To be absolutely raging at DS17 after shoplifting today?

[Cathn0]

Hi all, first time posting and I’m honestly shaking with anger and embarrassment right now.

Just had the call no mum wants. DS17 was caught shoplifting in town with a group of his so called mates. Security stopped them and rang me to come collect him. I thought they were joking at first. He was stood there like butter wouldn’t melt and apparently he’d shoved a pair of wireless earbuds down his jacket. Not even decent AirPods 🙄

When I asked him what on earth he was thinking he just shrugged and said everyone else was doing it and it was a laugh. A laugh! I could’ve died on the spot from shame. The security guard was actually really decent with me but made it clear if it happens again the police will be called.

I feel like the worst mum ever. I work hard, I’ve tried to bring him up right and now this. I know he’s not perfect, he’s been hanging round with a rougher crowd lately, but I never thought I’d be the parent of a shoplifter. My mum is living with us as well and of course she’s giving me grief about how this is all my fault. I just want to crawl under a rock.

So… AIBU to be raging at him and ready to come down hard? Do I ground him? Take his phone? March him down to the police station myself? Or is this just one of those teenage daft moments that I need to let him learn from?

I genuinely don’t know what’s fair and what’s over the top. Any advice very welcome

Sorry but at 17 its not 'daft teenage behaviour and way to old to be stealing things 'with his mates'
Thats more like what 12 /13 year olds do

Has he got a job at college?
Upstairs playing his xbox but you will take his phone?
Why is he on his xbox? What is his punishment for thinking its ok to steal ?

It's really not- anything in teaching or which requires developed vetting (police, many civil service roles etc.) become very hard to get once you have a criminal record.

I knew a guy on teacher training who was subject to all kinds of stipulations because he'd had a caution for peeing against a wall in public after a night out. It went down as indecent exposure and he had to jump through a LOT of hoops to get on the course and then found it very hard to get a job afterwards.

Well, it's not easy, but please try to ignore your mother, she's talking rubbish, but do warn her not to say the same to your DS.

@Cathn0 DS17 is upstairs in his room now with the Xbox on

If this was me, that Xbox wouldn't be on for much longer. Remove his phone, too, and make him sit with you and your mum every evening for the next two weeks - no friends, no phone, no gaming - oh, and make him cook the tea and do the housework every day if you think he would learn some new skills.

That'll be punishment enough for a teenage lad.

I didn't say he would get a crminal record for this. You are making up all kinds of stuff as you go along. I wouldn't be interested in being seen as a 'hard arse' whatever that signifies.

I assume you think it's OK for YOUR kids to indulge in petty theft to impress their friends?

that's how it starts. Best of luck.

That is not true. It would now be illegal to refuse someone a job based on a criminal record for pissing against a wall, because it is not related to his position as a teacher.

if he had been prosecuted for abusing children, they would of course have a legitimate reason to reject him for a teaching job.

You said if he ended up with a criminal record at 18 you’d throw him out. Piss poor parenting. I can only assume you’re saying it to sound like a no nonsense hard arse

I got caught shoplifting when I was 13 - it was mortifying! Your son might have been 'butter would't melt' but inside he'll be dying.

Basically just say to him he knows he's shown himself up and you never expect him to be so stupid again. He could end up with a record and ruin his life chances.

That's absolute nonsense. There's loads of jobs where you need to pass an enhanced DBS or a vetting check. Regulated activities is a pretty wide ranging term.

Wait until you find out that it's perfectly legal to refuse someone a role because a close family member committed a crime!

There are loads of places that take a DBs check. Indeed, I’ve had one my whole career and deal with them frequently.

doing a DBS check does not mean you can discriminate against someone’s based on what is returned.

a common example- one I took legal advice on in fact- it would be discrimination to refuse an admin person the job for a drink driving conviction - for a non driving job.

a DBS is information. It doesn’t necessarily mean the job offer is / can be withdrawn if something comes back from it

I wouldn't ground him or anything. I'd do nothing.

