entitled to have a relationship with his parents.

The OP sounds reasonable to me. What I fail to understand about the PIL generation is that they often seem so hellbent on NEVER apologising. The op’s father in law shouted and upset her. If I was him, I’d apologise and do my best to smooth things over, even if I privately thought she was being ridiculous (which she wasn’t).

If my own in-laws had come to me and said sorry for their shocking behaviour and accusations, then I would have accepted that and done my best to move on. As it was, they refused to do that. So I stepped back and left my DH to navigate his own relationship with them. Unsurprisingly, they treated him pretty badly in the years that followed…they now have a cordial, but far from close relationship, and their grandchildren barely know them. That is on them. It’s so stupid of them and I feel sorry for them tbh.

Op has repeatedly said that the children still see them. Said dh took them over "today".

Not wise imo considering their complete lack of regard for basic safety. But that's her call.

It's actually his call.

You have the option to tell them they must acknowledge their actions, apologise and be clear that there will be no repeat of similar. If they choose not to then you have to stick to your guns. You have no choice.

They sound foul and aggressive. The long running background is a red flag they may try to negatively influence DC @amispeakingintongues

Can you just go as low contact as possible?
Please be cautious about not being present when DC are with them - you don’t want emotional abuse and manipulation.
If possible get DH to set boundaries, so PIL don’t lash out at you or try to drive a wedge.

My PIL became terrible when we had DC. There is a very difficult SIL who never left home and does not cope with change. It was dangerous and later manipulative. I have also been shouted at by them, but honestly that is minor compared to putting DC at risk and the emotional manipulation.

Our relationship with other relatives is really good. The SIL also has problems with the other nieces and nephews, so it really isn’t just us. I have made a huge effort in the past. It meant nothing as there was manipulation, undermining and aggression once DC entered the mix. SIL is very creepy around DH and almost tries to act like a spouse in messaging and when together. Edited to add: unreciprocated!

Would happily never see them again and DC does not enjoy visits. DH is a massive problem and tries to pretend everything is fine and normal. Gets aggressive and blames us when we say there is an issue.

• So I go or am here when they are here to protect DC.
• They wear me down so I make myself scarce before visits. DH has to sort the house (not a big deal, but I don’t want a late night then have to face the stress on less sleep).
• DC should not be exposed to this. But if I leave and there is shared custody DC would have no protection. I have told DH that is DC are alone again with SIL I will file for divorce and full custody.
• I have been honest in an age appropriate way with DC, as I don’t want them to feel as if something they have done justifies bizarre ‚rules’, explosions and the general atmosphere. For context, it isn’t just my view, there are diagnosed MH issues but PIL have shielded SIL. So no treatment and anything she comes up with is completely backed, as I guess there is fear of the ensuing explosions.
• I understand it must be difficult for them, including SIL. But the lies and aggression are where any chance of a normal relationship broke.

Or she could...

I expect part of the reason DH is ‘sad’ is because the onus is now on him to maintain the relationship with his parents. From what OP said, I suspect the ‘wifework’ of arranging visits etc previously fell to her.

Have the PIL visited your house whilst you were out? It’s not clear from the posts. Also, how far away do they live & how frequently did you see them before?

If the children's safety is at stake I'd say that was a far more serious matter and something that does need to be the mother's call, if the father is intent on disregarding it. The compromise solution might be to see them in a neutral place where they don't hold all the power, rather than in their own home. This isn't a case of 'what I say, goes' or a power wrestle as to who and who doesn't have jurisdiction over what the kids do - it's a case of both parents working together to achieve a compromise solution that's in their children's best interests (rather than their own).

In most circumstances a relationship with their grandparents is in children's best interests. Putting their personal safety at risk is not. So there needs to be a solution which takes both factors into account.

There is no love lost between me and my in-laws. I've stepped back and DH facilities that relationship entirely. But I have no need to worry that he would ever override DC's safety on the whim of his family or otherwise. Nor, to be fair, do I have any concerns about DC's safety whilst with them.

OP's situation is entirely different.

Whatever.

I just hope he's watching them like a hawk.

Because the approach "they learn from their mistakes" doesn't work well when it comes to 1 year olds and boiling drinks.

I'm not saying that cups of tea near children aren't dangerous. But there are better ways of dealing with this than people shouting at each other and demanding apologies. If you ask your FIL to move his cup of tea and he gets huffy, you just move your kids until he's finished his tea. It's not like the in laws have been doing childcare and the OP has just discovered that they take them out in the car without car seats. Cups of tea are a danger that parents can protect their children against by keeping them out of the way.

I feel like if there were actually big reasons why the OP is right to go NC with her in laws, she'd have led with those reasons.

But this thread is giving me the same vibes as my SIL. If she posted on here she'd no doubt get all kinds of encouragement and irresponsible advice to cut my PIL off. But in reality she is very much the bad guy and has continually started conflicts over incredibly minor issues and destroyed her husband and children's relationship with my PIL through a thousand tiny cuts.

I would carry on as you are O.P. you said how much happier you have felt. If they apologise you can re think but otherwise leave your husband to it. If they are cruel to your kids again I would re think the kids having contact or else limited. I think too many people get away with being unkind in life because they are family and we should make the effort. As I get older and wiser I think you reap what you sow in life. Your in laws are reaping what they sow quite frankly. The ball is in their court to apologise x

They’re really not 😂

Are you alright?

Why are you so invested?

I didn't

I told my DH just how fucked up his family were and he was grateful for the support in extricating himself. Something he hadn't quite managed to do fully, something his mother and brother used against him in quite a cruel, constantly demeaning fashion

Sometimes batshit crazy family relationships just need to be walked away from

Why do they NEED to come to your house? Like, ffs, they can all go to a cafe or soft play or whatever. This weird attachment they’ve got with your home (aka a power play) further entrenches that they don’t care about your boundaries and just want to do whatever they like.

FWIW, OP, I think it’s absolutely fine for you not to let them in your house. Billions of other buildings on this planet. It’s your house too. Once your DH gets a spine and can be trusted then maybe he can have his arsehole parents in your home. My ILs used to emotionally manipulate and cry that eg “but I want to XYZ”…yeah, well, I want to be an astronaut and command a spaceship but I’m not qualified to do it so it’s a no. Once they’re qualified civil normal people with a compass for danger and your DP qualifies himself by getting a spine and some objective perspective on his parents, they’ll have earned the right to XYZ…

No way am I victim blaming. The situation isn't great obviously but it isn't as intolerable as it could be and she's focusing on herself rather than the children. Theoretically they are still put in dangerous or abusive situations as she's not there to protect them and it's upsetting her DP. Sometimes you need to work around other people's shortcomings.

How should the OP realistically work around her DP’s and ILs’ shortcomings…that isn’t just her rolling over and taking it…and is also realistic (because the ILs seem to have behaved appallingly for 10 years so a personality transplant is unlikely)?

Sometimes you just nod and smile and recognise that you aren't the main character.

Putting your own ego above all else never ends well.

So, roll over?