Adult man swearing at a toddler

[AnnaSunshine]

We have a family membership to Kew Gardens. I know it’s expensive, but we go almost every weekend to let our children run around and enjoy being outside.

My youngest child is 18 months old. He is in that gorgeous stage where he had just started to talk a little more coherently and where he absolutely loves running around and climbing. He can follow simple instructions….. when he wants to!

If you know Kew, we were over by the Japanese gardens. My eldest thinks this is the most beautiful place that she’s ever seen.

This area has some gravel sections where the stones are raked. They are not to be walked on.

As you can imagine, my son (who was with my husband) immediately ran into the middle of one of these areas. My husband called to my son (which he thought was a hilarious game) and then my husband went to go and scoop him up. Cue toddler screaming “No daddy!”.

At this point a man in his thirties sitting on a bench with a woman turns around and tells us “you cannot walk on that.” I relied, “we know, but he’s a toddler and he doesn’t understand that yet.”

To be clear, my husband has already removed my son.

The man then continues “What is wrong with you Karen? Parent your children. You need to have boundaries. What is wrong with you? You are a terrible parent!”

This is with escalating agitation. My son, still with his Dad, starts to cry because there is a man shouting at his mum.

I should have walked away, but I said still very calmly:

”Karen‽ He is not even two. He is not yet cognitively developed enough to understand this.”

To which the man stood up, turned to my son and shouted “You little sod, don’t go on the f-ing stones!”

I said “You are shouting at a toddler. For when you have calmed down, we forgive you for this.” And, I know pettily, walked across the stones myself to go and hug my child.

Was I unreasonable in this? Kew is made for people of all ages. We absolutely respect it, and would have taken my son off the gravel regardless of people being around, but I cannot comprehend this man‘s actions.

I’ve got thick skin, so tell me how it is if I’m wrong.

‘kitten’

dearie me 😂

We need that third option for AIBU someone was talking about the other day

I think it was probably you deflecting responsibilty that wound him up. If you would have replied something like 'I know, we were asleep on the job, he's caught now though' instead of you blaming the toddler for what happened the conversation may have gone differently. Your reply of 'he is a toddler he doesn't know that' implies that you think it is your toddlers fault that he ran on the gravel and don't accept that actually it was you and your husbands lack of parenting.

Tbh I probably would have just ignored the whole thing though, the toddler was picked up and the man's opening comment of you can't walk on that was a fair comment. There really wasn't any need for you to reply with your I know but especially when the toddler wasn't to blame in the first place and the man never indicated that he thought he was.

Where to start..........

Yanbu since you used an interrobang.
I can immediately tell that you are educated and creative.
Disgusting that he swore at you/your child
Weird that he got involved at all given that you both had the situation covered.

Yes of course you didn’t handle it well, him being a twat and you handling badly are not mutually exclusive.

walking over the stones was not only petty it was wrong and didn’t help so own that

and recognise how to manage this. Yes your eldest loves it how was it for her to see this all unfold?

here’s the thing having 2 changes things and sometimes means splitting off into twos one to the Japanese gardens and two somewhere else

recognise this and adapt for next time - it isn’t the same as when you just had the one

and I agree with others cognitively he doesn’t understand but now you do so what are you going to change

If he goes round yelling at random children like that someone less mild mannered is going to knock his block off before long. What a nutcase.

The problem with this country is that people are like hawks watching you to see if you make a mistake and then they pounce with their judgement .You don’t see that so much in Spain .

‘Oops sorry, I should have been quicker there’

How ridiculous! He didn’t walk into this man’s garden. This is typical of people thinking they can lecture others when it’s none of their business!

We all know how lame you are. Maybe invest in a hobby?

You know "that" parent? Thats you.

Given that he has paid his money, just as the OP, to spend time in that garden, I rather think he has as much a right to his opinion as the OP!

^^This is a very good post.

You said in your OP that you wanted opinions and that you had a "thick skin" but you've not been very receptive to different views and you've been pretty hostile to some posters.

You also said in your opening description that your toddler ran into the middle of the stones, didn't come when he was called and thought it was a game, so your DH had to go and retrieve him, at which point your toddler started screaming and crying.

All in the middle of the tranquil Japanese gardens.

Also, that's not "stepping onto the stones for a second" so your later posts trying to minimise what happened aren't really painting a truthful picture.

It sounds like your familiarity with Kew means you feel comfortable treating it as a giant playground and have gotten a bit too relaxed about following the rules.

If everyone let their toddlers run into areas they weren't supposed to be, the place would be a state. We have nice things for us all to enjoy by following the rules that these places set out. Your toddler is not exempt from this and you are responsible for making sure he's not wandering off.

The point PP were making about the road was to illustrate the fact that you can control your child when you want to. So they only ran into the prohibited area because you weren't watching them properly so the whole thing is on you/your DH.

And to answer one of your previous snarks, no I don't think it's just "perfect parents" that stop their children from legging it into botanical displays where they're not supposed to be. I think that's fairly basic parenting.

Having said that, if I had relaxed a bit too much and my toddler had gotten into the display, I'd be embarrassed because I'd accept I was in the wrong. I wouldn't be on a public site doubling down or trying to minimise things. I'd acknowledge that I'd dropped the ball a bit on that occasion, and make sure I kept a closer eye on my child during future visits.