He needs to think about what could have happened.

Would love to hear the example in which you can refuse someone a job because their family member committed a crime

Law enforcement agencies (police, national crime agency, etc.) are one example where you can and will fail vetting if you have a close relationship with, or live with, someone with a substantial criminal record.

That’s the correct answer 😂

Kids do silly things and make mistakes that is how they learn. It's what happens afterwards that matters. I got caught stealing at 15, I got a caution. It put me off stealing and I didn't do it again. I also tried various drugs and so did my friends, I went to a nice school these weren't bad kids. I think you are very naive if you think your kids aren't going to do silly things, no matter what wonderful parents you are (aimed at horrified pps) I am a sensible and boring adult now! Your son may feel embarrassed about it deep down. I think you need to let him know if he did get a caution it will come up on DBS and stay on his file for several years. The problem now is police don't do anything about stealing so the chances of him getting any real life consequences are slim. Just know you aren't a bad mum. He's just made a silly choice,, probably peer pressure and hopefully you can make him see that it's a road to nowhere.

This is why people shoplift. Because there are no consequences to it.

Just to add, if he wanted to adopt in the future, it would cause him all sorts of problems. It is seen as a red flag - what other boundaries does he not care about? That's the thing with a theft criminal record where people are trying to judge your character.

Do you actually have any power and control over him at nearly adult 18?

Money, IT, whatever he values?

I mean, you can tell him he's grounded, but he'll just laugh at you.

depending on the nature of the crime, You can even be a police officer in the uk with a criminal record. No one is denying a small number of jobs may be closed off but (thank fully) it’s not the barrier to a productive life some posters are making it out to be. Otherwise there would be no point in rehabilitation would there?

Where is his dad to do the proper bollocking? So many posts here with helpless single mums unable to cope with their teenagers. Teenage sons need good male role models - dad, grandpa, uncle, etc. Overworked and overburdened mums are really not enough alone.

Hmm..

Coming down on him really hard, taking his stuff, giving him a row etc... will serve to make home a really unpleasant place to be.

So then where will he spend his time - with the mates he has been out theiving with, justifying it to each other, taking the piss, minimising it..

Is that really what you think will help?

I'd be disappointed and disgusted - I'd make it clear that I'm now not sure I can trust him. If he'll steal from others, how do you know he wouldn't steal from you, from his Gran etc etc?

Then I'd keep him very very busy, so he has next to no time to hang out with arsehole mates - without letting on that this is what you're doing! A mix of fun stuff and chores, 'earning back my trust' stuff...

I think making it clear how a criminal record can affect jobs and travel is probably good - but if he isn't separated from these other kids, chances are this will just teach him its more important not to get caught, rather than not to do it in the first place.

I don’t totally agree with the tone of the post but it’s a good point about his dad?

Don’t feel bad.

I had an amazing mom who instilled the correct values and I still shoplifted as a schoolgirl.

I am a model citizen now.

Also don’t criticise his mates over and above him. Doesn’t make them bad people. They just did a bone headed thing.

'Well, mum - as I'm such an awful person, I guess you won't want to be living here any more .....?'

I think your mum is adding to your stress and not helping you think clearly. You need to have a firm talk with him away from her. It’s really tough in retail and even though we’re told not to challenge the shoplifters, it’s upsetting when you find tags from clothes tucked behind the mirrors of fitting rooms and so on, you still have to tell your manager. One manager always chased shoplifters and looked so deflated walking back. One of our security guards was run over by a fleeing shoplifter. We have CCTV stills of several shoplifters in our staff room, some are banned. I’m only telling you this because, how can we tell who has done it once as a dare and who keeps stealing? I’d be disappointed and like a PP’s suggestion of giving the value of the item to charity. Don’t let your mum’s awful opinion take your confidence.

Which jobs is it legal to deny somebody a role because a family member committed a crime?