Teacher asked who chose the pink bottle....

[Caszekey]

Ok, so it's more aibu to allow / encourage this behaviour.
Fairly identifiable so here goes.
5 year olds twin boys, both have long hair like their Dad which I put up for school. Ones favourite colour is pink. Both adore Frozen so wanted the dress up dresses (Kristoff is a minor character). Last WBD they dressed as Goldilocks and Red Riding Hood (bear, wolves are minor characters). School have jokingly passed comment previously about pink bobbles etc but today I was asked, incidentally, if I chose the pink bottles or them, do I pick costumes etc.
I don't know if she's curious or implying I'm doing something wrong but it's got me second guessing

The choices are child led and I reckon they'll age out of them but I don't want to pull the "boys don't do that" line when girls have so much fun.

So aibu to allow them to pick so freely ? We've not yet encountered a request for a dress for general living, just they like to be Princesses!

I did. The Gender Essentialists and GC people are out in force panicking over the remote—in fact fictional—trans menace that clouds kindergarten and seizes normal children and “turns” them into the trans enemy. One moment we are discussing an innocent five year old’s playful and creative identification with a favorite fictional character and the next earnest mumsnet nuts are cautioning the OP that the child is on a slippery slope to “invading female spaces” or delusionally “denying” that sex is a rigid binary.

If my girlchild dresses up as a teddy bear is she a transhumanist denying her essential humanity?

Why did you ask if you’re just going to argue with everyone who says “yes, you are allowing them to pick so freely”

This wasn’t an AIBU, it was a chance to start another boring debate.

FWIW, I don’t give a shit whether your boys wear pink and dress up as princesses. Would I let mine do it? No fucking way.

Why 'no fucking way'? That's a pretty extreme response to the idea of a child playing dress up!

From where I stand, my reasoning has been consistent and logical throughout all my posts but if you feel otherwise go ahead and be my guest. Your prerogative.

Now, this last post of yours feels to me that rather than debating with me you have eventually preferred to attack me in very underhanded way by hinting that my childhood example was "odd" (how so? if this is what the freaking thread is about?) or that I have dismissed the achievement of that man (a lie) or that I am "insulting" people just for not sharing their view about a given topic.

When you are prepared to discuss a subject by focusing on the ideas and points rather than resorting to some good old strawman bashing, I will be here. In the meantime, have a lovely day.

Absolutely fuck gender stereotypes. Why are we so hellbent on putting ourselves in boxes? I have no issues with a woman choosing to embrace pink and glitter. If that makes you happy, if it fills your heart with joy, rock on. If a boy wants to embrace it too, why the ever-loving fuck would we stop them? Out of fear for what others might say? It’s the most regressive ridiculous thing. We all, at any age, should be able to wear what we want without giving a flying fuck what anyone thinks and the people that deserve to be judged and condemned are the bullies and the pearl clutchers, not the kids wearing tutus and dinosaur t-shirts. The norm we should be enforcing is, ‘express yourself’, not, ‘worry yourself to death over what people might think’. If my kid bullied another kid for the way they looked, I’d be absolutely fucking furious. We shouldn’t just be accepting this.

Having long hair or wearing pink won’t make a boy gay or trans. The debate on this thread is dire.

Christ.

I apologise if you felt I attacked you; that was not my intent. I have aimed to attack your arguments and statements, not you as an individual.

I do find it incredibly odd that your mother wouldn't let you dress up as a fictional mouse in your childhood, and even more odd that in adult you think this was the right thing for her to do. This isn't an attack on you, it's an honest expression of my response to your anecdote.

I'm glad you see an internal logic in the way you've developed your argument. I don't. I've honestly found it quite dishonest as you've modified your position further and further away from your original statements, but haven't resiled from those statements. At the same time, you selective misquote and mischaracterise the statements of others. I find that sort of dishonest argument insulting.

We aren't going to find common ground. You find pretending to be a different sex or gender inherently problematic, and different from pretending to be a different species. You think it's ok to describe gender non-conformity to your child as something that bad people do. I find that position problematic and damaging to children and society. We aren't going to find common ground.

Well put.

This. I would be thinking the parents are pushing some other agenda on them. Incredibly odd that both boys are choosing this on their own.

OK so I tend to just scroll and laugh at some of the madness I see on some posts but this one I had to comment.

I have worked in nurseries for almost 20 years and in schools. We have had little boys and girls dress up in the opposite sex dress up and never once batted an eye. We have had boys play mummies and daddies and push a buggy about with a baby in it. Again never batted an eye. Pink is not a feminine colour. It is a colour. The same with blue, purple, orange, yellow etc.

A colour does not make a child change their gender or biological sex for that matter. Neither does a hairstyle. Just because boys enjoy doing things that are seen as feminine does not mean we are indoctrinating them into the trans community. We are allowing freedom of expression and freedom to explore life.

I hope you never tell my Scottish hubby he is going to turn out gay or trans because he wears his kilt to work in a school because oh god it's a skirt and only biological girls can wear them. 🙄 Get a bloody grip people.