The bloke was an arsehole, but you know that. You don't need MN to confirm that he shouldn't be yelling at a small child, especially when their parent has dealt with the issue. And misogynistic terms are always unpleasant, and unwarranted. But an acknowledgement that your toddler was too fast and shouldn't have been in there would have done wonders to calm things down. Waffling on about cognitive development is irrelevant. You just needed to say "I know, sorry, he's so fast and he got in there before we had a chance to stop him!" Defuses the situation, everyone moves on.

You should have been watching your child properly and trying to minimise him trampling over displays is pretty crass. The bloke was a giant arsehole and it's best not to pay him any mind. Both of these things can be true.

So you'll throw your hands up and use the 'nobody's perfect' response to your own behaviour, but when this guy overreacts you can't let it go.

You should have been in better control of your child, especially given how well you apparently know KG. It isn’t a playground and the staff there work incredibly hard to make and keep it beautiful for ALL visitors, not just small children.

I walked off despite an adult man swearing at a toddler.

I am honestly baffled by your position.

He's a prick. You're insufferable. Both things can be true.

The tranquil Japanese garden where this man was loudly watching Tik Tok and others were filming reels.

An oasis of tranquility completely destroyed by my toddler being on some gravel for max ten seconds.

That, to the one person and all their many accounts that I am talking to, was sarcasm.

I am eye rolling.

But you clearly do know the area. You go often, you know where the gravel that’s not to be walked on is, so when you head that direction, one of you takes the toddler’s hand.

No, there should not have been any swearing, but as the parents, you should have anticipated this and made sure it didn’t happen.

As for you then prettily walking over the gravel, what did that achieve? Just making more work for the groundskeepers and possibly waving a red rag to a person who was already swearing at a toddler. Definitely haven’t covered yourself in glory here.

Dear @AnnaSunshine, I am going to try to give you my viewpoint as kindly as possible, unfortunately, due to what it is, I fear that you will just think I am another uncaring, and children hating, Mumsnetter. I am neither of those things.

Towards the end of your opening post you said:

"... Kew is made for people of all ages. We absolutely respect it, and would have taken my son off the gravel regardless of people being around, but I cannot comprehend this man's actions.

I've got thick skin, so tell me how it is if I'm wrong."

Anna, in my opinion, and I believe the opinions of quite a few others who have replied to your thread, you have got it wrong. Sadly, you have not shown any signs of having the 'thick skin' you told us about. If you had not assured us of your thick skin, and of actually wanting our opinions, then I think that most of us, who had taken you at your word about wanting our opinions, would have refrained from giving them.

I have just looked up the definition of 'respect' Anna as you stated in your OP - as quoted above - that you and your family respect it, presumably you mean that you respect the owners/guardians of Kew Gardens, and whatever rules they see fit to make. All of the dictionaries that I looked at through 'Google' gave very similar definitions to each other, but the word respect, itself, seems to have several layers to imthe depth of it's meanings. I will show a couple that I believe are relevant here:

a) To be careful to avoid harm - to make sure that you don't do something that someone (in this case, Kew Gardens management, and the employees whose job it is to rake the stones in the Japanese garden, and to keep them looking pristine, just as they do in real Japonese gardens in Japan) would consider wrong.

b) To observe/abide by. To agree not to break a law, rule, or principal.

I'm sorry OP, but under those definitions of respect, neither you, or your DH, showed any respect to the Kew Garden rule of not touching those particular stones. In not being aware enough to be able to stop your D - and I am sure, your very gorgeous - Son from stepping/running over those stones, you are showing either no respect at all to the Kew Gardens employees exacting work, or you are showing a lack of comprehension and/or empathy to the ethos of the company running Kew Gardens.

If you want your DS to be able to run around with minimal supervision from either you, or your DH, then you really need to take him to somewhere like a secure soft play area. However family friendly KG claims to be, they do not mean that all of their plants, stones, and scenic areas can be treated with a complete lack of respect and care.

As for the man who shouted and swore at you OP, he was completely out of order. What he should have done was politely ask one of KG's staff members to have a quiet word with you and your DH about you both allowing your DS to behave in such an unruly manner.

Newsflash: toddler walks on gravel. World loses its mind.

As you were.

The man replied to you, Op, not because you were a woman but because you were the parent who spoke directly to him. He was replying. You were in the wrong, as parents.
You are members of Kew Gardens so you could not have been surprised by the Japanese raked stone garden looming ahead.

He was wrong to shout and swear.

Would he have sworn had you apologised, with some genuine humbleness, after his first words to you?

Why did you then run on the stones? Why punish the gardners?

He's a twat and was rude.

You are an over the top drama queen refusing to accept responsibility for parenting.

The man was definitely the one in the wrong swearing at you and making your child upset. A toddler running where they shouldn’t and being scooped straight up is not a big deal.

He sounds vile. I hope he was ashamed of his behaviour afterwards. Sorry you had to go through that. I've got a toddler too so I totally get it.

I don't personally engage with lunatics, this man certainly sounds like one. I just tend to ignore them or it just inflames the situation.
I hope you had a fun day otherwise.
My mum used to take me to Kew gardens when I was small and I loved it.