Adult man swearing at a toddler

[AnnaSunshine]

We have a family membership to Kew Gardens. I know it’s expensive, but we go almost every weekend to let our children run around and enjoy being outside.

My youngest child is 18 months old. He is in that gorgeous stage where he had just started to talk a little more coherently and where he absolutely loves running around and climbing. He can follow simple instructions….. when he wants to!

If you know Kew, we were over by the Japanese gardens. My eldest thinks this is the most beautiful place that she’s ever seen.

This area has some gravel sections where the stones are raked. They are not to be walked on.

As you can imagine, my son (who was with my husband) immediately ran into the middle of one of these areas. My husband called to my son (which he thought was a hilarious game) and then my husband went to go and scoop him up. Cue toddler screaming “No daddy!”.

At this point a man in his thirties sitting on a bench with a woman turns around and tells us “you cannot walk on that.” I relied, “we know, but he’s a toddler and he doesn’t understand that yet.”

To be clear, my husband has already removed my son.

The man then continues “What is wrong with you Karen? Parent your children. You need to have boundaries. What is wrong with you? You are a terrible parent!”

This is with escalating agitation. My son, still with his Dad, starts to cry because there is a man shouting at his mum.

I should have walked away, but I said still very calmly:

”Karen‽ He is not even two. He is not yet cognitively developed enough to understand this.”

To which the man stood up, turned to my son and shouted “You little sod, don’t go on the f-ing stones!”

I said “You are shouting at a toddler. For when you have calmed down, we forgive you for this.” And, I know pettily, walked across the stones myself to go and hug my child.

Was I unreasonable in this? Kew is made for people of all ages. We absolutely respect it, and would have taken my son off the gravel regardless of people being around, but I cannot comprehend this man‘s actions.

I’ve got thick skin, so tell me how it is if I’m wrong.

But it's one of those times to rise above and ignore. There is rarely anything to be gained from engaging with people like him. It would probably have been better to have just pretended you didn't hear and forged ahead with your day.

Why should the OP ignore someone verbally abusing her?! 🤦‍♀️ Typical British society....same with the bullying advice to 'just ignore them' well no, why should someone have to, its all just squashing feelings and opinions all the time.

Would you let him climb about amongst the cacti? Would you let him splash about in the water lily’s? Of course you wouldn’t! Yes, it’s about families. You still need to keep control of your children.

And I love children, especially that age group because it’s wonderful to see them soaking the world in and seeing their characters develop. But this was an occasion where you and/or your DH should have been on it. And you weren’t. It’s not your child’s fault: that’s what children of that age do. It’s your job to stop them doing it and explain why we don’t leave great big footprints all over a Japanese garden.

I think you exercised monumental self control with this man and I think you did really well not to escalate the situation. But it would have been avoided completely if either of you had seen the obvious and acted on it.

Time to book the surgery to have that stick removed…

Thank you, I really appreciate this.

I constantly/consciously go out of my way to make sure people aren’t offended or irritated by my child’s presence in public spaces but, by the same token, I find the lack of welcome and empathy for babies and toddlers just acting in a developmentally normal manner to be depressing and draining.

For example, once in a public park, my toddler was excitedly running along the footpath. None of us spotted that a man on a bench had a tiny dog under it. Dog went ballistic at my DD. DD jumped. We continued walking thinking nothing of it but dog owner followed us and passive aggressively held the dog up, telling the dog ‘not to worry about my child scaring it.’ It was one of those things that was so bonkers that I didn’t even react.

I really think children should be seen as the future of society, but they are often treated worse than animals.

Grown adults behave appallingly on a daily basis but their behaviour is just accepted.

Im sorry that misogynist spoke to you that way, as I guarantee he wouldn’t have said it directly to your husband.

Again, you are paraphrasing and by changing the narrative of my posts what are you trying to achieve?

It’s not about a road, a path or even the man shouting at you.

It’s the pettiness in your defiant behavior and your own conduct after the event and your inability to take responsibility for any of it.

Kew Gardens is a family friendly place for people who respect it. Of course a toddler standing on some stones for 10 seconds is not a big deal and the man was out of order. It’s what you did and the way you conducted yourself that is in question in my posts.

The responses on here are WILD!!! Toddler ran on to some stones, was swiftly retrieved. Not A Big Deal.

Crazy man escalating things by calling you a terrible parent and then swearing at your little boy - horrendous and literally inexcusable.

This is why I do my best to avoid any confrontation with anyone in public, as you never know who is a nutcase. If similar situation ever arises again OP just do an apologetic wave, say sorry/woops! And keep walking.

PS I would find your boy gorgeous too!! (and to the posters on here who feel the need to tell OP her toddler is “only gorgeous to you”… boo you suck)

His first comment was just something like “you can’t go on the stones” - that’s the bit OP should have ignored/waved sorry and moved away. It’s absolutely not her fault that it escalated or that he was inexcusably rude but in places like London, just move on from anyone who seems a bit hot under the collar/weirdly invested in park rules.

What did I do?

Trembling yet decided to pettily walk on the stones yourself. Why if you felt intimidated?

Yabu.

That is what happened.

It was petty, but I was also very cross. Not saying that was right.

But interesting you think that is the most important part of this.

I for one am glad OP walked back over the stones. It’s giving Julia from Motherland and I am here for it.

