To think the school could have cut DS some slack here

[Sprogonthetyne]

DS is autistic, really struggles with school in general but especially when there's transitions and change, so the start of term is hard for him. He's been crying and having anxiety attacks about going back to school for the last week and is only a hairs breath away from school refusal. He went back today and had a really good morning, which took an enormous amount of effort from him.

This afternoon he got told off for using his glue stick wrongly. Not inappropriately, just spreading glue across the whole surface he was sticking (as preferd by last year's teacher) instead of a dot in each corner (preferd by this years teacher), and this completely unravelled him. He'd been trying so hard to manage the big changes and hold everything together, so the unfairness of still being in trouble despite his effort and for something minor that he didn't even know had changed pushed him over the edge and he ended up having a meltdown (which I know isn't ideal, I'm not defending his reaction).

While I know I aught to suport the school, I can't help but feel they could really have picked their battles and just left the kid to glue however he wants.

Are you being critical here?
Is the teacher needing to begin every sentence/instruction with 'this is not criticism, you have done nothing wrong' even when they may have?

Oh.. we playing top trumps? I also have AuDHD, and i have 2 children with it.

I'm not the one apparently unable to have some empathy for an 8yo. BTW.. name calling is against the TOS, i've reported you.

No, but knowing that the child is prone to struggling to understand tone, you think ahead and alter how you approach it.. like how the OP herself has suggested she could have in numerous posts.

You keep using the words 'telling off' and 'in trouble'. I wonder whether you're using that language with DS, and potentially feeding in to his anxiety. You need to frame it and help him to see it in a different way, because he wasn't in trouble for putting glue on wrong, and he wasn't told off for that. He was given a different instruction and given a consequence/asked to think about his behaviour/reactions the next day because of the shouting and screaming.

You need to help him to understand that the reason the teachers are asking him to reflect is not because of the glue. He needs reassurance that the teachers weren't angry at him because of the glue - and in fact they're not angry about the other behaviour either, because they know him and understand why he reacts like that.

But he was told off for using to much glue. The reflection was for the the behaviour that followed but the incident started with him been told off and feeling that was unfair. Why would I mess with his head by tell him something didn't happen when it did?

A few suggestions here about the TA doing the glueing. This is not good - he has the skills to glue. The last thing you want if his deferring to the TA everytime he can't be bothered (I know we are not at that stage yet), and I have seen many teenagers who down tools whenever they feel like it. Also, excessive glueing can be a way to avoid actually completing the worksheet.

Instructions are somewhere where perhaps progress can be made. A lot of kids can only process one instruction at a time - in this case, glue in your worksheet, done! But there are followups - dot the glue in one corner only - and the TA can help him process this. She could write down the instructions on a whiteboard, and then get DS to absorb both parts before starting the task.

TBH, there are ways of framing this without making such a fuss. It could simply be, "we are going to be more eco this year, so we want to use less glue". This is something you could easily reinforce at home.

I find it hard to believe he missed his whole break - kids always get a toilet break if nothing else. I imagine the reflection time was just a couple of minutes. It's hard to believe, also, that the TA shouted at him. This would be distracting to the whole class, including the teacher's input time.

A 'telling off' is a scolding. You can give a child an instruction without scolding them. You're consistently using words like 'told off' and 'shouted at' to describe what happened, and I do have to wonder if that was the case? I totally understand that your ds might struggle to tell the difference between a neutral instruction and someone being cross at him, but if you yourself are framing it as a 'telling off' to him, you could be feeding into his anxiety.

What did the TA say that she said to him?

The 1:1 told me that he was told off mildly and overreacted.

DS told me she used an angry voice (As discussed above that discription could be anything from mildly frustrated/sterne to very angry shouting)

I don't feel there was any need to tell him off at all, no matter how mildly. At that point he was doing nothing intentionally wrong, so I understand why he felt it was unfair.

there was zero need to tell him off, or comment on it at all in that moment.

It could have waited until next time he needed to use glue, and before he did, just ask him to dab the corners so they didn't use up so much glue, so it lasted longer.

Thanks for explaining. I get it - I'm AuDHD and would also find that very unfair. The sense that the rules have suddenly changed and you don't understand them anymore is a scary one for a child (even NT children). I wonder if because he seemed to be coping so well that she didn't watch her tone and wording as carefully as she should have, not realising how much he was struggling? But I agree, there was no need to tell him off for doing it the way which was correct previously.