This world has become absolute bonkers.

Op let your boys enjoy their freedom and exploration. And if they do decide to be gay or trans I really hope you are there with them flying that flag and being awesome. 👌🏻

Well I've answered all questions put to me, I've considered those that think I'm encouraging my child to turn trans / deny poor girls their own heroines / will turn my sons into dress wearing psychopaths who murder and rape. I'm not obliged to agree with them.

They're twins, as much as we encourage them to do their own thing, they tend to play together, want to dress the same, do the annoying "what HE wants" no matter how much I try to make them pick their own ice cream flavour. It isn't THAT surprising that if one picks a character the other one wants a similar one. Next year they want to be Slinky, two halves of the same dog.

I wonder if anyone would have a problem with a girl dressing up as the wolf from LLRH or even the woodcutter. I suspect not. This hysteria over gender ‘norms’ is baffling. What each gender wears has nothing to do with biology its just a social construct.

I've got two sons, three years apart and I am and was the least girly girl you've ever met. Both my boys went through a phase of liking pink, sparkles, my little pony, other typical 'girl' stuff. They both grew out of it and they both have plenty of friends.

My boy and one of his friends loved pink in Primary School.
When they were allowed to - on non uniform day - my DS wanted pink in his hair, which we did.
As they moved through primary, their favourite colours changed - their choice -and both lads are now strapping 20 year olds (God, am I that old? 😅) and my DS will still happily wear a pink shirt, jumper etc these days 💗 Heterosexual male if it matters 🤷🏼‍♀️
It doesn't need making in to an issue!
Oh, and much to their embarrassment these days, they also used to kiss and hug each other goodbye at the end of the school day. I just thought it was nice 😊

Both my boys loved pink until they went into year 1 and learnt that pink is for girls. My one son used to want to dress as red riding hood for WBD and I wouldn’t let him, but wished I’d had the guts to do it. No doubt in a year or 2 they won’t want to wear dresses or like pink, but really it’s ridiculous isn’t it, society I mean.
don’t question yourself your doing the right thing.

I have a 4 year old boy who is the same, has always loved princesses and his favourite colour is pink, has princess dress up and toys alongside duplo and dinosaurs. We've never let him wear dresses everyday just for dress-up, although he does have princess PJ's and he went to nursery WBD as the room on the broom witch, nursery were not surprised as he spent most days wearing the nursery princess dress up anyway! This is entirely led by him, his older brother liked dinosaurs and trains and we embraced that too, it's just who he is, next year he might be into something completely different, but I hope that he will always feel he is able to be who he wants to be.

I would be more worried if they were dressing up as Hans. Hans is a right prick 😆

My grandson loves anything glittery and used to dress in a Cinderella dress by choice. He also loves cars and trucks and building things. He will be what he will be. You can’t really choose for this age as they will only do what interests them. Just carry on letting them be themselves as you are doing.

Some people on here for lords sake!!

there 5 not 15!!

I understand the teacher asking. There is a possible safe guarding concern regarding the encouragement of changing sex, it’s becoming like a trend. So the teacher just making a note and making sure that if there’s anything more to it they know and can help etc. however they are 5!

my son up until age 3! Would run round in my nieces Anna dress, liked playing hair dressers, loved his doll and pram. He went as a witch for Halloween one year

he still plays with his kitchen -he’s 5 now and he loves to play chef and waiter! He does gymnastics. But he also plays football and goes boxing, plays wrestling and Lego.

Toys and colours are not gender specific, characters are not gender specific. As long as they don’t think they are actually girls or are being encouraged to be female what’s the actual problem?

also my 8 year old has shoulder length curly hair

You can't win, OP. People will think
•Boys should wear xyz but not pink
•Boys can wear anything but don't make them stand out from their peers
•You must be transing your kids
•We know you're not transing your kids but be careful as people will think you're transing your kids
It's so difficult to let your kids - boys or girls - know that there is no such things as boys' or girls' things because some people will wilfully/ignorantly/fearfully make assumptions about their choices and your parenting.

It’ll be a seen safeguarding issue if you are pushing them to act like girls long hair bobbles pink bottle etc so they just have to record it.
Rest assured that most parents will be thinking that you are too!

What you have said is complete utter bullshit. Social suicide? They are little kids. The whole point of being gender critical is to let boys and girls dress how they want. You sound like a trans rights activist with your rigid thinking. What does wearing a dress or a link bottle have to do with being a girl? Ridiculous attitude.

The 1950s called and they want their gender ideals back.

Fucking hell none of you actually know what gender critical means. Gender critical is not assigning any of this bullshit to kids. It's 2025. They can fucking wear a dress if they want. All of these attitudes are the exact same attitude of the trans movement. Put your kid in a box and don't let them have 'girl' things. Why not? Now I understand. When people of Mumsnet claim to be gender critical they are actually just as fucking old fashioned and rigid as everyone else, and actually not gender critical at all. But following the rules of the gender gods more than anyone.