Yes you did. You said they are at “that gorgeous stage”.

of course people on mn don’t dislike children. They do dislike pompous self satisfied parents though. 🤷‍♀️

I called the stage gorgeous, not my child.

There is a difference.

In defiance of this man and to prove a point you purposely walked on an area that Kew Gardens prefer people not to walk on.

Why was he even bothered?It’s hardly a crime and causes no harm to anyone! Ok, keep off the gravel - rule broken for 1 minute - hardly worth discussing let alone a heated exchange.

The man just wanted to assert his superior knowledge of the dos and don’t of Kew Garden.

I’d let this one go and give it I thought at all.

I have said from my original post that this was petty.

I mean, op is obviously not after any opinions that don’t reinforce her own. But imo op yabu. Kew Gardens is for families. As are museums and art exhibits. When you have toddlers and children in the explore room of museum they have freedom. In the exhibits you hold them close as they cannot pass the ropes. The same is true of Kew. There are so so so many areas of opportunity in Kew Gardens for your toddler to run and toddle and laugh gambol about like the fresh little lamb he is. The Japanese garden meanwhile, has a very different vibe. Yes there are no ropes, but you are adults and should know the difference in vibe and intent. Therefore should have acted accordingly, and you didn’t. You failed, you fucked up and someone called you on it. You didn’t like being held accountable and have become very defensive (ironically your behaviour on the thread mirrors that of the “unreasonable man” in many ways- over reaction, refusal to listen, mud slinging unnecessarily and weak passive aggressive retorts) accept you fucked up. Man who wanted to enjoy the garden over reacted. You doubled down on the fuck up.

I’d have reported him to someone.

I'm surprised at some of the replies - have your toddlers never stepped off the path onto somewhere they shouldn't?

OP you showed a great deal of restraint - I would have told him to go fuck himself!

That was in the wrong order though.
They should have noticed the sign and prevented their toddler from running onto the stones in the first place, then they wouldn’t have needed to go and get him. That’s why they have been accused of poor parenting.
As a parent, it is your job to adhere to the rules, even with (actually especially with) a toddler at the “gorgeous” stage.
Benign parenting that allows their children to cross boundaries is a bad idea - they should start teaching them “no” before they start walking…
I recommend that the parents read the cautionary tales of Hilaire Belloc for some clue as to why DC doing exactly what they like is not the best idea…

Kitten, we went there for my daughter.

My son was on the gravel for a moment and my husband scooped him up.

I hear that people saying we could have reasonably assumed he would and prevented that. That’s fair. As I have said.

I don’t agree that I should just agree with vitriol and rudeness from a small minority of posters.

I’d welcome you to highlight where I have been rude to anyone.

You did a lot right.

You did nothing wrong.

You explained yourself well and so what if you were a bit petty - though I think it was fine. This guy was a misery spreader and he was ruining your day.

Of course your son might run there. He's young. It did no harm. He was picked up. All was good. But you had bad luck that day in bumping into the misery spreader. Please don't waste anymore energy on thinking about him and the misery he causes. Instead be very glad you aren't him.

Btw some posters try to control the narrative by having multiple accounts and writing very similar posts.

Interesting that you have picked one of the shittest mothers ever to compare the OP to….

I didn't accuse you of rudeness though the sum of the parts does equate to rude I suppose. But since you asked , below examples of that which I accused.

Passive aggressive- "The type with children" "both of which are fine by me" "cool if that's your position" - these are all standard passive aggressive.

Over reaction (and passive aggression) - "loved the casual misogyny" - pp clearly was referring to a plural you as parents but was taken to an extreme

Refusal to listen- "what did I do?!" (The poster explained what you did in the post)

Mud slinging - "I get the feeling people on mumsnet don't like children" there's no evidence of this and it's a rather ridiculous and offensive remark for the audience of a site aimed at PARENTS.

You also contradict yourself. Was toddler on the middle of the gravel and running away a she saw it as a game (as per original op)- at which point your husband would have disturbed the patterns upon his going in to scoop son up. Or was toddler scooped with haste and immediacy- which wouldn't have drawn spectator commentary. Do you go to Kew "most weekends" and know it well- so well as to describe the area for those who "know" Kew, and therefore should have reasonably foreseen this, (and so the fault is yours) or was it a brand new and unexpected situation which you mis navigated and now appreciate you should have premeditated? You went there for your daughter? Who knows the area and has been going for years and finds it the most beautiful place and so you should be extremely familiar? Your original post doesn't square with your ongoing defence.

No one is saying the man behaved well. But it's a fact of life that when we transgress social rules, others react unreasonably and that is predictable- see drivers when you accidentally cut them up, or pedestrians who let the door go in someone's face, or someone who mistakenly cheats a queue- all of these misdemeanours are accidental, but none of us would express surprise if and when someone over reacts and is aggressive. That doesn't make it right. But it can be avoided, and pps are simply pointing out that you could have avoided this.

With the best will in the world toddlers will sometimes do something they shouldn't, because they don't understand things yet.

Nothing got damaged, the kid just ran over some pebbles - for fuck sake - and was swiftly retrieved by a parent. In any sane world literally nobody gives a crap about that. I would have told the guy to go fuck himself the second he had a go directly at an 18 month year old.