Are we sure last year's teacher actually did prefer glue over the whole sheet? That would be incredibly unusual given the time constraints of a lesson and the cost of glue. Sorry if I've missed this at some point in the thread.

@Sprogonthetyne how did today go for your DS?Did you have a chance to talk to the school? Did he miss playtime?

Previous teacher got frustrated if things that were glued in fell out again and got lost, DS took this to heart and has probibly over done the make 'sure it isn't going to fall out' message but was not previously told his glue use was a problem.

He has really bad coordination for a child his age. Not enough to make him unable to do these things, but his writing and cutting & sticking looks like it was done by a much younger child (his understanding of learning is age appropriate, it's a controlling hands problem). This lead to more of his stuff becoming unstuck when he was younger and not pressing hard enough, and words been had about been carful to make sure it's stuck properly.

I see what you're saying, but I do also agree with others that it sounds like you are feeding in to his feeling victimised through your framing. You are putting the situation in the "angry' bracket when it is extremely unlikely that his 1:1 of three years, who knows him and must have patiently supported him through many difficult times, was suddenly angry about glue?

Can you teach him that there's such a thing as an ordinary voice? It's just somebody telling them something. And yes, I do think that unless he has very clear signs that someone is angry, he should be taught to assume that they are not. It'll help him navigate life a lot more smoothly than the other way around.

You’re doing more messing with his head by insisting that his being given an instruction was actually a telling off.

The TA herself described it as a telling off, albeit, mild.

The TA actually told op she’d told him off for using too much glue?

The 1:1 told me that he was told off mildly and overreacted.

From OP. She mentioned it a few times I think, but as she has been quite active and the thread is moving fast , it would be easy ro miss.

I had a phone call with his SENCo who is lovely but unfortunately doesn't see him that often (not a criticism, she does a lot in the background, but doesn't necessarily see the day to day). We talked about how high his anxiety is, that isn't really new info, it's been going on years but has peaked over the last 3/4 months and maybe wasn't really being considered because it because almost background noise. Did get the impression she was on a fob of, downplay and reassure mission, but can't really blame her for that, she has an obligation to suport her colleagues.

Haven't been able to talk to DS about his day yet. With school transport he doesn't get in until after 4, then is close to non verbal for the first hour or so while he decompress. He's not usualy capable of any conversation until after half five, by which time we're on to tea, homework and cello practice etc, which I don't want to derail by bringing up difficult topics. Just before bed usualy works well for bigger conversations so I'll try then, but he hasn't cried tonight and has only washed his hands 3 time, which is a good sign.

I'm a teacher (secondary though) and I can understand your point OP.

I'm also autistic.

He was trying to do the right thing, then he was told it was the wrong thing, now the world doesn't feel safe because he can't be sure what's right and what's wrong.

He shouldn't have shouted, but anger is the other side of the coin from fear and the school staff don't seem to understand this, or how punishing a kid for being frightened could have a very negative impact.

This is obviously a child with significant needs (has an EHCP at a relatively early age).

I think you should speak to the SENCO and consider what further steps can be taken to ensure your child's needs are being met.

This isn't about glue.

Don’t do this. It’s petty.

You need to tackle the situation in the morning with the 1:1 and school. If the situation is as you described then the 1:1 is at fault and your son shouldn’t be handled so heavily. You also need to set your boundaries early on in the term.

Fingers crossed he had a good day, and hopefully they took what you said on board and he didn’t miss playtime. Going by everything you’ve said on the thread, I think this year you’ll really have to be on them and ensure they start the year with a full reminder of his needs, his provision , how to behaviour manage him and what is expected of them. Preferably all documented in writing.

He did miss playtime (as they had already said he would), but that doesn't really feel like the most important battle. Having a meltdown is infinitely more distressing to him then missing playtime, so to me the more important thing is trying to reduce risk of future meltdowns (we all know punishing him will have zero effect on that). If they feel they need to get their revenge before they are able to discuss how to avoid meltdowns, then that unfortunately it is what it is. Focusing on the play time, would detract from me trying to explain what triggered it.

I think I got them to understand that telling him off when when he wasn't intentionally doing anything wrong felt unfair to him, so hopefully they will keep that in mind

I am so angry and sad for your son and for you. What a terribly unkind and stupid thing for his 1:1 to have done. Hugs to you both.