To think promiscuous men should be shamed more?

[TheJoyOfWriting]

This, really. The whole body count discourse is the latest version of slut-shaming, as it's mostly aimed at women. Promiscuous men are still given status by other men and by women, too often.

The body count arguments that people use against women can be used against men just as easily. Promiscuous men are more likely to cheat. They are more likely to have STDs. They are more likely to have contributed to an 'oops' baby- it takes 2 to make one, and more likely to walk away after w no consequences.

Promiscuous men often dump women after pretending to be interested to get sex, esp on datjng apps, which fuel this kind of behaviour. Women tend to find ONSs less satisfying, often partly bc these kind of men often don't care about giving pleasure, just taking it.

The idea that a man's worth is measured by how many women he has sex with is very bad. It encourages men to treat women badly, and it fuels the incel culture by making men feel insecure & unmanly if they're not sexually successful.

Thoughts? I don't mean we should call Promiscuous men horrible names or talk about them like 'run through' or 'high mileage cars' the way some men do about promiscuous women. But I think they should be shamed more, by both men and women.

I don't think casual sex is bad per se, but I think the culture of it has got out of control, and Promiscuous men share a lot of the blame.

What’s wrong with kink?

Is it more common? It takes two to tango!

And the issues you raise are violent sex, unprotected sex and deceitful sex… not the quantity of sex.

I don't date men. I don't like the term 'body count' at all, either. I guess the issues I have are not w promiscuous men per se, but with what a large amount of them do. I don't use that kind of term myself, I was just giving an example of the kind of misogynistic double standard that lets these men off (or even praises) while condemning women who do the same.

Challenge the double standard. Don’t shame people for shagging.

Like pp, I think you're missing the point that a lot of promiscuous men get as much sex as they do bc they lie about their intentions/women sometimes feel pressure they have to have sex early on bc that's common, then they get dumped.

I know there are women w high sex drives & sociosexuality who like ONSs, but I don't think that many.

Why is your automatic thought to shame men, instead of defending women's right to be "promiscuous" then?

Maybe it's just me, but it's comes of as anti-feminist in that you seem to believe that all/most women are naively being tricked into sex, and that they couldn't possibly also enjoy a nice no-strings-attached shag.

Again, why don't you think that many? That's not my experience at all.

Coming of age in the 90's 00's I feel like women joined the party a bit and competed to sleep around. .. my friends did. I'm not sure it was a good look tbh.

I don know how you have read those things into my post - don’t know where to start really!

You claim I think women should withhold sex in order to manipulate men into relationships? Where are you getting that from? My point is, and I get this from what I regularly read here as well as people in real life, that women often come away disappointed (at best) and deeply hurt (at worst) after a casual sexual encounter…because they hadn’t seen it like that while the man clearly had.

i don’t mind who’s doing who, how often, which way up or how many people are in the bed at one time. All I care about is: are both parties clear that it’s casual or maybe one-off sex? If everyone’s being honest - fine. But I think the balance is skewed hugely towards the needs of promiscuous men. Women beware.

I suspect that men are not honest because they know coming out and saying they only want a shag will rarely get them what they want.

I make a point of saying what I mean and meaning what I say - no need to read between the lines or make stuff up!

before I let my current partner I loved a good shag for the sake of it.

I never lied to anyone and no one ever lied to me.

whats wrong with kink and what are you defining as kink please?

Ikwym. This would be ideal. I guess tho that the idea is that if casual sex is common, some women feel they should do it or man will leave. Then promiscuous men can have sex early on & dump, potentially many times.

I suppose the answer would be for women who don't want to have sex early on to wait a bit (to mitigate the 'dump early' strategy), at least a few weeks. I think this is probs quite a few women, and they shouldn't be shamed if they want to wait.

I think there is some truth to the arguments that greater acceptance of casual sex enables bad male behaviour. But as you say, it's wrong that they put all the onus on women. They basically say that men kind of get addicted almost to the 'hit' of havjng sex, so if they can easily have a lot of it, they just think about that, not relationships, & treat women badly.

I don't have such a poor opinion of men, but I think sadly has some truth

So perhaps it's not negativity towards promiscuous women as such, more just voicing concern about it due to those issues you list.

Of course we are. Sexual mores within a society affect us all. Ridiculous and dishonest to pretend otherwise. They permeate everything: personal relationships, art, media, law and politics, education, health and welfare. It’s called ‘society’, but some posters here seem to agree with Margaret Thatcher that there’s no such thing as society!

Lots of harmful kinks out there. Violence, also ones that use domination/humiliation, misogyny, racism & homophobia as kinks.

Harmful in what sense?

Exactly. Very socialist 👍

Tbf I don't like direct economic comparisons that view women as 'cheaply' 'giving away' sex and then blame women bc men won't commit unless they have to work hard to have sex and it is 'expensive'. Nasty ideas there, and men can certainly control their behaviour.

I do think there us an issue w women feeling pressured to have sex they don't want, ad well as general male bad behaviour which is amplified by promiscuous men. The issue isn't w those women who have ONSs and are happy.

Gosh, you would hate the things my husband and I get up to then 😂. I love some dom/sub play, and it's has no reflection on our relationship outside of the bedroom. How is that harmful?

I understand that your issue is with the double standard applied to men. However I'm wondering whether rather than holding men to the same standard of 'morality', (which is after all just a social construct, as lots of consensual sex with multiple partners, with precautions, isn't objectively harmful) as women, is where we should be focusing.
Better perhaps to challenge the stigma and judgement of women choosing to have safe consensual sex with multiple men. Because, the problem with the encouragement of any form of shaming on 'moral' rather than practical grounds, is that it inevitably swings back twice as hard on women.
Basically, if you create a climate where men are shamed for promiscuity, guess who going to be landed with the greater shame for allowing them to be promiscuous?

You're not giving women any agency here. They are either being lied to, or doing something they don't really want to do. Why can't you accept that there are plenty of women that are very happy with their online dating choices or their ONS? Your only comments along that line are that you don't know many women that do, but that's not exactly a representative sample.

Your age is important because you keep telling people they don't know what they're on about because they're old. Maybe not that directly but the implications are there

You're doing the very teenager on the cusp of "full" adulthood thing of "my generation knows better"

Slut shaming women was part of the fundamentals of witch hunts when you look into it.

Slut shaming men would become a whole other issue. And I'm pretty sure would only make "alpha men" worse tbh.

There's a very definite "women can't make the decision to have no strings attached sex and are being forced by the nasty men to do so" theme here

I suppose it depends what viewpoint you come from. I never regarded myself as a notch on someone’s bedpost. I regarded them as a notch on mine.

There's nothing inherently wrong about violence, dom/sub, humiliation etc in sex so long as its practised under the kink mantra of "safe, sane and consensual"

But you're showing more and more your actual issues

I ask again... have you been raised with a particularly religious view at home?

👏

Yip.

And I was more than happy to shag rings round me. Loads of ONS. A regular FWB and a fuck buddy or two.

And some were even kinky.

And being old had no risks of pregnancy. And even before I was that age had a coil in. And made them wear a condom.

🤷🏼‍♀️ it was fun.